I hate cars

Other forums don't mean a thing when it comes to what we use in the TL. I've spent countless hours going over the technical side of this in other threads and I honestly don't feel like doing it all over again. It's out there, just search.

The end result is a non FM fluid cures shudder in the TL, much less create it.
It shows much less wear as is evidenced on the drain plug.
Shift quality is much better than stock.
Shifts are much quicker than stock.
The current turbo TL has never had a trans failure on this fluid while the first turbo TL failed within a day on Z1.

It's all on here and with so many people doing this and all with the same positive results there is no debate. The end results speaks for itself.

OntheJob

ok I can see where your pointing me.... I just pulled this from RP site on their version of the racing ATF they make with little to no FM and they say its NOT recommended for stock auto transmissions...... so if what there saying is exaclty obosite of what your saying ... then which is correct and where am I mis understanding?????? NOTE: I did put in the MAX ATF FLUID THEY RECOMMENDED... but if RP is saying not to use NON FM fluids... then who is wrong?



Royal Purple Racing ATF is a high performance lubricant designed for automatic transmissions using Ford Type F fluids.

Royal Purple Racing ATF is formulated with Synerlec, our proprietary additive technology, resulting in 300% greater wear protection as compared to traditional Type F fluids. Combined with select base stocks, it also excels at high temperature oxidation resistance, is anti-foaming and protects against corrosion and rust to promote longer oil life.

Field testing in GM, Ford and Chrysler drag racing transmissions has shown Royal Purple Racing ATF to be very consistent in pass-to-pass performance and has resulted in the doubling or tripling of transmission component and fluid life.

Racing ATF is not recommended for any stock automatic transmissions or for street use where a friction modified fluid is recommended such as a GM DexronŽ III or Ford MerconŽ. For automatic transmissions calling for a GM DexronŽ / Ford MerconŽ fluid, we recommend Royal Purple's Max ATF.

I hate cars

That's just marketing. It's so useless I never read it....ever.

There's no actual information whatsoever in that statement by RP. Just a bunch of vague advertising nonsense.

Redline says not to use their non FM fluid in the TL as does Amsoil and probably any manufacturer you ask. They have to say this as it's not tested. I've seen it cause torque convertor clutch shudder in Fords. In the TL's carbon lined clutch it's not an issue but they can't tell you to use a fluid that is the complete opposite of the OEM fluid without getting sued.

OntheJob

hmm so basically the fluid companies you guys are all using,as well as telling all of us to use, and so PRO about are even NOT recommending the use in the very transmissions you are putting them it themselves!!!! ... IE the TL transmissions.
If thats the case I am using and switching back to the z-1, honda is known for their longevity/reliability, again bringing us to the issue of maintenance personal vigilance, and Honda's engineers designed and require the FM for a reason other wise they would not have used it.

And this is AMERICA companies can recommend you use their product, if not as you stated, then mobile 1 and every other oil company and product even beyond cars would not have a market to exist in.

Thanks for helping make my decision.

Inaccurate

Not in reagards to longevity/reliability of the transmission on the 2G and 3G TL. The 2G and 3G TL is notorious for 5AT trans failures.

Do you wonder why ????

Too much FM is why.

Do you wonder what fluid has too much FM? It is Z1.

OntheJob

So then where is my motivation to put in a fluid from a company that does not recommend it themselves for my transmission?

Inaccurate

Where is your motivation? Then don't. We are not here to force you to do anything you are not comfortable with.

Look on the bright side. The Acura dealership is SO WELL in practice of changing out 5AT trans, they can probably do it while you wait when you current trans fails with Z1.

I hate cars

Seriously, you're incapable of basic reasoning and logic. The facts are out there, you either choose to not search or you don't understand. Enjoy arguing with yourself.

Merry christmas Inaccurate!

Inaccurate

And Merry Christmas to you my friend and to the rest of Acurazine. :gheyhug:

I am still working hard (every spare minute) on writing the NMI (nitrous) thread. Estimating 5-10 more days.

OntheJob

Guys...... Im not arguing.. this site is filled with people like you who cant have an objective conversation with one ounce of intelligence so dont attack me.


Im simply trying to understand how fluids with less FM that cause harsher shifting as YOU described is safer, as well as how you push these fluids yet the companies them selfs do NOT recommend them.

DONT GET ME WRONG, I would love to put an upgraded yet safe fluid in the trans just like you guys, but not short of what it was designed to be used for.

Heres my logic, your telling me to use something thats not approved by Honda or the actual company it self who designed it ( the non FM fluids) to be used in our AT transmissions, all on a hunch of yours that 1 turbo TL on heres transmission has not failed yet... thats what you give me to support you claim... that is horse crap.

