So i've been reading a whole bunch of threads about Hondata reflash and typical bolt on upgrades lately. Because i can only afford one or the other, i'm not sure whether to get new headers or to get the reflash. This is with a modded intake or CAI btw. Looking at the dyno plots from Hondata's website, the header's will spike the torque upwards of 168 ft-lb from 4000-5000rpm range while the reflash doesn't really ever go past 155-160 ft-lb. But of course the reflash has the advantage of never really dropping in torque from 4000-6000rpm. So if you had a modded intake or CAI and could only choose one, would you choose the headers or the reflash?

 

Well, Hondata is made to work with a car that has a CAI/Icebox, and a performance header. However, the Hondata, IMO, is a better bang-for-the-buck mod than a performance header. The most difficult part of this decision is: How much of Hondata's gains are you not going to realize without a performance header?

If it were my car, I'd get UR underdrive pulleys first. Good solid linear gains from 0rpm to redline.

 

if memory serves correctly, it's been a long time since i've talked on this forum, headers cost more than the new (totally sweet) price of Hondata these days. I'm still scared to take out my ecu on my car, but I'd totally get Hondata if I were you. And after I get that, I'd be on the lookout for a nice used header on the blackmarket.

 

I'd get a header first. Aside from the performance benefits, you also get a slight boost in fuel economy, and I don't know if you can sell your Hondata, but you can sell your header if you part out the car or something.

 

Reflash is great gains but doesn't really part out well if the car is sold; you will not get any money out of a reflash like you will an actual part. CT-E header had great gains over stock and fit almost like stock however Weapon-R header has even power & torque across the board but fit & finish leaves a little to be desired. Stay away from cheap Ebay headers, I went that route and sold it for the CT anyway. A good intake for little dough would be the CT Icebox or just pick up a used Injen or K&N cai. GL what ever you choose.

 

Sorry for the late response, yea i hear what you're all saying. The reflash is pretty much a money sink, once i invest in it that money is gone forever. I'm not sure i'll get too much money out of selling the header either too though. All those selling/shipping fees, depreciation, and installation fees (I'm afraid to go under the car). I'm thinkin the new DC sports headers btw, the one with the 3 bolts not the old one that kept cracking.

 

If you mod a car, you will lost some money in the process. Just accept that. It's easier if you plan on a total loss, and be happy with what you do get back later...

If you can't afford both, you are probably better off with the reflash. You will notice gains in the daily driving rpm range. Even without a header, there is still a noticeable difference. For under 300, I don't think there is a better bang for the buck, and it is a very straightforward process, with not much to go wrong.

If you go the header route, consider that installation may not go completely as planned. Bolts corrode, cease and break. I could not recover my O2 sensor of my stock header, so had to get another. Since you're afraid to go under the car, you should consider the costs of installation and going back to stock in comparing to the reflash option.

 

You're right... things always go wrong. What happened with your O2 sensor? I'm not even sure of the placement of it.

 

There's one in the section of pipe you'll be replacing with the header. It was rusted/ceased to the pipe, and it was not possible to remove. so I had to replace it.

 

Oh dang wth lol, maybe i should get some jack stands to check out the situation down there before i get the headers.

 

After I got expired my warranty,

I did Hondata reflash.

I could notice the difference and my next mod is gonna be

comptech icebox.

 

all i can say is when i had my type s kpro was the shit. but my friend has an si and the reflash was worthless.

 

I wouldn't say this gain is "worthless": (2006 TSX Hondata).
That is a LOT of area under the curve difference between non-Hondata and Hondata pulls.

 

Please correct me if I'm wrong, from my understanding the reflash isn't a new ecu its the same, just retuned

 

yeah. same with kpro. you send it to hondata in CA and they overnight it back to you. i sent mine out on a friday and got it back that monday. (kpro)

 

Yea. All your doing is sending your ecu to a shop who does the hondata reflash, theyll retune your ecu with the reflash, then send it back to you to install back into your car

 

The ONLY place on the planet that does the reflashing is Hondata in Torrance, CA. Dealers just push the papers, so to speak, and facilitate your sending the ECU directly to Hondata and Hondata sending it directly back to you.

 

This will definitely be my next mod. I've been wanting to buy it for a while but kept holding off on getting it, to get other mods for my car. But I'll have it come spring time!

 

I want to upgrade my TSX a bit as well, but have been having the same questions as the OP. Why is it that our only option for the TSX is a reflash, isn't there some tech we could buy that would allow us to manually enter would would be best for what we have? With that said, why is it so expensive for something that costs hondata nothing but time to do.

 

KPro is now available.

And the reason it's "so expensive" is R&D costs. Its not like they just magically created this software and its not like the hardware to reflash a Honda proprietary ECU is free!

