Opinions on 'cutting losses'
11-25-2015, 09:23 PM
#1
Opinions on 'cutting losses'
So I bought an 05 6spd back in 2013 on wholesale for ~$10K and I'm fairly frustrated with it today
So far I've spent close to $4K in parts and repairs since then; including rear brakes, the e-brake, timing belt (3x), the 105k service, clutch, drive shaft, steering rack, and just today; the front Brembo brakes.
The person before me neglected the car. And you're probably wondering why i bought the car with so many issues? Well, I had no idea there were so many; the dealer had a sticker on it and it test drove just fine. From what I remember, it was also a decent amount under book.
Now, the only things I didn't do myself were the clutch, drive shaft, and rack; since all that stuff was more accessible during the clutch job. So I think I've saved a bit of money on labor by doing my own work.
But anyway; my wife suggested dumping the car to cut our losses; but should I?
Now that all that stuff has been or will be replaced; what else could go wrong? The car is $200 away from being paid off, insurance is fairly low. Am I wasting more money here by keeping it?
The thing is 10 going on 11 years old with 133K. But based on Acuraziners, people can get up to 200k+. On Acura's sight someone is in the 500K range.
What are peoples thoughts and insights on this; I'd love to hear them. Either way, I think im stickin with it; unless some one has a very compelling reason to replace it with another car that is not the TL. And chances are good the wife won't buy off on another luxury car; I have a feeling it would be an older 4cyl Accord, just so I can get a manual.
So far I've spent close to $4K in parts and repairs since then; including rear brakes, the e-brake, timing belt (3x), the 105k service, clutch, drive shaft, steering rack, and just today; the front Brembo brakes.
The person before me neglected the car. And you're probably wondering why i bought the car with so many issues? Well, I had no idea there were so many; the dealer had a sticker on it and it test drove just fine. From what I remember, it was also a decent amount under book.
Now, the only things I didn't do myself were the clutch, drive shaft, and rack; since all that stuff was more accessible during the clutch job. So I think I've saved a bit of money on labor by doing my own work.
But anyway; my wife suggested dumping the car to cut our losses; but should I?
Now that all that stuff has been or will be replaced; what else could go wrong? The car is $200 away from being paid off, insurance is fairly low. Am I wasting more money here by keeping it?
The thing is 10 going on 11 years old with 133K. But based on Acuraziners, people can get up to 200k+. On Acura's sight someone is in the 500K range.
What are peoples thoughts and insights on this; I'd love to hear them. Either way, I think im stickin with it; unless some one has a very compelling reason to replace it with another car that is not the TL. And chances are good the wife won't buy off on another luxury car; I have a feeling it would be an older 4cyl Accord, just so I can get a manual.
11-25-2015, 10:55 PM
#2
Sounds like a bit of badluck esp with the way the previous owner treated the car. . . Brake Pads, rotors, tires, 105k service, all new fluids are expected on a 10 year old 100k+ mile car. Not sure why the timing belt was done 3 times or the drive shaft unless it was in an accident. It's not weird for clutches to go out either. The tl is a pretty solid car. Sounds like you fixed most of the problems tho. If you keep up with preventative maintenance the car will last 200k. I'd keep it after fixing all those issues.
Last edited by mvp2765; 11-25-2015 at 10:58 PM.
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11-25-2015, 11:08 PM
#3
So I bought an 05 6spd back in 2013 on wholesale for ~$10K and I'm fairly frustrated with it today
So far I've spent close to $4K in parts and repairs since then; including rear brakes, the e-brake, timing belt (3x), the 105k service, clutch, drive shaft, steering rack, and just today; the front Brembo brakes.
The person before me neglected the car. And you're probably wondering why i bought the car with so many issues? Well, I had no idea there were so many; the dealer had a sticker on it and it test drove just fine. From what I remember, it was also a decent amount under book.
Now, the only things I didn't do myself were the clutch, drive shaft, and rack; since all that stuff was more accessible during the clutch job. So I think I've saved a bit of money on labor by doing my own work.
But anyway; my wife suggested dumping the car to cut our losses; but should I?
Now that all that stuff has been or will be replaced; what else could go wrong? The car is $200 away from being paid off, insurance is fairly low. Am I wasting more money here by keeping it?