Why are there countless threads claiming the exact opposite on all other cars as well not even just the TL. As well as countless threads all over supporting factory oil..... all I am saying is the rabbit hole is very deep and leads in nothing but a big circle, so me trying to get a better understanding on FM and what it really is or the lack of it does/is makes me an object for attack on here????

Oh I get it maybe if I post BS threads about "what car I should buy next" you guys would be more entertained.... this site is pathetic.

which brings me to try and come to you guys, the so called "experts" on here for help cause I would like to understand yet all many of us get are ur comments by you and your goonies. Grow the f* up.

OntheJob

cute

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

OntheJob, I suggest that you immediately stop the personal attacks.

OntheJob

and do you suggest the same for "ihatecars" as well? I mean read the page, I was attacked first....

OntheJob

in case you forgot your supposed to monitor everyone on here.. not just the people who you are not friends with.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

No, I'm not going to warn IHC at this point or Inac.

They said their peace, and you did as well. The quote above is what I am referring to.

You think IHC likes me? LOL.

OntheJob

No Im simply pointing out the one sided treatment your giving me because your "buddies" or whatever you label it... its pathetic... and your moderator status should be revoked for it... but considering how this site is run, I would doubt that.

I get it... lets not warn the person who attacked first..... great MODS we have on here, what a bunch of class acts.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

Enough of the Off Topic comments, please. If you would like to discuss further, I would be more than happy to via PM. Thanks.

OntheJob

No i think out in the open so everyone can see what you just said to me is more appropriate to shed light on your one sided treatment... its BS and Im calling you out. Pming me will solve nothing.

Warn ihatecars, or resign from being a MOD, if you cant do your job dont do it.

I hate cars

I'm looking forward to it. Will all of my turbo preaching, ironically nitrous is in the near future. Got to hurry, I'm sneaking on here with my new phone every now and then but since I promised no a-zine on Christmas I will be killed if I get caught.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

Last warning, do not crap up this thread anymore. I've asked nicely.

I hate cars

Love to hate lol. Sorry, I'm done with the off topic, I didn't see your warning until after I replied to Inacc. But no, I don't dislike you or anyone else on this board.

Edit: I really did not see your last warning until after I hit the send button.

con5tant

iTrader: (4)

could the dealer somehow void the powertrain warranty if you used anything other than OEM tranny fluid?

leedogg

Manufacturers can only require a type/class of any/all fluids used in their vehicles. Consumers have the freedom to choose which particular brand of fluid they want to use as long as it meets the manufacturer's specifications. Requiring/Forcing you to use their fluid would spell lawsuit.

BradE

They can only force you to use their specific fluid (brand) if it's provided to you free of charge. Otherwise, you can use any fluid that meets or exceeds the specs.

They would also have to prove the use of the incorrect fluid caused the failure. Where it gets messy is, the dealer could tell you to fuck off, then you'd have to fight them in court, and that gets expensive.

AWDream

hey guys, i've been reading a bunch on the atf suggestions, technical info, etc. i plan on changing mine to the redline type f, but have a question. on a 3x3 drain/fill (which i plan on doing in 3 intervals and driving in between them), is it safe to switch directly from Z1 to type f? I remember reading something about a transition, mixing fluids, etc. until you're happy with how the trans shifts. I don't want to bother with trying different ratios, mixtures, etc.

basically, is it safe to drain the z1, and fill with straight type f, without worrying about any issues related to longevity/reliability?

sorry if this has been discussed, or considered off topic to this thread

I hate cars

It's fine to mix.

TheChamp531

iTrader: (3)

Interesting.

OnTheJob, IHC and Innac know what they are talking about.

You havent proved one thing besides that Acura or Redline Racing doesn't approve of the use. Obviously when they haven't tested it on your vehicles. They say that for legal reasons but we have used te Racing ATF for over a year with 0 problems on a turbo and supercharged engines. We have the REAL world experience yet you keep arguing. Don't make a topic when your transmission fails with Z1.

WRXtranceformed

We're beating a dead horse at this point, but knowledgeable pioneers like IHC and Innac are probably responsible for saving / preserving the life of at least a hundred TL ATs on this forum. If it wasn't for IHC's pressure sensor switch thread my own AT would probably be close to on its way out now at 103k miles. If you haven't gotten booted already from this board it would be in your best interest to read those threads and pay attention OntheJob.

I hate cars

I really appreciate it guys. But I'm not going to argue with people as much and give the moderators a break. I'll follow the Inaccurate way and make a statement and leave it at that. The only reason I tend to argue is I don't want others to believe things that are not true but I think there's enough info out there that people can make an educated decision.

Dan000

iTrader: (1)

Happen to have a link to that thread?

