I don't have a question so much as I have an urge to try to work this out and vent to people who may understand.

I've been seriously considering a first gen TSX for a bit and test drove two. With the first, I couldn't really take it over 40MPH, but I did avoid a deer. In the second, I got to unwind it a bit and found it not quite right under cornering and braking. After the drive, I discovered one of the tires had a large bubble on the side, and they were pretty worn, which probably explained that. I thought I'd give the first one another try, but it was sold.

I went back to looking at some other cars, but then this came up:
Black exterior and interior, manual transmission non-nav 2006 TSX, under 20K miles, no signs or records of accidents or modifications, priced just under $18K. Great.

But I can't quite convince myself to get it. I also seriously thought I'd buy the second TSX and even tried to work out a deal for the car and a new set of tires, but we couldn't quite reach an agreement. I keep running through options, including telling myself that I could probably re-sell it without taking much of a loss if I want, but the drives so far were missing something. I liked the other TSXs, but I wasn't wowed, although it's tough under those conditions.

And as tempting as the TSX is, I keep looking at a listing for a '93 Prelude with 50K miles and some rust on the back fenders. If I was good at bodywork and had extra garage space, I'd probably get it just because. But the TSX...

So, am I just insane? Or should I just go buy it? Or just forget about it? I'm looking for something fun to drive, with great driver feedback. Something that I'd smile while driving, especially if I saw a sequence of curves ahead.

 

What you're experiencing is common when we can't decide what/when to buy. I think you'd find it has nothing to do with the car you're undecided about being a TSX though. That just happens to be what's caught your fancy right now. And the TSX you're interested in sounds nice, but it's a bit pricey (in my opinion), and being a black on black MT, I wouldn't plan on flipping it anytime soon if a "try out" is your plan (black is kind of a love it or hate it and there's a reason why MT TSX's are 5% of sales).

 

Thanks. I figured that was a decent price for what a dealer is listing (at least compared to what else I've seen), and I could go from there. I think that in one respect, 20K miles is barely broken in for a Honda (I have an Accord with over 160K), and it's an entry luxury sports sedan at nearly the price of a new economy car. I am searching for justification, though.

I think one thing throwing me off is that I've never owned a car with any kind of drive by wire system. Also, even though I've spent some time driving cars with ABS or traction control, I've yet to own one.

I'm in the position to finally get something pretty special, as I've always been an enthusiast who figured out how to get the best out of what I've got. It'd be nice to get something awesome. Of course, this is a time when awesome is much harder to find than utility. And I'd like some all-weather awesome that doesn't break a lot.

 

Please don't let me dissuade you from giving this car serious consideration. The TSX is a wonderful car; by far one of the best I've ever owned, and I've owned allot. The drive by wire is invisible, as are the traction control and ABS (unless needed of course). My wife and I drove all wheel drive Audi's for years, going back to Honda products when high accumulated mileage and long life became a priority. Front wheel drive has been sufficient year round even here in the Northeast. The Acura's haven't let us down. The 05 is up to 127K miles, the 07 just hit 100K, both with nothing more than regular maintenance. We both do mainly highway driving and the mileage is great (I average over 28 at cruising speeds in the 80-90 mph range) and I'm pretty sure you'd find the car comfortable, entertaining, and very easy to modify. Price is in my opinion must less important than some others here might find. As long as you're fairly satisfied with the deal, trust me; a year or two from now, you won't remember the kind of deal you got, and you won't care (and you're looking at it in the right context. Indeed, you won't find much new for the kind of money you're talking about). An 06 with that low mileage is kind of a find; it's just getting broken in. The only real downside that I see is the fact that the factory warranty is probably short lived. So.... I'd say there's little to lose by making the move (especially coming from an Accord).

 

Thanks, that does help, and I'm still seriously considering it. Since it's a 2006, I'll just have the powertrain warranty, but so far living with a Honda well past the warranty period has still been very good. Of all the cars I've owned, the 2000 Accord Coupe has been by far the most reliable. I intend to keep it, but it's starting to show its age. It's also an automatic, and I want to return to driving manuals. (At the time I bought it, I was having complications after breaking my left leg and needed an automatic). I'm not too fond of the current Honda/Acuras, however, since I tend to favor smaller, more responsive cars.