The thing is 10 going on 11 years old with 133K. But based on Acuraziners, people can get up to 200k+. On Acura's sight someone is in the 500K range.
What are peoples thoughts and insights on this; I'd love to hear them. Either way, I think im stickin with it; unless some one has a very compelling reason to replace it with another car that is not the TL. And chances are good the wife won't buy off on another luxury car; I have a feeling it would be an older 4cyl Accord, just so I can get a manual.
So far I've spent close to $4K in parts and repairs since then; including rear brakes, the e-brake, timing belt (3x), the 105k service, clutch, drive shaft, steering rack, and just today; the front Brembo brakes.
The person before me neglected the car. And you're probably wondering why i bought the car with so many issues? Well, I had no idea there were so many; the dealer had a sticker on it and it test drove just fine. From what I remember, it was also a decent amount under book.
Now, the only things I didn't do myself were the clutch, drive shaft, and rack; since all that stuff was more accessible during the clutch job. So I think I've saved a bit of money on labor by doing my own work.
But anyway; my wife suggested dumping the car to cut our losses; but should I?
Now that all that stuff has been or will be replaced; what else could go wrong? The car is $200 away from being paid off, insurance is fairly low. Am I wasting more money here by keeping it?
The thing is 10 going on 11 years old with 133K. But based on Acuraziners, people can get up to 200k+. On Acura's sight someone is in the 500K range.
What are peoples thoughts and insights on this; I'd love to hear them. Either way, I think im stickin with it; unless some one has a very compelling reason to replace it with another car that is not the TL. And chances are good the wife won't buy off on another luxury car; I have a feeling it would be an older 4cyl Accord, just so I can get a manual.
11-25-2015, 11:42 PM
#4
Fearless DIY Guy
iTrader: (2)
I'd estimate you're still $1k to $2.5k in the red before being in safe territory. Your motor mounts are likely shot as well as the control arm bushings, but that's deffer able work. Your PS pump seals are shot, period, and it's luck of the draw on how well that holds, as it's held well for many. At this age the PCV should have been replaced, which is a cheap one. Minor chance the HFL will crap out or the MAP sensor will fail as it has for a good number of us. Outside of these issues...you 'should' be in the clear for a long, long time.
Let's say you get another 50k out of the TL once these are done, and assume you drive 15k per year and decide to lease. Assuming your monthly car payment is $200 in a new car, you'd break even at the 10-month mark in keeping the TL. Comparatively, the lease would leave you $5200 in the hole before the TL needed additional investment assuming the trade-in covered the downpayment and disposition fees at end of lease.
I'm at 185k. I just spent $2.7k in new wheels, tires, and replacing ALL bushings/mounts/etc. (there's a thread on it) because I have 0 concerns about this car making it to +250k, and will be sold only due to overt boredom in time.
I can't sell this car because it is simply fiscally irresponsible for doing so, and would only reflect a mindset of luxury wants and not needs.
Let's say you get another 50k out of the TL once these are done, and assume you drive 15k per year and decide to lease. Assuming your monthly car payment is $200 in a new car, you'd break even at the 10-month mark in keeping the TL. Comparatively, the lease would leave you $5200 in the hole before the TL needed additional investment assuming the trade-in covered the downpayment and disposition fees at end of lease.
I'm at 185k. I just spent $2.7k in new wheels, tires, and replacing ALL bushings/mounts/etc. (there's a thread on it) because I have 0 concerns about this car making it to +250k, and will be sold only due to overt boredom in time.
I can't sell this car because it is simply fiscally irresponsible for doing so, and would only reflect a mindset of luxury wants and not needs.
Last edited by DeathMetal; 11-25-2015 at 11:44 PM.
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11-26-2015, 05:45 AM
#5
So, if you decide to cut your losses, you'd move to an older Accord. I don't think that is a great decision - considering the TL is basically an upscale Accord.
When you mention that you had to do the front brakes - do you just mean pads and rotors, or also an issue with the calipers? If it's just pads and rotors, it appears that everything you've done to the car aside from the steering rack is just maintenance. What prompted replacement of the rack? It was good to do it during the clutch job, but other than some people mentioning a slight looseness, I'm not familiar with them being issues.
Also, did you take it to the dealer for all the service? I'm thinking so based on the prices, because you'd nearly have to with the quantity of things and the amount of money. Find a good indie shop and save a lot.
