think about it..if a TL is behind even a 325i..where would a TSX be comared to the midrange 325i?? i still dont see how you see a I4 FWD as a sportsedan which is where the MB,Lexus,BMW's plaly in... the cars are fundementally different to begin with. there can be no comparison of "value" if they are different things. a Saab9-3, volvo S40, A4 FWD is where the TSX excels, but look at those brands and then at MB,BMW,Lexus.

and you highlighted my point exactly..luxury/sportsedans buyers aren't just looking for value....the Car itself is the most importnatn part. you may not agree...but it's pretty clear if a 325i and TSX were even price which car would most members on this board let alone average consumer choose. which show that people WANT the 325i more but monetary constraints may force them into a TSX. if acura had a car that people would choose if it were the same price as a 325i, then that would make a viable brand... its like the supermarket discounting day old baked goods to sell, the ppl who buy them will think what a good deal they are getting, its nearly just as fresh but almost half price.. but if they were the same price, ppl would the the fresh ones. in the end, Acura has products that are not quite upto par with its targeted market..but discounts its products sufficiently so people will sacrifiace the car to save money.

 

Says you.

 

I can't argue with you because I see your entire value system to be flawed. That's ok of course because those are your opinions, and you have every right to feel that way. The TL is ahead of the 330i, let alone the 325i. What planet are you on anyway?

The average consumer is a total moron, let's not forget that. I would assume the average consumer would pick the BMW, but not because it's a better car. It has a perception as a better car. That's where you and I agree about German cars versus Acuras.

The general public thinks these cars are the greatest because they cost way more than a comparable Japanese or American car, so therefore they must be better. The truth is they are not. I was in a friend's E430 today and I thought it was a total piece of shit (for a $50k luxury car). In fact, that car was RIDICULOUS for the money they were charging. Where is the glory in that?

 

Acura needs two things a car that makes more than 290 hp and is either rwd or awd, and add a performance division maybe sell factory based Mugen or Computech cars like Mercedes does with Amg. That A-spec thing sucks in my opinion.

 

says the car mags and anybody who've driven it.. unless you like plowing into corners and wallowing around when you hit a bump and like torque steer as well.:P

 

"There's only one glitch in the luxury cruiser side of the TL's personality - the steering. Oh yes, we've heard all the complaints about torque steer, etc. and let's dispel that right now, this car doesn't have a torque steer problem. The amount of power you choose to deploy through the front tires does influence the steering, but it does so in the manner you choose. But there is a drawback, one present only on the 6-speed model TL as far as we can tell. At very, very light throttle, say as you add a little throttle to maintain speed up a grade, etc. the steering can develop a little wiggle. Nothing major, almost imperceptible most of the time, but it is noticeable in gentle sweepers. Lift off the gas and it goes away, apply more throttle and it disappears again. What's causing this? It's the LSD stupid! (that's directed at the auto mags who've been bitching about torque steer, not you dear, intelligent and well informed readers). At very light throttle openings you're right on the verge of where the LSD really begins to take action and when it does it helps steer the wheels into a corner, hence the slight variation in steering angle. Combined with the very quick steering, especially off-center, and you get a little movement in the wheel, if not in the path of the car. It's a price we're more than willing to pay, as you'll understand in a moment, but it may be something that Acura takes a look at for mid-model cycle revisions."

- TOV

Don't be so dramatic Gilbo

 

I just read a page or so of this thread, and

I bought an Acura. My penis needs no extension, so having a 4 cyl doesn't bother me, even if the competition can brag of bigger units. I could have bought an ugly-ass Accord V6 for equal dollars? I'm must be going mad!! What a fool I am!! I lose a second or whatever in a straight line. My god, what was I thinking? I come from ownership of previous shitboxes, but I'm supposed to be dissapointed that my TSX doesn't perform as well as the other brands that I've never driven? A car magazine gives my ride a poor showing. Damn, guys that drive the best on earth don't worship my car. What the hell is going on? I'm so dissapointed...waaaaaah!!

I'm a novice performance driver. I'm sure many of us are, though it seems everyone in a BMW, Merc or Lexus claims they aren't. Because of this, these talented performance drivers need RWD and more torque and HP. I gotta give it to them. I'm sure the majority of the "better" brand owners use every masterly engineered inch of their cars to drive at levels Juan Pablo would be more familiar with.

I had the money to buy an 330ci if I wanted. I love BMWs as well. I mean I've worshipped their cars for the last ten years or so. Why did I buy the TSX? Simple. For my wannabe performance driving ass, it delivered everything I'd never before experienced, and everything I needed and wanted. Why the fuck would I spend an extra 4, 5, 6, 7 grand on a similar car? Oh right, 6 cylinders, RWD, "prestige"(the gheyest word ever) and ego stroking. What was I thinking?

Why can't a car company have it's own identity without being compared to the others? Yes, I'd say Acura is entry level luxury and performance. Even with 4 cylinders... Who fuckin' cares??!! The whole luxury segment is so overplayed and blown out of proportion anyway. Every bloody car with leather and a Nav screen is considered luxury these days FFS!! Luxury this, luxury that...(LOUD FART)

I'll never expect to see Acura at the #1 spot, and it bothers me not one bit. I didn't buy the best, but I'm sure as hell enjoying this bloody car. It's the best to me and that's all that matters.

 

Thank You! That was well put, cause i think the same thing...tired of all this hoopla...i love my car and its a damn fun car to drive, especially for a 24 year old...

 

Just out of curiosity, gilbo, have you actually driven the new TL or is this all strictly comparing based on what the mags are saying?