I was also seriously considering a CPO BMW 3-series, but discovering they no longer have dipsticks threw me. I may be being a bit of a Luddite, but the inability to look at the oil while examining a used car is kind of a deal breaker. Audis and some VWs are tempting, but my mechanic once told me working on those cars can sometimes drive them crazy.

I've got a free day, so I'll probably take the TSX for a test drive.

 

As the proud owner of a 06 6MT (yes I am part of the minority) tsx I recommend it. I also so mostly highway driving and average over 30MPG. It now has almost 113,000 miles. After getting gas in NJ the attendant did not turn the gas cap enough. The car now has the tighten gas cap and check emissions systems messages. I did tighen the gas cap. I have an appointment at the acura dealer next week to get the power steering recall done along with an oil/filter change and tire rotation/balance. If the message is still on I will have them reset it.

 

Your requirements seem to be that you want something driver-friendly, fun, corners well, reliable, comfortable and sporty at the same time, and something that you can toss around with relative ease.
IMO, a 2006 TSX with the MT completely fits the bill. The 6MT in these cars is super-slick ('buttery' is often used to describe the transmission shifts). The power of the 2006+ is very nice although doesn't feel like it sometimes -- due to the fact its a 4cyl but still has a lot of torque down low (90% of peak tq at 2000rpm I think is the selling phrase). It can rev nice and high like all other Hondas, and while doing so you still retain full control and are in comfort and luxury while doing so.

Its practical, affordable, and retains a lot of Honda DNA that you like (esp. if you're looking at an older Prelude, I can tell you like driving Hondas!).

 

Thanks nj2pa2nc and curls. I may be looking for the older Honda DNA and was hoping to find it in the TSX, but the only one I got to push a bit turned out to have very worn tires.

I do like driving Hondas. I've had two now, and they've been my all around favorites. If you're curious, others have been two Nissans (good in some ways, surprisingly bad in others), a Toyota (competent but mind-numbingly dull), an Olds (the single worst car I've owned), a Chevy (almost as bad as the Olds), a Ford (first manual), a Mazda for a week (dealer bought it back), and a Plymouth Grand Fury ex-police car (my first car was a monster).

 

What other cars are you looking at? I'd suggest test driving a bunch of competitors so that you can get a baseline. That may help you appreciate the TSX more, or whatever car you decide to choose.

But I'd suggest keep looking at other TSXs as well. It sounds like you haven't had the chance to drive a proper model thoroughly, maybe that's just what you really need.

 

To put it into perspective, I came from a 1991 Acura Integra and found the TSX to be the "grown up" version with a billion refinements, but still retaining somewhat of a go-kart feel if one wants to drive it as such. To me, that's what driving a Honda product is like -- very responsive, subtle but fun, but still can be 100% pedestrian-like in nature if you need to bring grandma to the airport. To me its a near-perfect 'dad' car where I can still have fun or act 'responsible' when I want (I'm 30 with two kids, so I need to balance fun and functionality in one car).

 

I went and took the car for a test drive. I couldn't do much in turns, but at least I got to do freeway acceleration, and the car was pretty nice and responsive. The car itself is very clean, but I could not find the vin tags on the hood and front fenders. Are they behind the sound insulation? The sales guy asked what I was looking for, then told me where the vin was. I told him I knew that, but I'm looking for the body panel tags to check for replacement. He jumped in and assured me again that the Carfax and history was perfect. (Later he printed out an AutoCheck, which didn't show anything. But I'd still rather see the tags themselves).

I like the car quite a bit, but I'm not sure I love it. I'm don't quite know why. The test drive went well, but I didn't quite feel comfortable yet with the transmission (although the shift linkage felt great). I'd probably get used to it. I didn't come close to stalling nor miss a shift or anything, but I wasn't quite there. I did heel-toe a bit and found the pedal spacing good.

I did tell him we could work out a price, then I'd go home and consider it. At that point, he went into aggressive car salesman mode, which put me off. I think he noticed the sudden phone call about the wholesaler aching to buy it didn't get the response he wanted. It may be true, but I learned long ago not to react to "gotta jump on it now!" sales tactics.

One minor thing. When I was leaving, he also decided to slag a bit on my car, saying he can't believe I was going to drive home in that thing instead of this one. It's sales guy stuff, but I think if someone has a 10 year old car and is not trading it, it's probably more than just a piece of junk to him.

