MoFocker

Ive searched a ton of forums, including this one... Can anyone tell me exactly what driving habbits cause a clutch to burn out?

iamhomin

when you excessively ride the clutch and when you even slightly depress the clutch while in gear.

gfxdave99

So basically you need to make sure you are using the dead pedal to the left?

Lung Fu Mo Shi

Clutch pad wear occurs when the clutch is "half way" in. In other words, things slip and rub against the clutch pad.

Clutch bearing wear is when you have the clutch all the way in for extended periods.

NeoChaser

how long should the oem cloutch last? on average?
i know it varies with w/ ppl and the way they drive..

Lung Fu Mo Shi

Between 60K and 120K usually. 90K is about average.

Dan Martin

Something else to avoid: using the clutch to hold you stationary on a hill instead of the brakes.

bob shiftright

I've NEVER had a clutch disc actually wear out. It's always been "other stuff", like the pilot bearing, slave cylinder, clutch rubber center or a main seal drenching the clutch with oil. While everything is apart it's prudent to replace the disc since the clutch parts are just a few hundered bucks more.

Currently with 135,000 on my T5 Volvo's clutch. (No, I'm not betting the TSX clutch will last that long.)

tuan209

what do you mean by "riding the clutch?"

Johnny_RENAMED

Tuan........riding the clutch is when you don't let it up quickly enough and kinda hold it half way to get going. Just remember this tip....................There are two places for a clutch.....all the way up ...or all the way down. No in between!

KJLite

for once i agree with dan, lol, jk dan. see our other interaction.

this is the worst thing you can do. most people will do this cause the hardest thing to do is accelerate smoothly from a dead stop on an incline.

just practice man, and you'll be able to start without stalling. worst case, you chirp the tires and send old women running.

basically don't feather the clutch for long periods of time. as someone else put it, the clutch should be in or out, no in between, unless starting smoothly from stop, in which case the 0.5 sec of riding the clutch will not cause much wear at 1000 rpms.

enjoy working the 6 spd.

slats

Also people, remember to Double-Clutch. It saves your tranny synchros in the long run and reduces wear on your 6-spd.

Slats

Dan Martin

Oh God, not this discussion again!

ClutchPerformer

fdl

What about downshifting? That puts alot of wear and tear on the clutch. Especially if you downshift at high rpms. Double-clutching is to save your syncros, AFAIK simply rev matching will save your clutch when downshifting.

MoFocker

Ok well all this information is helpful... Ive been looking for awhile and didnt think id actually get a decent answer. Thanks!

When i drive, I dont ever sit at a stop with the clutch down, I always leave it in neutral and go into first when its time to go... When its time to go, i do give it a little gas while holding the clutch so as not to buck-out... Is that ok? I never thought it was a problem before reading all your comments... Also, I use and have always used the clutch to switch into Neutral... Is it true your not supposed to do that and your supposed to just move the shifter into N by itself? If so, fill me in on more because Ive obviously been out of the loop since i learned to drive...

iamhomin

depressing the clutch all the way in while in gear is the same as the shifter being in the N zone

RogerPodacter

i think what he is asking if its ok to take the car out of gear with out pressing the clutch. i always press the clutch in to take it out of gear...but if its extra wear and tear than maybe i'll change my habits.

DEVO

not true, but the effect is the same. in one case the transmission shaft (forgot actual name) still spins at the same speed of the engine (input shaft?). with the "clutch all the way in", the transmission shaft doesn't spin at all.

MoFocker

ok soooooooooo does that mean YES its ok to pop it in neutral without depressing the clutch, or NO its not ok to pop it in neutral without depressing the clutch?

I get lost when people start taking the subject in 3 different directions...

When I start out, i do give it a little gas with the clutch still pushed in half way before i let it completely up... Thats how ive always driven shift... Is that bad to do?

xizor

Same thing I do. I'd like to know if anyone could do it differently. Would be near impossible to have a smooth start w/o some touch.

I think the important thing is not to hold the clutch in that mid level position like one might do to keep from rolling back on a hill. A shift from stop->1 takes only a fraction of a sec.

MoFocker

I know... exactly... Im not talking about keeping the clutch in and holding the cars position on a hill or holding it in at a light... Im talking about starting out and giving it some gas before the clutch is fully let out.. I never thought that was a bad thing, but from what im gathering here is that its horrible and one of the worst thing syou can do... And what about the shifting into N question I had...?
Thanks again guys.