Now, think about it - you have a paid off car, low miles, that is cheap to insure, extremely reliable and has had all major maintenance work completed. Add to that, it is a timeless looking car, has a MANUAL TRANSMISSION, and is decently quick. I can't think of anything maintenance related that would need to be done for nearly 100K - maybe shocks/struts - those always get overlooked. If you're adept at doing your own work, hunts for a set of ASPEC springs & shocks and do it yourself. I think you'll be hard pressed to find an older Accord in as good of shape with all the maintenance done for a decent price.
Just to give you some perspective - I bought my 04 6MT TL last year with 232K miles and plan to keep it indefinitely. The interior looked BRAND NEW - that's what sold me on it. I got it for $2500 so I had to snag it. It needs a paint job, which will be done this week. Now I have a like new car with no car payment, that I don't feel bad about modding either - why not, it was only 2500 bucks.
When you mention that you had to do the front brakes - do you just mean pads and rotors, or also an issue with the calipers? If it's just pads and rotors, it appears that everything you've done to the car aside from the steering rack is just maintenance. What prompted replacement of the rack? It was good to do it during the clutch job, but other than some people mentioning a slight looseness, I'm not familiar with them being issues.
Also, did you take it to the dealer for all the service? I'm thinking so based on the prices, because you'd nearly have to with the quantity of things and the amount of money. Find a good indie shop and save a lot.
Now, think about it - you have a paid off car, low miles, that is cheap to insure, extremely reliable and has had all major maintenance work completed. Add to that, it is a timeless looking car, has a MANUAL TRANSMISSION, and is decently quick. I can't think of anything maintenance related that would need to be done for nearly 100K - maybe shocks/struts - those always get overlooked. If you're adept at doing your own work, hunts for a set of ASPEC springs & shocks and do it yourself. I think you'll be hard pressed to find an older Accord in as good of shape with all the maintenance done for a decent price.
Just to give you some perspective - I bought my 04 6MT TL last year with 232K miles and plan to keep it indefinitely. The interior looked BRAND NEW - that's what sold me on it. I got it for $2500 so I had to snag it. It needs a paint job, which will be done this week. Now I have a like new car with no car payment, that I don't feel bad about modding either - why not, it was only 2500 bucks.
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OculiAquilae (11-26-2015)
11-26-2015, 07:22 AM
#6
When you buy any CAR that has close too or over 100k on it...and I don't care who had it,serviced it etc,your going to spend money to get it RIGHT.To keep it RIGHT.Otherwise,save your money up and buy a NEW car.There is no other way around it.Its a Honda it will last for many more miles..get rid of it to start over and who knows what you will get yourself into.Just my opinion.
Last edited by 6MTSSR; 11-26-2015 at 07:27 AM.
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OculiAquilae (11-26-2015)
11-26-2015, 10:38 AM
#9
Team Owner
I was wondering the same thing... Why the hell was the timing belt replaced three times? How many miles on your car?
Also, along with what Polo said, the ebrake is also a maintenance item. As is the clutch.
Whenever buying any manual car, you never have any indication on what shape the clutch is in (unless it's already slipping). You just can't tell unless you drop the transmission, and no one is going to do that just for an inspection. Even if the car had a new clutch put in a month ago, it could be near done if the person doesn't know how to drive a manual. It's just a risk you have to take.
Also, you mention you did the 105k service AND the timing belt 3 times. Part of the 105k service is doing the timing belt. So you had it replaced 4 times? You do it once every 105k and that's it. Why you'd do it more than that is confusing to me...
Also, along with what Polo said, the ebrake is also a maintenance item. As is the clutch.
Whenever buying any manual car, you never have any indication on what shape the clutch is in (unless it's already slipping). You just can't tell unless you drop the transmission, and no one is going to do that just for an inspection. Even if the car had a new clutch put in a month ago, it could be near done if the person doesn't know how to drive a manual. It's just a risk you have to take.
Also, you mention you did the 105k service AND the timing belt 3 times. Part of the 105k service is doing the timing belt. So you had it replaced 4 times? You do it once every 105k and that's it. Why you'd do it more than that is confusing to me...
Last edited by TacoBello; 11-26-2015 at 10:44 AM.
11-26-2015, 11:51 AM
#10
Drifting
I agree with the others- keep the car. The cost of switching to another car at this point doesn't make much sense now. Hopefully, your luck will turn on the maintenance and you'll be a happy camper in two years.