I'm thinking about it, but right now I'm leaning towards no.
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Aman - The ones I looked at are most of the fairly sporty but daily-living kind of cars: Other Hondas and Acuras, Subaru Legacy GT, Mazda/Mazdaspeed 6 and 3, BMW 3-series, Ford Fusion, possibly even the Suzuki Kizashi. The problem is finding cars with a manual transmission, and I'm not a fan of electronic nannies nor electronic steering. I've been researching/looking for a while when I get time (I have odd work hours).

curls - I could see a bit of that in the test drive I took today. The Integra is interesting. If I could go back to the early 90s, I'd probably try to find an Integra instead of the Sentra. I've even watched for a non-abused one, but they're tough to find. I even looked into an RSX-S (even though I think I'm too old for one), until I asked for an insurance quote.
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Anyway, thanks everyone, even anyone who read any/all of that

 

Don't let the salesman push you into making a decision. If you're leaning towards no right now, take your sweet precious time making a decision. It could be a week, a month, even almost a year. These cars will only go down in price

It sounds like you want to keep all the pros of the TSX, but make it a bit more sportier. Don't forget many of the things you may not like about the TSX can be cured by a modification.

 

Aman - Thanks, and no, I won't let him push me. I actually have the opposite reaction. If a salesman decides to put on pressure, I make up my mind to definitely not. That's partly from lessons learned when I was much younger, way too eager and not thorough enough in my research.

It sounds like you're right about what I'd like. On modification, however, the things I suspect would make it better won't be that easy. While these aren't crucial, I would like a limited slip (salesman said it had one), the stereo (it's become much harder to install aftermarket units) and the electronic throttle. Tires and possibly brakes would be much easier.

I did get to spend a good part of a sunny, crisp day driving through a rural countryside, past Amish buggies and farms, as well as get to take a newer car for a drive. Not a bad way to spend a free day.

 

Take your time and you'll find that perfect TSX if you decide to go with it. Trust me, I don't think anyone flip flopped (BMW/TSX/Camry) as much as I did or took as long as I did to get the TSX (Almost 2 years).

I picked a used TSX over the new one because it had the engine pinging, premature brake failure, and larger size. I only hope Honda/Acura improves their cars after this wave of refreshes because it isn't likely I will buy another one given the way the current "larger is better" approach.

 

npolite - Thanks. I hadn't heard that about the new TSX. I just feel that, like the current gen. Accord, it has gotten a bit too large and less engaging than previous versions for my preferences. I'm also hoping that Honda/Acura finds its way back to making driver-focused cars again. The CR-Z looks kind of promising, but for now the first gen. TSX is about the last Honda I've really liked.

---

Earlier tonight I decided I needed a benchmark for the TSX, so I stopped by a BMW dealer. I asked the salesman if I could take one of the used, manual transmission 328s for a drive, just because I wanted to see what it was like. A few minutes later, I was flinging the car through a series of undulating curves and smiling like a buffoon.

I wish I could take the TSX down that road, but at least I now know what all the fuss is about.

 

Probably fear of commitment or making the wrong decision. I just went through it myself. It's a big decision, and one you should feel good about. Drive as many cars as you can (that you think you'd be interested in) and go from there.

 

Thanks. I'm concerned with making the wrong decision, and I tend to research and analyze some things an absurd amount. There were a couple of times that the sales guy told me I knew more about that car than he did. (One was when he said it had tire pressure monitoring, and I told him, no, that was added on 2007s.) So, yeah.

At any rate, the 328i drive was helpful. I think that that the TSX is a great all-around, all-season, easy-to-live-with-every-day luxury sports sedan, but I think it's just a little more weighted to luxury than what I'd like. Now I just need to find something that combines the refinement, build quality, and harmonious brilliance of the TSX with the "Holy Crap" awesomeness of the 328i.

 

Just wanted to weigh in on a couple of subjects mentioned here...

Salesmen who are like the one you described can be very off-putting. I've looked at things, (not just cars), that I really like and ended up buying, but the sales experience ruined it for me. In fact, I'll remember the over-zealous jerks for years afterward. Could be that is tainting this for you a bit. (I know it would make me think twice about that particular car.)

I ended up with the same TSX vs. BMW decision. I loved the way BMW's drive. I liked the way the 1G TSX drives almost as much. The BMW engines vary with displacement, but these days they are all strong. (The TSX, especially with a MT is pretty strong, too...and can quickly be made stronger if you buy an 04-06 and get Hondata for $300).

