xray328

So we bought an '08 RDX that we found out had been in an accident a few weeks after we bought it.

We first noticed a few rattles and squeeks. A few days later, we took it to our Honda store because the drivers side headlight was misaligned. He said he couldn't adjust the light and to him it looked like it had been in an accident.

I had it looked at by a local body shop that told me that they could realign the drivers quarter panel and replace the headlight for $1000 (headlight is $750).

Since it was advertised as an accident free vehicle, I immediately took it to the place I bought it (A Ford store) and they refused to buy it back. They only offered to give me trade in value for it towards a cheaper car (a prior rental 2011 Kia Sorento with 29k miles in this case) while keeping my loan the same. I've since contacted the BBB and Illinois Attorney General. I've been going back and forth with the BBB and all the dealer keeps saying is that the car had a clean carfax and they tried to trade me out of the Acura - at a huge loss, which of course they aren't admitting to.

I took it over there today, and spoke to the body guy. He said the roof is buckled, every panel except the hatch has been repainted, the weld on the drivers strut tower is cracked, the lip on the bumper is glued on (should be clipped on), almost every panel has gaps (small at the bottom of the door and gets larger as you go up to the top for instance), and the cross member was twisted so he had to beat on it to get the radiator to sit flush.

I'm hoping the Attorney General can help. But in case they can't, what do I do with this POS? Do I trade it and play dumb about the damages? If I admit to the prior accident how much of a hit am I going to take in value?

What would you guys do???

Thanks in advance!

jr-type-R

check if the panels have labels all modern cars have them if it doesn't have the side panel labels you could easily go to a lawyer and he'll clarify that the vehicle was in an accident and if they refuse to take the vehicle back you could easily sue the dealer for the vehicles cost (No more than that)

holefoods

wow this suck$. i guess if i were you, id press it with the AG. ive been lurkng around here for a bit, another person threatened his dealership (smail acura, if i recall right) with posting a website about this frivolous dealership and even have a billboard about it. if what you have found out is indeed the case (eg. car was in accident), this ford dealer is eff'd so long as you pursue the case.

if it's too much of a hassle, then yes, i guess take the loss and move on. it's a matter of how much time you're willing to dedicate.

ADD

Since you know about the prior damage, I don't think you can play dumb about it. But, it's time to get the opinion of an attorney. A vehicle advertised as accident free with the amount of damage you listed is false advertising in my book. Have you got copies of the ad, whether print ad or on the internet? If not, I would get them now.

xray328

I honestly thought about a billboard, but I wasn't sure if I could get sued by the dealership for libel.

I'm guessing 98% of the time the customer gives up in these cases, so it's to the dealers advantage to try to stall.

I'm ready to drive the darn thing through the showroom window.

DJ Iceman

I guess I just disagree with your thread title. It's not a POS RDX, it's a POS dealer that sold you something other than what was promised (which happened to be an RDX).

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

all cars do, BUT on some of them, they are hidden behind the interior door panel, so not easily viewable





as far as OP, did you ever have the vehicle checked out BEFORE you had bought it, probably could have revealed some of the issues before you had ever bought it, and been in this situation


you might be able to get them for false advertising, and i would say that is about it

Dymondawg

Take it to Carmax up in Kenosha and play dumb. I've seen them take back an '01 Saturn sedan that leaked oil for $1k less a year after it was purchased (bought for $9k, sold back for $8k one year later). Granted, that happened 6 years ago, and maybe they're better now than they were back then... Still, not saying that you should pay this kind of crap forward, but you may just be screwed in all this otherwise.

xray328

I don't know about that, this particular RDX is a POS. The RDX in itself is a fine vehicle, just not this one.

If you saw the damages, you'd say "geez, what a POS RDX".

xray328

Yeah, I can tell them "It has a clean carfax" like the dealer told me. I ran a KBB on it (for what that's worth) and even with accident history (up to $3500 in damages) it still books at $19,300. I'm not sure that this was fixed properly though.

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

, x2

xray328

I still don't think so.

Yes, the dealership is a POS. But they sold me a POS damaged car.

POS - any object, person, or other existing thing that works incorrectly, is too expensive, or just plain sucks.

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

maybe, but by the way it sounds though, you never even had the vehicle checked out before hand (by an independent shop, or a completely unrelated dealer, yuou would have been out roughly $100 and moved on to another vehicle), which more then likely had caught the damage, so you would not have even bought it in the first place (and more then likely the vehicle is "clean" when you do a carfax on it; which is probably what the salespeople went off of)

xray328

Actually, the local Honda store did do a "used car inspection" on it for $110 (1 hour labor). They said it needed an air filter and the brake fluid changed otherwise it was solid.