 

I was going to bring my car to a shop to have them send the chip out, how difficult would it be for me to take it out myself and ship it?

 

If you follow Hondata's instructions on the Reflash page for the TSX, it's dead simple. Keep in mind, once the ECU is out, the car isn't moving without a tow truck!

You will need a 10(?)mm socket and small ratchet, as well as a non-damaged #2 Phillips (star) screwdriver.

EDIT: Keep in mind you also have to remove the immobilizer around the key-slot on the steering column. The covers around the steering column pop off easily using the pictures from Hondata as a reference. Then there's two screws side-by-side, and one other one where its facing the front of the car - get on your back and you'll see it. All three of these screws need care -- they're small and soft! Use pressure to not let the screwdriver bit cam-out and ruin the head of the screw. Patience is a virtue.

 

hondata would be a wise purchase.

 

Thank you curls, very descriptive. I've been wanting to learn how to work on my car more, I guess this is a good place to start. Do you know if theres any DiY threads for this on here? The closest shop that would do this for me is in NH which is about an hour and a half drive for me, so I thought instead of leaving my car there for a few days I could keep it in my garage.

 

Check out the Hondata page - it's informative enough, but if not, a quick search here should provide something for you in addition to Hondata's description (which includes great pics).

 

i would say get a header first and basic bolt ons before getting the hondata to tune it

 

Very biased suggestion, but do the Hondata. It's so cheap (now; dammit) and easy (see my DIY and impressions post on it), and you see immediate gains, even without a CAI or other bolt-ons. I'm sure CAI and header replacement are great, but require work ... Hondata reflash just makes the engine rev like it should have out of the factory, and all you have to do is ship it off. You can't part it out, but who cares? I consider it fixing a design fault with the 1G TSX; VTEC should kick in at 5000 rpm, period.

Pulling the ECU is easy and painless. Getting the immobilizer out ... is a bit trickier. But if you know how to use a screwdriver and socket wrench, you can DIY. Trust me, I'm an (former) avionics tech wussie, hate pulling things apart, and I had everything ready to ship in an hour. (Send your valet key, if you have it; they don't need the wireless remote fob.)

Oh, and buy replacements for those craptastic immobilizer screws.

 

Thanks for the help. I was able to get everything out and I should be able to pick up my ecu in a day or two. I was looking at the dyno in one of the pictures above, it shows negative gains. I'm assuming thats an error?

 

Ummm... negative?

There's a ton of improvement between the purple line (stock) and the blue line (Hondata). There is a very very minor spot around 6200-6300rpm where it appears the stock version is above the Hondata version, but the other 7200rpm worth of dyno shows gain for Hondata.

Trust us, you will LOVE the Hondata upgrade!

 

It will be a nice upgrade, I haven't heard anything bad about it at all. I was just saying in the picture where it says gains it says -28.2 and -32.6

http://hondata.com/images/dyno-06tsx...h-vs-stock.gif

 

They just ran the math in reverse (or ran the Hondata ECU first, then stock ECU second.)

 

Well I just put my reflash in and love the results. No question its worth the money and made the car more fun to drive. I just added a rsb too which is also really nice.

 

At the risk of sounding conservative,... you're done! With the CAI and beefier RSB, your car should now perform and handle very well.

Now it's time to get some upgrades on the DRIVER. If you haven't been licensed more than a couple of years, look for advanced driver training. SCCA and Tire Rack have a good one-day course called Street Survival, in which you'll get to see the limits of your TSX' handling and learn how to recover when you exceed those limits. There may also be "track days" hosted by the regional SCCA or other car clubs, in which you drive a track under instruction. Great opportunity to do some spirited driving in a safe, controlled environment with an experienced driver guiding you. PM me if you need more info.

Trust me, the advanced training is invaluable in keeping your car (and yourself) safe, and you'll REALLY appreciate the upgrades you've invested in.

 

Some late-night modding at 4:30am? Congrats on the install.

Pulley(s) could be next. There's always something!

 

There is nothing to tune. Hondata tunes this ECU for use with CAI, Headers, & exhaust. You'll see some gain from the ecu on a stock motor but the ecu is made so you see even more gains from these parts than you would w/o it. Also its made pretty much to run exclusively on premium gas so folks keep that in mind. The raised redline adds to the top-end as well a the major jump in mid-range. You'll feel every bit of it asap.

 

Haha yea I really wanted to finish up my car last night so I did some late night modding with one of my buddies. Well worth it though.

I was originally looking at the Skid school since it lowers my insurance rate, but the street survival course is something i'd definitely want to do.

I was looking into doing pulleys also but I wasn't comfortable doing that upgrade yet. Just too many people saying different things.