But it came down rear wheel drive vs. front wheel drive. And if I lived in a warm weather climate, I'd get a rear wheel drive car. The balance is just different. I owned two RWD sport cars and they were just joy on wheels. But, try driving a RWD car in a place where there is significant snow or worse yet, ice...and you will know the meaning of white-knuckled driving, sliding and a lack of confidence in your path. You will even avoid driving on cold wet days. (That's a deal breaker for me.) And don't tell me BMW makes AWD cars. Yes, they do, and they are heavy, ill-balanced shadows of the RWD brethren. (If you read Car & Driver, they say the same thing; AWD is not worth the penalty of weight.)

The other important reality is that unless you plan to get rid of the car after the warranty expires, BMWs will cost you a lot of money to maintain. And as it ages, you'd better get used to seeing it in your mechanic's bay rather than in your driveway. (Another deal breaker for me.) Even if you can afford to repair it, why would you want a car that is M.I.A. periodically?

So, with that said, I'd get the BMW, but only if you live outside the snow belt and if you plan to buy/lease new every 3-4 years.

 

Boulder TSX - The salesman's deciding to try cheap manipulation pretty much killed it. I was seriously considering agreeing to buy it, even heading back and arranging someone to take me back, but as soon as he pulled that stuff it was time to leave.

That's another part of what made stopping into the BMW dealership great. The salesman there knew I just wanted to take one for a ride, but he had no problem directing me to a great road and even asked if I wanted to take it on the freeway or anything. That place is also part of a very good local dealer network which has been very open and no-pressure in the past. The only problems are that they rarely stock manuals, they don't have an Acura dealer and the Honda dealer is pretty far.

At any rate, I know about rear wheel drive cars on snow and ice. I live in the slushy center of the snowbelt, and I learned to drive mainly with very powerful, rear wheel drive cars and pickups. It's been some time, but I remember some pretty scary moments. I do think learning to drive in those conditions did serve me well, although I wouldn't recommend it. It may be part of the reason I felt superhuman and nearly unstoppable driving an Accord with winter tires through blizzard conditions last year. Whatever I get, I plan on keeping that car as long as I can. It's been astonishing.

As a sidenote, a bit ago I looked at what I've saved on a car site, and thought that, for less than half the price of the TSX, I could get the '93 Prelude and a '90 325iS with over 200K miles. Then I'd just need to take classes in auto repair. Well, it's a fun thought, anyway.

 

Now that would be completely different -- and it could be lots of fun. (Two great cars...and one car could cover for the other if repairs were needed.)


As for driving RWD cars in snow for years and getting a feel for it, I know what you mean. You do get a good idea of what's possible and can make it work most of the time, especially with winter tires. But like you said, if you suddenly go to a front drive car like the TSX with winter tires, you feel invincible in comparison. I didn't realize how low stress a drive after a snow storm could be.

 

One thing to really consider is that on a 90 or 2006 325i the repair costs. Check to see what the prices on just the parts go for. Especially with the runflat tires you could be looking at tires costing well over 300+ per tire if you get the sport package. The brakes usually run $200 per axle and you also need to replace (highly recommended) the rotors at each change. I think when I added everything up in parts alone it came close to $500 for just the parts!

BMWs are fun cars to drive and have a great warranty while new or on a lease but once that lease is over forget it.

 

Boulder TSX - A 90s Prelude/325i combo does sound like a great idea, doesn't it? But it's still one that still requires quite a bit of time and skill. And tools. Speaking of which, I was talking with my mechanic a bit ago about cars and found out he has an old Honda and BMW. I think they were both late 80s / early 90s; he just keeps them going. Of course, he is an excellent mechanic.

As for winter driving, the Accord/Blizzak combo actually made some otherwise very scary situations fun last winter. I'd just keep away from other cars as much as possible, ease through the packs and push through.

npolite - Yes, that's a huge consideration and I'm finding info is all over the place, from $1,000 to $6,000 a year. I probably spend about $1k/year on the Accord. As you probably gathered, I also tend to keep cars a long time. So, I'm not sure. I have noticed that listings for CPO 328is are nearly $10K more than those sold at non-BMW dealers. Maybe I should figure that's about what three years' of maintenance costs would be.

--
If anyone's curious about the TSX, it looks like the dealer uploaded photos to its ads, so evidently the "buy now or it's gone to the wholesaler" wasn't quite accurate. I did get the price down to a little over $17k, though (about $18.5K with tax/fees).