I spoke to them after finding all this damage and they said they don't check that type of stuff, its a mechanical inspection only. They said a body shop would of had to check it for collision damage.

IMHO, the selling dealership should of done more than just check the carfax. As I'm sure you know (and I do know) that the carfax is worthless. If it shows something great, but if it doesn't, that doesn't mean anything. A carfax is just for "warm fuzzies". Its a marketing tool for the dealership.

And when I did bring the car back to them they should of done more to resolve the issue. The only thing they did was to offer me trade-in for it and put me into a used $17,000 Kia for my original loan amount of $22k.

xray328

But anyway, back to the original question, what do I do with this thing now?

xray328

It has the tag on 2 of the four doors, but it looks strange. The tag on my '04 Accord has two "H" honda symbols on it. The tags on the Acura have repeating lines of "HM" on them and no Honda symbols. Can anyone confirm what yours has?

Mr Marco

^Don't listen to this idiot. A clean CarFax is not a guarantee of anything. However, I would spend a grand and get a lawyer to write them a letter asking them to trade for a car of equal value (what you owe). Sometimes even just the threat of legal action is enough to motivate people to do the right thing. If the car was advertised as "accident free" you have a case and they would be smart to settle for a fair trade (not a KIA). Maybe you could get them to trade for another car with three letters...BMW X3?

wrestrepo

I stand to be corrected, but doesn't Carfax buy back the cars if they have been in an accident that doesn't show in the report? For the sound of it, it was a pretty good hit, so I think that there has to be some record of it.

Also, who's the loan with? what's in the loan documents? does it say that the car is clean?
Who paid Honda for the inspection? you or the dealer? if you, you are probably screwed, unless you can prove that the dealer sold you a car with known damage and they didn't disclose it...key word, prove.

xray328

I just don't trust these guys, they really are the epitome of used car salesmen. Open collars, gold chains, snotty attitude. When I tried to return the car they literally laughed at me.

They did show me a 2007 Infinity FX35. But it had 57k miles, the entire interior handle assembly was missing from the rear hatch, the salesman couldn't get the key to work (keyless fob) and the thing smelled like a body shop.

But even with that they said it would cost me $3-$4k more than the Acura.

The other option they gave was to sign over my 2005 Accord and they'd "let me" walk away from the Acura.

As a final attempt to screw us over (again), they offered us a used 2010 Odyssey from another dealer in the auto park for $38k. The MSRP on a brand new one is $34k.

When we bought it they tried to tell me $199 Window Etching was mandatory and required by the finance companies they use. Then they tried to slip in a $2500 service contract on the final paperwork. When I asked them what the $2500 charge was for "ESP" they claimed it was an accident because the computer automatically puts it on there.

Like I said these guys are just sleazy.

xray328

Nope. Carfax buys a car back only if it has a branded title (salvaged) that itsn't reported on the carfax....that's it.

The loans with Bank of America.

I paid Honda for the inspection.

The "proving it" part is where I'm probably stuck. MAYBE I can claim negligence since they sold the car as "accident free" without doing an inspection for body damage. From what I hear the Illinois AG HATES used car dealers, so maybe I'll get help from them.

On the latest BBB rebuttal the dealership said that I filed a written complaint with the Illinois Attorney General and they would advise the BBB of the outcome.

Mr Marco

Talk to BofA (with a hypothetical). Otherwise it sounds like you need a lawyer. These guys sound like shitbags!

xray328

You have no idea.

wrestrepo

Here is a thought, is there a TV News near you that has a consumer protection segment? call them up. If this happened to you the way you say, I doubt that you are the only one.

XIS

Dealer is the POS - totally agree.
If the damages are that obvious to the average buyer, why didn't you notice any before you bought it?

?

I would be going up the ladder as high as I could, with something in writing from a shop with a good reputation related to the prior accident and their inspection results. I would also get a copy to someone important at BofA and ask if they can assist since they put up the money...

wrestrepo

Another question, wouldn't you get your loan forgiven if you return the car to BoA? I know that there are probably some "consequences" to that in your credit, but that's another idea.

mrgold35

Have you thought about calling the local newspaper or TV stations about the problem? We have "Bob Barker" a local TV reporter that loves to investigate shady government officials and local businesses. This guy scares the crap out of people when he is at the front door with a crew with cameras and satellite van.