RogerPodacter

heheh i hear you with your "3 different directions" comment. people answer a completely different question than what was asked.

I dont think its bad to pop out of gear without pushing the clutch. but for some reason i dont ever do it like that. i usually press the clutch anyway.

as for starting out in first, what you do is pretty much what i do. just remember that the less amount of time you are "slipping" the clutch the better. i rev to about 1.5 K rpms and blend the cllutch and gas, usually only for a second at most. then i am off in 1st gear...

MoFocker

thanks You should write a sticky for this forum on how to properly answer the question upfront! you go!

DEVO

One way to exaggerate the effect of slipping so that anybody can understand is to go to an empty, long, and flat parking lot. At a complete stop, put the car into first and attempt to take off WITHOUT touching the gas. Once you get good you should be able to get the car rolling without any problems and do so within a second or 2 (amount of clutch time). Same drill, now try to launch the car in 4th gear (or higher). You will find that now you have to ride the clutch more in order to get the car going.

DEVO

The answer is yes and no. If you know what you are doing then you can shift gears or go to neutral (while moving) without ever using the clutch. I highly recommend that you do not try this unless you understand the mechanics behind this.

So I would answer NO, it's not ok to shift to neutral without using the clutch. Regardless of what gear or neutral, always use the clutch. And if you want to get fancy, slats can show you how to double clutch. Another technique for saving the transmission.

DEVO

On a hill, you should use the ebrakes if you are not quick with your feet.

Giving the car gas before the clutch is fully let out is correct when trying to get moving from a stop. See my above post on how to accomplish this without giving the car additional gas.

Read above for the shifting into N.

Dan Martin

Practicing in parking lot is definitely the way to do it Devo. But it sounds like people are a little too woried about clutch wear.

The clutch is there for a reason folks!

It's designed to slip and relieve stress on the transmission when you are changing gears. Certainly you should minimize the amount of time that you are slipping the clutch and you shouldn't apply power until the clutch is fully engaged but sidestepping the clutch or making a jerky start will do far more harm than a little slip.

DEVO

Dan,

Well said. This is a wear item and it will last a long time if properly treated... and by that I mean "normal" usage.

Some do's and dont's

Normal wear:

Starting from a stop position, reving (1.5k-2k rpms) the engine and letting out the clutch smoothly (within a second or so).

From a stop on a hill... use the ebrake (unless you know how to do this with quick feet.) to hold your position. Rev engine and slowly let out clutch while also releasing ebrake.

While moving. Changing gears with minimal time on the clutch... enough to select gear... and release. The following are not needed but will extend the life. You can rev match gear shits (up and down shifts). You can double clutch gear changes (up and down).

NOT NORMAL WEAR:

From a stop position. Rev the engine beyond 4k and slowly let out the clutch.
From a stop position. Rev the engine beyond 4k and pop the clutch.

From a stop on a hill... keep car from moving backwards using the clutch and not the brakes... very bad.

While moving... ride the clutch by leaving foot on the clutch pedal... this may seem like you are not doing anything but you are. The clutch is engaged ever so slightly. Don't do it.

While moving... changing gears and slowly engaging the clutch.

Dan Martin

Devo, you've got it. This thread should be sticky and change the title to "How to drive a MT car".

ClutchPerformer

You mean like this one?

Edit: I know I'm a little late, but I feel I should weigh in about the shifting to neutral thing. There's not actually a lot of wear that happens when you push the clutch pedal DOWN (as long as you don't press it down slow or something--I don't see why you would). So even if you use the pedal to shift to neutral every time, which I recommend, there's no problem. Letting the pedal back UP is where your concern should be. Enjoy.

Dan Martin

Oops! I never actually browse the forums, I just check for new posts so I didn't know that existed!

ClutchPerformer

It's cool. I just remember that thread because it was so fun and informative!

tuan209

ive had my tsx for 2 weeks and this is my first manual. anyhow i can drive it pretty well, but sometimes when i shift into 2nd it kinda jerks. any advice?

DEVO

please give us your RPM reading when you are chaning out of 1st. are you pressing the gas prior to shifting into 2nd? how long are you holding the clutch pedal in while changing gears. details.

tuan209

i shift around 3k. i usually press the clutch, let go, then hit the gas.

DEVO

sounds right... try shifting at a higher rpm... say close to 4k.

ClutchPerformer

And try waiting longer before letting the clutch out.