 

i cross-shopped a used is300, is250, mazdaseed6, nissan altima se-r, and bwm 325i. but i smiled like a buffoon driving the tsx... i've loved hondas ever since i rode in an cherry 79' accord hatchback my dad's friend owned, rode in a 85' accord hatchback, wanted to buy a used 89' accord lx sedan as a first car (couldn't afford it as a high schooler), rode in a friend's uncle's 91' integra sedan (thought the angled look of the rear windows rolled down was awesome), and practically drooled when the tsx came stateside in 04' (past co-workers could vouch for this). i know a 3-series is a superior driving machine stock for stock, but, i love my hondas and buying a tsx was an easy decision.

sounds like you don't want the car enough.

 

That's just the thing. I've loved Hondas for some time, as well, and was always happy to drive or ride in one. My parents had a '90 Accord they had bought used, got another car and then told me they had put the Honda up for sale. I had driven it and loved it, so I wrote them a check and sold the '88 V6 Camry I had at the time (I found it mind-numbingly dull). When the Accord was 16 years old, it needed an engine rebuild, and a few people were fairly persistent that I not put more money into it. I kind of regret being persuaded.

Later, even though it turned my stomach at needing to get a car with an auto transmission, I was ecstatic when I found the Accord Coupe. Even after all this time, the car still amazes me. So, when I realized I can go back to driving manuals along with the increasing likelihood that I may have to at least semi-retire the Coupe from 80+-mile/day commutes, I immediately looked to Honda/Acura. What I've found bothers me, but that subject's pretty well discussed.

In my shopping, the first gen. TSX seemed to still have the kind of spirit that made me love driving Hondas, but it's not quite been there in the test drives. It may have been the conditions of the drives, the traffic or the salesman in the last case, but I haven't felt that spark. Even while driving back from the dealer, I turned into a corner in my Accord and thought it felt more responsive and alive than the TSX I had just driven. It may have been familiarity, or that I was away from traffic and zipping through the countryside, but it still had that feel.

That may be a reason I wanted to try the BMW, to see if that feel was imagined or had been refined out of new cars. I knew I wanted a comparison, as I was overanalyzing reasons I should buy the TSX although my heart wasn't in it.

So, as you say, I suppose I don't want the TSX badly enough, but I'm glad you smile driving yours. I was really hoping I would, too.

I doubt I'll convince myself to live with both the costs and cachet/stigma (depending on perspective) of living with a BMW, so I'm not sure what I'll do. I'm probably a little too old for an RSX-S (although I did ask for an insurance quote on one. Eesh.). Most of the other Hondas I love will be fairly hard to find in good condition, and it doesn't make a lot of sense to buy a car as old/older than the Coupe.

So, thanks everyone for your advice and indulgence.

Edit - Maybe I just need to get a wagon and find a really steep hill. Oh yeah.

 

Carraway, one thing I find interesting about your comparison of the TSX to your Accord Coupe is that you find the Coupe more responsive. I've driven both, and I can say that the TSX in equal conditions, is a more responsive car. Having said that, I think you can chalk up the differences between your daily experience in the Accord, and the test-drives in the TSX's, to different conditions and often the sales pressure from the slimeball in the passenger seat.

With decent tires and twisty roads, the TSX handles like a champ and has laser-crisp steering response. Even then, if that's not enough, for about $120 you can get a Progress rear sway bar which makes the handling of the car even more neutral, flatter in corners, and more responsive. A HIGHLY recommended and inexpensive mod to get a lot more satisfaction from the car. Ask anyone whose done that mod and they will likely agree.

And with Hondata only costing $295+shipping (and a few days of downtime), it's a no-brainer if you find the power in the TSX lacking at all -- it makes a big difference and yet completely retains the luxury of having a nice flat torque curve down low.

I really think that anyone who loves how a Honda drives, owes it to themself to give the TSX a fair chance, as it really epitomizes the Honda/Acura experience, in my mind.

 

I came out of a '94 accord coupe manual (which I bought new). After putting over 150,000 mi on the accord- I got a used '07 TSX 6mt. I love driving a manual and the newer accords have gotten too big for my taste. I have had it less than 6 months but I love this tsx...

 

Actually, the DBW is very noticeable, not in a good way, if you get the 6MT.
One of the few downsides of the car IMO.

