'06 Dyno Posted at TOV
#1
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'06 Dyno Posted at TOV
Hey guys, Jeff posted up the dyno of the 5AT TSX
http://vtec.net/articles/view-article?article_id=453644
they only got it up to 6600RPMs unfortunately
anybody think they can superimpose an '04/'05 dyno over that one?
http://vtec.net/articles/view-article?article_id=453644
they only got it up to 6600RPMs unfortunately
anybody think they can superimpose an '04/'05 dyno over that one?
#2
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Can't wait to see a 6mt dyno but that looks good. After vtec is noticeably strong with the 06 which should help considerably.
I think most 04-05 5ats on dynojets hit around 160whp so an extra 10-15 ponies is very significant
I think most 04-05 5ats on dynojets hit around 160whp so an extra 10-15 ponies is very significant
#4
Team Owner
Originally Posted by Jeff at TOV
We've been waiting anxiously to once again try out Acura's TSX, which is the recipient of several upgrades. Of course the most significant change to us are the revisions to the motor, which are described as follows:
On the intake side of the TSX engine, the diameter of both the throttle body and the intake duct were enlarged to increase induction flow rate from 95 liters per second to 110 liters per second. In addition the diameter and shape of the intake valve were enhanced to help increase intake flow by 16 percent and the high RPM cam profile for the intake cam was modified to provide increased intake valve lift and duration. In addition, a ventilation passage was machined into the engine block to reduce pumping friction by increasing air flow between cylinders.
Engine code remains K24A2
All this is said to result in only a 5hp increase, but don't forget that due to the recent revisions to the SAE J1349 testing standard, almost all Acura and Honda motors horspower and torque have been revised downward for 2006 so the actual improvement over last year's motor is said to be actually 10hp.
The first 2006 TSX press loaner just became available here in Atlanta, so I jumped at the opportunity to check it out. Unfortunately, this is also the first 5AT TSX that's been in the press fleet here, so we don't have any basis for comparison on our dyno run. There are currently no 6-speed '06s here yet, but we're going to try to get our hands on one in the next month or so.
I took the car over to Dynolab in Marietta, GA, where Arthur strapped it to the rollers which we subsequently spun to 145mph.
We're pretty sure that the strange loop shown in the dyno plot is the point where the torque converter finally locked up. It's a little strange that it didn't happen until nearly redline, and you can see that below that point the slippage of the torque converter was costing the car some power and torque. Inside the car, it was strange as well because I've never felt a car lose rpms at full throttle on a dynojet before. Perhaps there's some trickery going on with the drive by wire which momentarily cuts the throttle as the torque converter locks, in an effort to disguise that event to the driver and passengers. Obviously, the false peak of 180hp must be thrown away as it's clearly an artifact of this step, but after the torque converter locked up this car put down a pretty healthy peak power of 175hp. On the road it feels quite nice - much better than the '05 TSX, which had a very subtle benefit from VTEC. On my own '04 TSX baseline dyno, if you compare the difference in the power level at 6000 rpms (just as the VTEC switches over) and at the car's peak (in VTEC), it's only about 20hp. On this '06, the difference is roughly double that, at a little over 40hp! This can very obviously be felt on the road and it gives the '06 that sense of urgency and a bit of an added high-rpm thrill that's lacking on the '04 and '05 TSX. Though the rev limiter has been raised to 7300 rpms on the '06, it's still not enough - particularly since the car now pulls more strongly up top, it feels like it could use another 500 or so rpms.
Conclusions
Overall, I like the improvements to the K24A2 (it's still labeled that, by the way) for '06 and I can't wait to try out the 6MT version. We're hoping it puts down 10-15 more hp at the wheels than the 5AT version. With a few bolt on mods such as a 4-2-1 header (the '06 appears to use the same design as the '04 and '05) and a cold air intake, it wouldn't surprise me if the '06 is capable of over 200whp. And if Hondata can successfully reprogram the '06's ECU, then we might even see another 10hp or so of peak power and a healthy dose of added midrange.
