xxh

I am looking on Craigslist for a '04 or '05 TSX. There aren't many listings for Owners, so if I want a lot more options, I will have to go to a dealer. Dealers mark the price up around 2k.

Do you think I can haggle a dealer down to around Private-party "good" condition price, if I paid in cash? Thanks!

Jimmy The Saint

Well contrary to popular belief, paying in cash will actually hurt you. Dealers would much rather have you finance the car. So saying how much for cash nowadays doesn't "buy" what it used to. That said, it all depends on the car. You haven't really given us much to go on. What is your budget? do you wan tan 04 or an 05? or facelift 06? Do you want navigation? All of these things come into play. And of course mileage? Are you willing to buy a high mileage car to save some bucks?

There are a couple of nice TSXs here http://www..com/forums/tsx-sale-wanted/

Also where are you located?

nj2pa2nc

I agree dealers would rather you finance the car than pay cash-

xxh

Ive been busting my ass working to save up for a nice car since I was 15. I'm now 20 and have enough to finally get a sweet car.

I live in Indianapolis, Indiana.

There is a TSX for sale at a dealer. I entered the cars info and 94,000 mileage, and kbb said the car in "good" condition is $11,600 private party.

The dealer has it listed for $11,900. $400 difference. I just called them and I asked is the car for financing or for purchase. They said it is for sale. Doesn't is seem fishy that a dealer is selling a car damn near private party price? Think there is maybe something wrong with it?

Oh, your link doesn't work

LuvMyTSX

Not really a surprise for an 04. Most 04s can't be certified pre-owned anymore, which jacks up the price a little bit. If it has high mileage, then the price is even lower.

Either way, get a Carfax and Auto Check on anything before you buy. They aren't fool-proof of course, but can alert you to any problems the dealer doesn't mention.

Simba91102

Good for you for saving your money for a nice car. You didn't say what year the car is that you're interested in (I'm thinking it's an 05, but maybe not. TSX prices tend to be quite regional, and I have no idea what your area will support, so I could of course be wrong). And I'm also curious if this in an Acura dealer. It would surprise me to see a car with that many miles on the lot, as it would most often be wholesaled off, no matter how good the the condition is. That said, if it is an Acura dealer, they may own it for cheap, think they could make a quick buck by not pricing it too high and try to move it in a hurry. Try to get a service history on the car (if it was serviced by an Acura or a Honda dealer, it's all in the computer), and try to find out if it's ever been hit.

And I don't really agree on the theory of financing will get you a better deal. I'm still pretty sure that if you took say $11K cash monies in the door with you and offered to lay it down right now for the car, my guess is you'd have yourself a deal. If not? So what; nothing ventured, nothing gained. And at least the salesman would know your serious and that you actually have some money. Plus, it's cliché but.... a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

Jimmy The Saint

its not that financing gets you a better deal its that cash doesn't anymore- it used too...

anyway: is this the car you are looking at?

http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail...5&aff=national

I think if you could muster up about 2 grand more you could get a bunch lower miles and an 05. If you are financing do the math - see what the max payment is you can afford and search around. Look for a while. This is a big decision, don't jump in too quick.

And hey, if you find a car around the DC northern va area, I'll go look at it for you and help you find a good shipper or pick you up at the airport if you fly in.


Here is an 06 6 speed with Navigation - its only a few miles from my work. Be happy to go check it out for you tomorrow. Listed for 11,900. 93K miles

http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail...5&aff=national

i dig Milano Red...

LuvMyTSX

Also, if you are tight on money (kind of sounds like the case), you might want to avoid 2004 models. They have more issues (expensive ones) that the other years seems to have mostly avoided.

nj2pa2nc

First I commend you for saving for a car.
When I bought my 06 tsx I planned to pay for it in full (cash) I was informed by the dealer that acura was having a good rate on interest. When I decided to finance $10,000 they gave me more off on the car. The same thing happened when my mom did the same thing when she purchased her 08 honda. I am going by personal experience not hear say.

Jimmy The Saint

Same thing happened to me.....

redpoint

Patience will always be your friend when trying to get the best deal.

My stealership experience-
I was initially quoted $26k for my car. I laughed at the salesman and said he was crazy. He asked what number I thought was reasonable, and I said $19k. His counter was $22k, and I told him that he wasn't hearing correctly, because I would pay only $19k. He eventually came down to $19,400, and asked what it would take for me to buy that day. I told him again $19k, but he wouldn't budge. I walked away and came back the next week, and bought the thing for $18,600.

Don't get emotionally attached to anything you don't own yet, or you will get steamrolled by professionals who are expert at separating people from their money. My suggestion is to buy private party because you will get the best price, and can likely bargain more effectively since the average person is not an expert at selling. Furthermore, you can get an idea of how the car was treated, instead of lies from a salesman telling you it was babied.

Jimmy The Saint

wow - 26K to 18,600 - now thats a deal

jchan2

Well, the car that I looked at was initially listed for $23,995, but I only went to look at it when the price dropped to $21,160. I walked in, drove the car, offered $19,500 cash, which they flat refused.

I offered $20,000 cash, which they refused. I got up, went to lunch, and before I walked into the restaurant, the dealer called back and said we had a deal at $20,000 cash plus taxes, tags, etc.

Sometimes walking away and leaving your phone number will do wonders. I bought a Nissan Altima this way too for my mom. Offered a little under what I wanted to offer, "raised" my offer a little to show I'm serious, and then walked.

2 days later on the Altima deal, I got a call telling me that we had a deal at my price. 2 hours after hanging up the phone, my mom and I drove off in a new Altima.