11-26-2015, 11:51 AM
#11
Moderator
iTrader: (7)
If the timing belt was replaced 3x, either you decided to use cheap parts which crapped out, or the install went wrong. Neither of those are the car's fault
Honestly though, keep the car, you can get the same oem pads made by brembo on eBay for about $100. Power steering seals are like $20 for parts, bushings are pretty cheap too, if you can do the labor and let a shop press them out. I'd say you're definitely less than $1k away from a reliable car, if you can do the labor yourself
Honestly though, keep the car, you can get the same oem pads made by brembo on eBay for about $100. Power steering seals are like $20 for parts, bushings are pretty cheap too, if you can do the labor and let a shop press them out. I'd say you're definitely less than $1k away from a reliable car, if you can do the labor yourself
Last edited by paperboy42190; 11-26-2015 at 11:53 AM.
11-26-2015, 03:16 PM
#12
Advanced
I agree with everyone, definitely keep the car! You've had all major maintenance done, and should be set for a long time. It's all maintenance, parts that wear and what not. I bought my 3G TL 6spd a year ago for $9 or $10 grand sticker with 118k, now has 133k. I haven't had anything major: oil pan needed new threads due to moron mechanics over-tightening it, I now need new brake pads (maybe rotors too, idr), tires, and I plan to do my valve cover gaskets, update the CMC, and remove the check valve on the clutch as well. So nothing major. It's a solid car, with a rock solid engine, manual gearbox, and it's a looker for sure! Keep it 
11-27-2015, 10:46 AM
#13
Drifting
If you can get a decent price for it, then I would jump. Because you're contemplating selling now.. And it will only get WORSE.. haha But on the bright side, you've already replaced a lot..
Last edited by Chad05TL; 11-27-2015 at 10:52 AM.
11-27-2015, 02:17 PM
#14
I have had my CL-S for 10 years and an additional 100K miles (it had 38K on it when I got it.
Let me see
front brakes 2x
rear brakes 3x
all new mounts
all new sway bar bushings and end links
new ac condenser
timing belt at 118K
new left front wheel bearing
Car needs new hood cable (spring project)
rust repair on driver side rear quarter panel
new headlights
new front bumper cover
Gonna keep it and drive it u
Let me see
front brakes 2x
rear brakes 3x
all new mounts
all new sway bar bushings and end links
new ac condenser
timing belt at 118K
new left front wheel bearing
Car needs new hood cable (spring project)
rust repair on driver side rear quarter panel
new headlights
new front bumper cover
Gonna keep it and drive it u
11-27-2015, 02:44 PM
#15
Drifting
Appending what I said... If you can't upgrade for a decent price or alleviate any issues by changing car, or if the next car is not any better, then there is no sense in trading. I have been contemplating. The same thing but the only other car I like is 40k. So I have not jumped yet since they don't offer .uch on a trade. Someone offered me 10kon a z06 trade but I didn't make the move .. Only 77k. Miles here
11-27-2015, 06:21 PM
#16
Drifting
For me, to find anything equal to the TL, I would have to spend like 20k or more. So, its best for me to just keep the TL.
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OculiAquilae (11-28-2015)
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OculiAquilae (11-28-2015)
11-28-2015, 10:51 PM
#18
Thanks for all the replies, I going to keep it for sure at this point; I just need to replace a couple more things.
But just for clarifications, the timing belt was done 3 times because of the Kit I bought. It was a DNJ Kit from Rockauto and it wasn't the cheapest, but every part that was in that kit failed; not the cars fault.
The calipers in the front were messed up, 1 of the pistons was seized on each caliper, and when I went to replace the piston, the cylinder was pitted and beyond my ability to rebuild. The mounting threads were also worn out. But, I've got new brakes on the way.
I did get the compliance bushings replaced during the clutch job, so I guess its up to the motor mounts to go.
But just for clarifications, the timing belt was done 3 times because of the Kit I bought. It was a DNJ Kit from Rockauto and it wasn't the cheapest, but every part that was in that kit failed; not the cars fault.
The calipers in the front were messed up, 1 of the pistons was seized on each caliper, and when I went to replace the piston, the cylinder was pitted and beyond my ability to rebuild. The mounting threads were also worn out. But, I've got new brakes on the way.
