rb1

Don't know about your part of the world, but around here two-lane road speed limits are 55 mph, and in a typical passing situation you are going 50-55 mph, not 70 mph. So, you're at 2500 RPM or so, not 3000 RPM.

So, the standard top gear pass metric of 50-70 mph is a good guide. The TSX is roughly the same in this regard as the base Jetta GL with the 2.0L 115 hp engine, 122 lb-ft @ 2600 RPM. Draw your own conclusions.

ClutchPerformer

Try 150 lb-ft (at the wheels) @2600. Thanks.

ClutchPerformer

I don't see that as an advantage. I'm also at 3000 RPM @70mph when I'm not passing anyone. That's what wastes all of my gas on the highway.

rb1

Yup, and what do you get for this in this particular scenario?

The same top gear passing time as a car that weighs only 10% less but has 20%+ less torque.

The TSX shines in many areas but pep in top gear is not one of them, IMHO.

ClutchPerformer

I still don't see why "pep in top gear" is important (especially when you have a manual transmission at your disposal).

sauceman

Ah-hahaha, It's all in good fun.

Seriously, though, you should get a ride from me (...maybe at the track), see how "timid" a driver I can be.

rb1

Easy question to answer.

The car with more "pep in top gear" will generally subjectively feel faster, more responsive, and fun to drive. This is especially true if all other things are equal, and sometimes true even when they aren't (e.g. my current wheels vs. the TSX. No doubt I would get my doors -- and probably trunk lid, too -- blown off by a TSX, but I go 50-70 roughly a full second faster).

ClutchPerformer

Right......if both cars are in top gear. My point is: why would you want to leave it in 6th if you're really trying to accelerate? That's what doesn't make sense to me.

I guess I just don't feel like I need pep in top gear. I don't see the point.

rb1

And if both cars downshift? Advantage still generally goes to the car with shorter gearing.

Of course, this is true only up to a point of course (e.g. if you downshift enough gears then the shorter geared car will be out of its powerband sooner than the taller geared one), but it is almost certainly in the case of downshifting 1 and perhaps even 2 gears from top gear at 50 mph.

On a side note, if the TSX is turning 3000 RPM @ 70 mph (those must be big wheels based on the gearing for this to be true), that doesn't strike me as particularly short. A BMW 325i turns almost the exact same rev's at 70 mph and it's an I6.

ClutchPerformer

I don't think this has anything to do with how short/tall your gears are. I'd say it goes to the car with more top-end power assuming that both cars can put their RPMs in the same peak-power range.

Side note: They are big wheels. 17" + a 215/50 sidewall. This has nothing to do with being an I6, or an I4, or power, or torque, or anything else except gear ratios. Like I mentioned earlier, a Corolla (I4, ~130? HP) w/ a 4-speed auto turns 2500RPM @70mph (and it'd be nice if I could).

rb1

I was just suggesting that the gearing in the TSX seems very similar to other MT cars of comparable weight and engine output.

AT cars with 4 (and especially 5 gears) almost invariably have taller gearing than the corresponding MT, but they also offer very little acceleration capability in their top gear either and will almost always downshift if even moderate additional throttle pressure is applied. (The main reason I despise them, actually).

dom

I was reading this over at the CanadianDriver.ca Forums. Has anyone ever heard of what this guy is talking about?