 

Hondata for $300?
Enlighten me! Last I checked, they were $600.

 

Apparently you haven't checked since before the spring...

 

curls - I was wondering about finding my car more responsive, as well. It may depend on which Accord Coupe you've driven, as I think they softened up a bit, but a lot of the difference for me may have been with the tires. The TSX had the original Michelins; mine has a set of Yokohama Envigors I bought last Spring.

I don't think I found the power lacking as much as the feedback and responsiveness. I'm not sure if that was drive by wire, but I think the TSX only uses the DBW throttle and the steering is still hydraulic, so it shouldn't have made that much difference. Of course, there were the conditions.

QPrime - Nice. Did you drive many other cars before Hondas?

 

I stand corrected. I'm sure it probably is more noticeable in a manual transmission car. The move to a computer controlled throttle is of course all about emissions (which is why it's becoming so common). I'm confident you'd notice similar throttle inconsistencies in a "hard wired" system that you find with the drive by wire (though more crudely applied). I assume it will get better in time. Evidently the AT pretty much masks all the symptoms that the MT exhibits.

 

I think this is a matter of personal taste, as I honestly don't notice it at all. I've driven cars with manuals exclusively for 25 years...(I've driven everything from Porsches, to 1990's Nissan Z's, older Honda Civics & Accords, Infiniti G35 coupes, RX-7's), and the TSX throttle seems no different to me vs any other car.

I've also seen no mention of the DBW by the automotive press...when the 1G TSX won Car & Driver's 10 Best Cars in the World award 3 years in a row. (And the car they were praising each time was the manual version).


On a side note, I have driven the 2G TSX as a loaner, and one thing I did notice with that car, (which was mentioned as a downside by Motor Trend and Car & Driver), was the electronic steering. They felt it was numb and vague on the highway...and I completely agree with that assessment. Fortunately, the 1G has hydraulic steering.

 

Yes, indeed. They cut the price in half a few months ago. A pretty sizable discount!

 

Probably a personal thing, but I know I'm not the only one. In fact, I've seen quite a few complaints about the rev hang in the throttle, apparently done for emissions purposes.

My other complaint about the 6MT is 6th gear. It's geared so close to 5th that it makes the 2 gears redundant. I would've enjoyed a taller 6th for better highway mileage.

 

Can't disagree with that...

 

This is the main reason why both my wife and I went with the AT when the TSX's were purchased. We both do like 90% + highway driving, so for mileage, wear and tear, and comfort purposes (the K24 is a sweet sounding little 4 banger, but cruising above 3500 or so can get tiresome), it was a no brainer. As they say, time is money, so I try to keep my average speed as high as possible, which means that I tend to cruise at pretty high speeds (traffic permitting, but I tend to travel almost exclusively in the early AM so it usually does) so the final drive reduction in high gear with the AT was important to me. So..... all you MT guys that think the AT crowd is missing something..... you're right, we are, but cut us some slack. As with most things in life, there's more to the story.....

 

Since you will be driving the car get what makes you happy and comfortable. My husband and I like driving manual transmission vehicles so that is what we own. I will cut you some slack but do the same for the MT crowd (yes I know we are in the minority and all the rest) Yes we also do alot of driving. Oh I leaned to drive MT many years ago in NYC.

 

I certainly do, and will continue to, respect everyone's opinion. I guess my point was that for some, the decision making process is not as black and white as it might appear. And.... I should (and should have) qualified my statements by adding that we had (at the time) a manual transmission option available to us at will since the Acura's were (and are) basically commuter rides. We had a WRX and/or a BMW Z4 (weather permitting) to satisfy the shift-it-yourself urge.

 

For me, it was the reviews by automotive journalists calling the 6MT in the TSX "one of the best manual transmissions ever made"...and that by itself made it worth a look. It has an unbelievably smooth and precise action...just a pleasure to use every day. Added to that is the lighter weight (thanks to the magnesium transfer case) and quicker 0-60 times over the auto.

But as Simba said, it really is all about your own individual needs, regardless of what the stats or experts say. And if I had to do a lot of commuter driving, especially in heavy traffic , I too would likely go with an automatic.

 

I have tried out a few shifters lately, and the one in the TSX is great.

As for the standard vs automatic attitudes - Yes. I love driving manuals and miss it (which is a big reason why I'm shopping), but I understand all too well the need to get an automatic sometimes. It does bother me, however, that now few cars even have the option available.