I did get the compliance bushings replaced during the clutch job, so I guess its up to the motor mounts to go.
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OculiAquilae (11-28-2015)
11-28-2015, 11:06 PM
#19
Advanced
Thanks for all the replies, I going to keep it for sure at this point; I just need to replace a couple more things.
But just for clarifications, the timing belt was done 3 times because of the Kit I bought. It was a DNJ Kit from Rockauto and it wasn't the cheapest, but every part that was in that kit failed; not the cars fault.
The calipers in the front were messed up, 1 of the pistons was seized on each caliper, and when I went to replace the piston, the cylinder was pitted and beyond my ability to rebuild. The mounting threads were also worn out. But, I've got new brakes on the way.
I did get the compliance bushings replaced during the clutch job, so I guess its up to the motor mounts to go.
But just for clarifications, the timing belt was done 3 times because of the Kit I bought. It was a DNJ Kit from Rockauto and it wasn't the cheapest, but every part that was in that kit failed; not the cars fault.
The calipers in the front were messed up, 1 of the pistons was seized on each caliper, and when I went to replace the piston, the cylinder was pitted and beyond my ability to rebuild. The mounting threads were also worn out. But, I've got new brakes on the way.
I did get the compliance bushings replaced during the clutch job, so I guess its up to the motor mounts to go.
Sounds like you're good to go then. Yeah, definitely not the car's fault. It's a rock solid car, just give it love & maintenance when needed, which shouldn't be that often or that needed.
Motor mounts are a pretty cheap maintenance job also. Bought mine at 118k, had the 105k service (timing belt and water pump done, also tensioner & engine mounts. Haven't had to do anything since. Brake pads and rotors soon, plan on doing CMC to update for the TSB, and check valve delete as well as valve cover gasket replacement all at the same time, in a month or so. Again, all maintenance and just driver preference on the other's.
Great car, I love her....Glad to hear you're keeping her
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maddog0z (12-04-2015)
12-01-2015, 09:39 AM
#21
iWhine S/C 6MT TL
iTrader: (1)
When you buy any CAR that has close too or over 100k on it...and I don't care who had it,serviced it etc,your going to spend money to get it RIGHT.To keep it RIGHT.Otherwise,save your money up and buy a NEW car.There is no other way around it.Its a Honda it will last for many more miles..get rid of it to start over and who knows what you will get yourself into.Just my opinion.
-New oem upper control arms
-New oem lower control arm bushings (both sides, all bushings)
-New oem sway bar bushing
-New oem outer tie rods (alignment)
-New oem transmission mount
-New battery (yellow top)
-New oem lower ball joints
-New oem rear upper control arms
-New oem drivers seat belt buckle
-New oem Bluetooth unit
Last year the timing belt and dashboard was done. My seats have to get redone and I purchased new Tein Street Advance coil overs since my old coils are done. Overall, all parts and labor ran me about 3K. To save the cost, I ordered the parts and did most of the work myself. The dashboard was a 70/30 split. IF, I was to sell my TL, It would need absolutely nothing. It sit with 99,900 miles. The body is near flawless condition. The truth of the matter is, nobody will pay for a well kept TL today.
Most of the current buyers would rather buy a salvaged TL. You see this a lot if you're part of any Facebook groups. As the prices of the TL are obtainable by nearly anyone, the quest to find a well kept and done right, is going to be a hard task. The time's have certainly changed. Most don't want to go to the dealership for at least a proper multi-point check list. You see these guys with broken lower ball joints and wonder why it happens. Most of the same guys will run to Acura for a free crappy Bluetooth speaker.. Go figure. I also, would like to upgrade to a 2013 S4 Audi. It's the only thing that is close to a great replacement for the TL. I've owned the TL for 7 going on 8 years, it's not easy for me to part ways with the amount of time and money I've invested. I'd rather not deal with the insulting offers that most are willing to pay.
Most current pictures of my TL
Last edited by 04WDPSeDaN; 12-01-2015 at 09:43 AM.
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12-01-2015, 12:57 PM
#24
Burning Brakes
you're well on your way to many, trouble free miles, after all that maintenance..
keep it, and start modding it now
keep it, and start modding it now
12-01-2015, 12:59 PM
#25
Team Owner
I've heard there's a supercharger or two for sale in the black market section... 
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