WRXtranceformed

There's enough info out there now thanks to you guys.
I can see why it would be frustrating when someone keeps arguing with you guys after all the theory, discussion, and real world application we've already had here regarding AT life and preventative steps to prolonging it.
Sure, here you go. It'll take some searching through it, but you'll find great diagrams, part numbers for specific model years, etc.

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...g+conversation

Dan000

iTrader: (1)

Thank you.

OntheJob

Well I figured since no one wanted to listen OR HELP ME UNDERSTAND I would call Redline directly and spoke with the technical department and here is what I was asked:

ME-Would you recommend me using the Type F fluid in my trans without the FM's in it?, as a few guys on the forums are using it in their tranns. and explaining by not having any FM that I would extend the life of my trans through reducing the "slipping" effect caused by FM's to give the smooth shifting characteristics.

Redline-No, we never recommend that because the lack of FM, which the trans is developed to have, in the type F fluid could cause lock up torque converter, chatter and shudder.."which you guys are trying to combat" which could lead to damage to the trans, as well as send the trans into (limp home mode) with the ecu.

Me- Would the Type F fluid with the lack of FM extend the life of my trans by helping reduce the "slipping" effect of z-1 fluid through the lack of FM'ers?

Redline- No most likely not, if anything maybe minimally but again probably no much of a difference.

Redline- we would only recommend using D4 which still has friction modifiers in it and meets the OEM standards of the z-1, in terms of FM's.

Me- well then would D4 be an upgrade from z-1 in terms of longevity and protection of my trans?

Redline- Yes, but only in the terms of the better operating temperature rating, the d4 will not break down as easily from heat, even under normal operating temps.

Me- Ok so to sum all this up, IS IT SAFE TO USE THE RACING FLUID IN MY AUTOMATIC TL TRANSMISSION?

Redline-NO.


Me- D4?

Redline- absolutely

Case closed.



-I understand and respect the real world use and pioneering of new stuff with our cars, but when the manufacture of a product tells me not to use it, theres no way I am going to use it. I am just trying to shed light on the subject directly from the source so that there is more then a one sided stance, which contrary to what you think could still be wrong, just because you think your right, does not make you right- which also applies to my stance, however I think the failure in lots of our transmissions are based on many other factors, every brand of car is going to have failures, not every car that rolls off the assembly line will perform, and last the same as the one before or after it.

I hate cars

You're 6 months too late. Search is your friend. Now stop cluttering this thread with useless info that was presented long ago. Welcome to the present.

I hate cars

Since you're incapable of searching I'll hand feed you. Here is a statement from Dave at Redline. Inaccurate showed tact and asked the right questions. My guess is you came across to Redline the same way you come across on here so you got the generic version if you even called at all.

leedogg

Enough. I just searched for you, here's the thread with info you wanted. And a blend of D4 & Type F was what was determined as optimal.


https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...t=redline+type

OntheJob

I read that as well some long time ago, I understand the big picture here.

If the Forced induction guys want to experiment with fluids to get better holding abilities great....

But for the every day driver, coupled with the responses to me and innacurate from redline, running a type F fluid is not needed or wanted by a NA TL. Simple as that.


D4 sure, but not the type F... and the response I got from redline was fine and was the same as innacurate minus the seal swell part of the convo, so condescending remarks by you gets us where?

I would like to point out that I liked the sound and explination of the d4 and would be very inclined to use it, I am trying to show that the use of Type F fluid is not good in our trans, as stated by Redline themselves, and designed by Honda engineers... So parts of your assumptions and advice given to people on this site to use a NON FRICTION modified fluid is wrong... sorry I know you wont be able to admit it or handle that, but it is what it is, sorry, ....

I hate cars

I actually feel sorry for you.

You need to either comprehend and search or you need to be banned. If you don't understand something, that's fine. But when you come on here not understanding the first thing about an auto trans, ATF, and cars in general and you post your opinions as fact it's no good for anyone. I suggest you go back read everything you can. Every "point" you think you have has been gone over and answered already. I can't continually hand feed things to you. Educate yourself and then thank me and Inaccurate for bringing this fluid to you.

OntheJob

so then help me understand ...pm me please.

I read everything on here, I see your points, and spoke with redline directly... are you to tell me that you are right and redline and honda are wrong???????

I hate cars

Redline is not wrong. They #1 are covering their asses and #2 have not tested this fluid in a Honda so how can they recommend it?

Honda has the highest AT failure rate of any manufacturer. There are two reasons, the fluid and the failed switches. Either I #1 know more than Honda or #2 Honda just doesn't care.

The number of saved transmissions from the fluid and swtiches on this site alone speaks for itself.