Jimmy The Saint

I think I haggled down 1500 on my car..... probably could have gotten em down a bit more, I guess.

jchan2

For a frame of reference, the book value on my TSX when I bought it was something like $20,900 in "excellent" condition for private party, and around $19,600 for "good" condition from a private party.

Dealer retail book value was something like $23,500. Basically a ridiculous price.

I had a Volvo dealer try to convince me that at a dealer, everyone paid the dealer retail book price for the car, which I don't believe. The KBB Dealer values are so overinflated.

NJ-TLGuy

I just bought my 07 TL from a dealer and agree that paying cash does not work in buyers favor. Dealers would rather you use their financing...I think they get some type of kick-back.

Jimmy The Saint

Prices are all dependent on the market. Here in DC, Acuras are really popular (as are 3 series BMWs) so they are easy to sell and hence the prices may not be as low as other areas. A good example, my brother in law pretty much stole a Passat Wagon in South Carolina because there is hardly a market for them there.

But a dealer typically has 2 to 3k room to move I have found on used cars if it is the brand they sell. The indy delaers are a different story - they buy their cars wholesale - i wouldn't touch those things.

Jimmy The Saint

They sure do. They get a % of the total value of the loan. So if you finance 30K at 6% that's like 35K total. Dealer gets part of the additional 5K

kodawg9

Ultimately, it depends on the interest rate that you'd be getting if you finance a car. If it's high, then I can't say, don't pay all in cash.

If you are paying in cash, don't tell them you're gonna pay in cash until you've got the written offer from them for a certain figure. If you tell them you'll pay in cash, they won't go down that much because, as stated by others, the dealers can make up that money they lose in the haggling process through the financing.

My dealer never asked me how I was gonna pay them. I guess they assumed I was gonna finance, which was what my plan was anyways. But if they ask how you're gonna pay, find ways to avoid that topic until the last minute by saying stuff like, "I'm not at that point yet."

These guys are professional at what they do, but you can certainly take advantage of these dealers.

NJ-TLGuy

I wish I had kodawg9 to give me that advice before I bought from the dealer. I told them up front I had my own money...might have saved myself a few bugs if I led them to believe I was financing. I'm still happy as hell with my TL and feel the price was good, it is Acura certified.

jchan2

I would also agree that if you can find an Acura from the Acura dealer, then that is preferred. I don't know how I feel about the indy places- I know they go to auction to buy their cars (as does CarMax) but I've seen cars from my local Acura dealer come in via auction, too.

I didn't really consider CarMax (basically the only other place in Nashville you could go for a used Acura TSX at the time I bought) because their TSXs were priced equal to, if not higher, than comparable models at the Acura dealer.

Plus the Acura dealer cars had the Certified warranty and room to haggle.

redpoint

Perhaps knowing what the dealer paid for the car will give you some room to negotiate.

Before I purchased my car, I researched the price they paid for it. When I offered $19k and they said they would loose money on the deal, I asked how they could loose when they paid $14k. My reply "If you can't turn a profit on a $5k margin, then you are in the wrong business".

Jimmy The Saint

not always that easy to find out what they paid - especially if it was a trade in. Where would you find that?

skipreid

I bought my TSX new in 2006. The dealer came down from 30k to 26k and he drove it to my house after work in the middle of the week, which is 78 miles away. Good ole' Fred.

redpoint

KBB.com - trade in value, or other online resources such as Edmunds. You won't know exactly what they paid, but you will get very close.

When I told the dealer how much they paid for the car, instead of denying it, he attempted to justify the price by saying there are significant expenses in preparing the vehicle for sale, none of which involved polishing the scratches out of the paint.

Jimmy The Saint

So actually you didn't know what they ACTUALLY paid just what trade in value is. Dealers rarely pay what KBB states. They use black book or auction prices even if they are going to sell the car on the lot. So they probably paid a lot less than you thought.

rkan121

haha dealerships can be funny. patience def helps alot. arnt all of the used cars dealers have , traded in..... so the person that traded it in more thanlikely got ripped off thus increasing the profit for the dealership. this will give you some room to negotiate

1Louder

xxh,

Buying an 5-6 year old car is part art, part science. You can research all you want but you'll find such a wide variety of pricess all kbb and other web sites can do is give you a range. If kbb is at 11.4K and they are at 11.9K, you're in the ball park and that's about as much help research will be.

At this point just evaluate the car you want and determine it's a solid car. Get it checked out by a mechanic if you really want to be sure. Make sure it has a clean title. There's lots of threads on this forum already on what to look out for.

As for the deal, don't be too suspicious of the dealer price if it's in the range of what the research says it should be. Maybe they stole it from the person that traded it in and they can offer a good price (that happens a lot). I'd get very suspicious of any deal that sounds too good to be true. There is no such thing. But go in and get a price you're happy with. My take - a dealer offering a car for $11.9K can probably be had for an even $11k or close to it (+/- $200).

Aside from that, don't kill yourself over +/- $200. As long as you are happy with the price and the car, it's a good deal. Also, guaranteed that a week after you buy it you'll find one for less. With cars, there's always a better deal. But at some point, you just have to go buy what you want and be done with it. In 4 years, you're not going to care and it will be a distant memory. And you'll have a great car.

Simba91102

Good advice; points I've been preaching here for years (we all should try to learn as we get older). I get a charge out of how some people will fight tooth and nail for that last $100 on a car sale but walk in to an appliance store and pay whatever the sticker says for a refrigerator or a washing machine. And, as you noted in the above post, as long as someone is relatively happy with the deal, a few years from now (a few months actually), they won't remember the price and they won't care.