On the intake side of the TSX engine, the diameter of both the throttle body and the intake duct were enlarged to increase induction flow rate from 95 liters per second to 110 liters per second. In addition the diameter and shape of the intake valve were enhanced to help increase intake flow by 16 percent and the high RPM cam profile for the intake cam was modified to provide increased intake valve lift and duration. In addition, a ventilation passage was machined into the engine block to reduce pumping friction by increasing air flow between cylinders.
Engine code remains K24A2
All this is said to result in only a 5hp increase, but don't forget that due to the recent revisions to the SAE J1349 testing standard, almost all Acura and Honda motors horspower and torque have been revised downward for 2006 so the actual improvement over last year's motor is said to be actually 10hp.
The first 2006 TSX press loaner just became available here in Atlanta, so I jumped at the opportunity to check it out. Unfortunately, this is also the first 5AT TSX that's been in the press fleet here, so we don't have any basis for comparison on our dyno run. There are currently no 6-speed '06s here yet, but we're going to try to get our hands on one in the next month or so.
I took the car over to Dynolab in Marietta, GA, where Arthur strapped it to the rollers which we subsequently spun to 145mph.
We're pretty sure that the strange loop shown in the dyno plot is the point where the torque converter finally locked up. It's a little strange that it didn't happen until nearly redline, and you can see that below that point the slippage of the torque converter was costing the car some power and torque. Inside the car, it was strange as well because I've never felt a car lose rpms at full throttle on a dynojet before. Perhaps there's some trickery going on with the drive by wire which momentarily cuts the throttle as the torque converter locks, in an effort to disguise that event to the driver and passengers. Obviously, the false peak of 180hp must be thrown away as it's clearly an artifact of this step, but after the torque converter locked up this car put down a pretty healthy peak power of 175hp. On the road it feels quite nice - much better than the '05 TSX, which had a very subtle benefit from VTEC. On my own '04 TSX baseline dyno, if you compare the difference in the power level at 6000 rpms (just as the VTEC switches over) and at the car's peak (in VTEC), it's only about 20hp. On this '06, the difference is roughly double that, at a little over 40hp! This can very obviously be felt on the road and it gives the '06 that sense of urgency and a bit of an added high-rpm thrill that's lacking on the '04 and '05 TSX. Though the rev limiter has been raised to 7300 rpms on the '06, it's still not enough - particularly since the car now pulls more strongly up top, it feels like it could use another 500 or so rpms.
Conclusions
Overall, I like the improvements to the K24A2 (it's still labeled that, by the way) for '06 and I can't wait to try out the 6MT version. We're hoping it puts down 10-15 more hp at the wheels than the 5AT version. With a few bolt on mods such as a 4-2-1 header (the '06 appears to use the same design as the '04 and '05) and a cold air intake, it wouldn't surprise me if the '06 is capable of over 200whp. And if Hondata can successfully reprogram the '06's ECU, then we might even see another 10hp or so of peak power and a healthy dose of added midrange.
Interesting. This is the first I've heard of the rev limiter being increased to 7300
#5
Photography Nerd
Originally Posted by z-tec
wow, those numbers at the wheel are so much lower than the SAE ratings.
torque never touched 140 i believe...
can't wait to see the 6MT numbers...
torque never touched 140 i believe...
can't wait to see the 6MT numbers...
#7
Instructor
Originally Posted by Dan Martin
The new SAE ratings still only show horsepower at the crank, wheel horsepower will always be lower due to driveline losses.
sure, but i never really knew it was that much...just surprised me a bit.
(i don't think i ever checked out the dyno run they did on the '04...)
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#10
Three Wheelin'
iTrader: (1)
Originally Posted by jlukja
Overall a very positive review for you current and future 06 AT owners.