It wouldn’t hurt to contact the TV station and there might be other complaints about the dealership.

XLR8R

Wow, there's a lot of red warning flags there. :shakehead

Anyway, the CarFax shows a clean title so the accident repair was done without reporting the VIN -- probably by a dealer. How did the seller represent the "accident free" condition? Do you have something specific in writing? Sales agreement? Or did they simply use the CarFax to suggest this?

If you have something specific stating that the vehicle was sold "accident free" (other than the CarFax) you may be able to make a case against the seller using the condition of the doors/panels and especially the missing/non-matching VIN stickers on those panels.

As for the local news-team "crusader"; those guys usually don't dare go after any organization big enough to fend for itself, that employs lots of locals, or more importantly, big enough to buy advertising -- such as a large new car dealership.

Otherwise, from your perspective; the car has never been in an accident. There's no record of it. The CarFax is clean. Trade it in and take the hit -- a little older and wiser. (Just don't sell it privately.)

ps. Taking it to the local Honda dealer for a pre-purchase inspection wasn't likely to reveal much. They knew where it came from. Those two dealers aren't going to piss in each others Cheerios.

nj2pa2nc

I do not know about other dealers but when I traded in my cars they made me sign a paper that stated the car was not in a accident. If I lied I would be liable. They did not have to worry-even told them that someone backed into one of my cars. (showed them the pictures of the damage-(nothing major) before it was fixed.

xray328

I considered just leaving the car in the dealership driveway with the keys in it. BUt I know they'll just have it towed then it'd be repossessed by the bank who would sell it at auction and come after me for the difference.

Just not the best choice.

If I just return the car to B of A, that's called a voluntary repossession, which is still a repo and affects my credit the same way.

I'd be better off selling it to carmax.

I think in the end, I'm just going to wait for the Attorney General and if nothing pans out from that I'm going to trade it on an '08-'09 Odyssey Touring.

Every time I see the "A" Acura symbol I just cringe. The entire experience has left me sour towards Acura products, although I know it's not Acura's fault and in no way represents the quality of their products. I just been a terrible experience.

wrestrepo

I am thinking about the last resort.....and that is that you don't want to keep the car, do you?
BTW, this is not an Acura experience given the fact you got it from a Ford dealer.
If you can sell it to Carmax, go for it, I would think they would be more careful about checking a car they are buying....
SEriously, check out the local new, they can be a lot of help....

jr-type-R

You just answered your own doubt probably the owner of that dealer buys reposesed vehicles with damage probably has a bodyshop who fixes them up and then sells the vehicles.Try to get a lawyer to help you on this case is the best thing you could do and don't forget 110 of labor in acura claim that.

XLR8R

Do you have any contractual paperwork that states the car is "accident free" ?

Even if you don't, you should be able to demonstrate that the car is a rebuilt wreck. The buckled roof and cracked weld on the strut mount are safety issues and would be a mis-representation by the dealer if they didn't disclose them.

This isn't a Lemon Law case but a Lemon attorney might be able to direct you to the resources you need.

xray328

No, unfortunately I don't have any contractual paperwork on the accident free part. They referred heavily to the clean carfax and told me point blank that the car had never been in an accident.

Obviously we will be much more careful next time.

From what I hear, the AG makes dealers backup the carfax report (if the carfax says it's never been in an accident, it better of never been in an accident) , so hopefully that will work in our favor. I sent the AG another letter today with all the new damages I've found on the car.

I'll keep you posted.

MyTL09

iTrader: (4)

^^ what ford dealer did u buy it from in Illinois?

xray328

Sutton Ford
Matteson, IL.

www.suttonford.com

XLR8R

I believe verbal assurances can be considered contractual as well. You should certainly force them to acknowledge this to the AG.

ps. It wouldn't by any chance be silver, would it?

xray328

So the AG never did anything.

We traded the RDX in last night on a 2008 Chrysler Aspen Limited.

They gave me what we paid for it as a trade-in.

Thanks for all the help along the way.

wrestrepo

wow, can't say that I like that outcome....how long before the next buyer is telling the same story on this board....

SinCity

I believe the opposite may have happened. When a car goes to a dealer, a VIN is used and everything is recorded unless they took a vehicle in knowingly they are going to resell it, then they do not use a VIN and write the estimate without it.

xray328

Besides having it crushed, there's not a whole lot you can do with it. It was in an accident and it was repaired. Just not very well. There are thousands of vehicles in the same condition out there.

I think it was safe to drive, it just had all kinds of rattles and cosmetic issues.