Interesting. This is the first I've heard of the rev limiter being increased to 7300
Interesting. This is the first I've heard of the rev limiter being increased to 7300
I thought the rev limiter was always at 7300rpm even for 04 and 05's?? The redline on the other hand, is at 7100rpm
#11
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Originally Posted by supraken
I thought the rev limiter was always at 7300rpm even for 04 and 05's?? The redline on the other hand, is at 7100rpm
#12
Team Owner
Originally Posted by supraken
I thought the rev limiter was always at 7300rpm even for 04 and 05's?? The redline on the other hand, is at 7100rpm
#14
Senior Moderator
04/05 AT's were putting down ~160 but I don't think we saw an 04/05 AT dyno on Dynojet before so its hard to compare.
Either way, very impressive. Looks like its at minimum an added 10HP to the wheels which is very impressive. You can expect 6MT to be putting down 185 and like Jeff said over 200 with mods
Either way, very impressive. Looks like its at minimum an added 10HP to the wheels which is very impressive. You can expect 6MT to be putting down 185 and like Jeff said over 200 with mods
#17
Originally Posted by dom
04/05 AT's were putting down ~160 but I don't think we saw an 04/05 AT dyno on Dynojet before so its hard to compare.
Either way, very impressive. Looks like its at minimum an added 10HP to the wheels which is very impressive. You can expect 6MT to be putting down 185 and like Jeff said over 200 with mods
Either way, very impressive. Looks like its at minimum an added 10HP to the wheels which is very impressive. You can expect 6MT to be putting down 185 and like Jeff said over 200 with mods
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Originally Posted by Newplay1
what are thoses loopie-loops at peak power kinda funny looking dyno.
#25
Originally Posted by madmanmax3000
anybody think they can superimpose an '04/'05 dyno over that one?
Originally Posted by STL
I second that.
2004 - 2006 5-speed AT Comparison
Taken from this 2004 dyno
#26
Originally Posted by promax
The dynos are different, but here's my crappy attempt:
2004 - 2006 5-speed AT Comparison
Taken from this 2004 dyno
2004 - 2006 5-speed AT Comparison
Taken from this 2004 dyno
I've been waiting for the 2006 dyno for ever. The steep spike at vtec is exactly what I was missing on pervious YM.
However , the nice jump in pover seems to come at the expense of medium range power. As Jeff said the vtec makes a jump of 40HP, but it starts at about 135 HP opposed to around 150 in previous years.
Also the torque seems to be a lot lower in low and mid range, the bonus being that it doesn't drop like before right after vtec.
I vouldn't mind these if shifting at 7200RPM wouldn't drop you out of vtec range. Is it possible to stay in vtec by shifting at red line if one has extremly quick shifts?
Now we need to see a 2006 MT on the dyno. Looks promising. Maybe there is a four door replacement for my Prelude after all.
#27
Very nice. Tangible differences between the 04/05's.
A few thoughts.
Can't wait to see 6 speed numbers.
The '06 possibly may not be broken in yet so it could put out slightly better numbers.
Why was max hp/tq measured at 7k, when higher numbers were available at 6700 rpm for torque.
At about 6700 rpm, it was putting out 135 ft-lbs.
Factoring a 15% drivetrain loss at 164 ft-lbs should yield about 140 ft-lbs at the wheels.
A few thoughts.
Can't wait to see 6 speed numbers.
The '06 possibly may not be broken in yet so it could put out slightly better numbers.
Why was max hp/tq measured at 7k, when higher numbers were available at 6700 rpm for torque.
At about 6700 rpm, it was putting out 135 ft-lbs.
Factoring a 15% drivetrain loss at 164 ft-lbs should yield about 140 ft-lbs at the wheels.
#28
The dyno plots aren't consistent with what people are reporting though. Or the other way around I suppose. Aren't people saying the 06 feels like it has more low end pull?
#29
First US '06 TSX on board
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Looks like the Vtec crossover point could be lower.
Does something like this work?:
http://urbanimport.com/xcart/custome...cat=300&page=1
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