Limelight

It seems like people can't talk about the RLX without mentioning Acura's failure on the marketing front.

Do they advertise or promote the RLX? No, and that's pretty much all I have to say about that - or perhaps care to say I suppose is more accurate.

I'd love to hear why folks feel marketing is so important to the purchaser or owner of the RLX. I get its value to the seller to attract potential buyers, but will marketing change my perception of the car in my driveway? The way I see it, it will change others' perceptions of the car in my driveway - something I couldn't care less about. Maybe when I'm at a dinner party and someone asks what I drive, they won't shrug their shoulders acknowledging they've never heard of it before.

Selfishly, I've always liked the exclusivity of a less mainstream vehicle, so I'm more than happy to keep the RLX quiet...

Personally too much marketing puts me off. I can see a million more Ford commercials and still never buy one of their cars.

TBC787

I'll 2nd that!

holografique

Because it also affects the value of the vehicle, which causes residual value to go down which causes monthly lease payments to be very high at the same time lowering the resale value of the vehicle.

The less of a job Acura does in marketing the vehicle properly, the less the market acceptance is on the vehicle, the less the market value on the vehicle. All of which ultimately impacts the pocketbooks of existing RLX owners.

That's why.

Limelight

Perhaps this is particularly true to those who lease the car and paid full sticker price as I know you did, however the lack of marketing then worked wonders for me - as I bought used with extremely low mileage in brand new condition for a fraction of the MSRP. Acura's strategy got me a hell of a nice car that was kind to my pocketbook!

George Knighton

There was a strategy?

holografique

Sure, but it ultimately creates a situation where you have to wait 1-2 years before getting the car at a price that is more in line with what it is worth. Versus having the car priced appropriately upfront so that you get buyers wanting to buy it when it is actually released for sale. That is a poor sales strategy IMO. But like George said above...its clear they had no strategy to begin with...

Short of 1st gen products, prospective buyers should be able to have a confidence level in buying new products when they come out, not this "hold-n-wait" game to get the car at a cost that is more in line its value. Imagine if Apple did a horrible job at marketing their iPhone, to the point where no one wanted to buy it, even though it is technically a fabulous product, and only after a year of release did prices come down to the point where customers wanted to buy it. It would be a complete failure. Hence the abysmal sales figures of the RLX, and the poor market reception.

IMO the RLX is a combination of multiple failures, not just marketing...

* Poor (or lack of) marketing,

* Major quality issues in the initial 2014 release, poor suspension being probably the biggest hit, with dozens of reviewers and who knows how many customer complaints about poor ride handling for a vehicle of this class.

* highly overpriced with lack of value. Remember the 2014 was lacking several key features that are now only found included, added, or improved upon in the 2016. Amd they did it all with no increase in price, which is clear proof that they know they messed up from the start.

* lackluster exterior design (I personally like it, but it doesnt make me horny like a 4-series or A5 does). Even the GS-350 has a sexier appeal to its exterior.

* lack of the SH-AWD version at the launch.

Again, all just my persepective.

TBC787

"Again, all just my perspective".


That pretty much sums it up. This is a great car for $48,000. Don't know about the early years but as long as they got is sorted out on the 2016 it works for me

holografique

Yup, absolutely great car for $48k. Which only proves my point. You gotta wait 1-2 years to get it at that price point.

Absolutely NOT a great car for $63k with a $980 month lease payment....hence my perspective.

hondamore

You can't blame or fault Acura for selling the RLX to early adopters for a high price. It only makes sense to maximize profits.

I seem to recall many discussions on this forum back in 2013, BEFORE the RLX was launched, in which MANY posters laid out plans to wait for discounts before buying based on the history of the RL and other Acura products. Those who chose to buy early KNEW they were going to be paying too much and KNEW they were going to be accepting the highest risk for potential "new model issues and glitches". Complaining after the fact seems to be a case of wanting your cake and eating it too... wanting to be first to own one but wanting the same pricing and reliability enjoyed by others who chose to wait for prices to drop and glitches to be worked out.

holografique

^ I disagree on one simple point:

Acura added (a real) remote engine start (to the Advanced trim), 360 degree camera, improved suspension and apparently an improved navigation system at NO additional increase in the MSRP of the vehicle. That is proof that they "missed the mark" from the get go. Otherwise, they would be, as you stated, increasing the price to maximize profits. That's clearly not the case with the 2016. The 2016 represents them acknowledging the mistakes I'm talking about. The lack of marketing only makes it worse.

The car should have had all of those things included in 2013, when you could have gotten the same from competitors for not much more than the MSRP of the RLX PAWS. The only person to blame for missing that mark is Acura. And even George has validated that it was Honda/Acura that made the wrong decision on the pricing of the car based on the whole Yen vs Dollar situation at the time in combination with their perception of what they thought the market wanted at the time.

The only thing I blame myself for is not having done my research and spent more time testing the car before having jumped on it. Looking back now I consider it my "blind faith" in the Acura brand.

fsmith

Due respect, holografique (and I mean that seriously), but isn't this the real issue? You knew you were paying top price, obviously, and that you hadn't done your research. I don't deny Acura messed up the suspension on the early RLXs, and that the price was too high, but you knowingly rolled the dice. The fact that they fixed the suspension and added functionality means, to me, only that they learned they made some mistakes and fixed them. I paid full price also, and took what I recognized as a very big risk on a totally new technology, with only a couple of hours of test drive. I guess I lucked out with the SH-AWD, but if I hadn't I knew what risk I was taking. I don't mean to sound more special or smarter than you, only to say that we both took risks knowingly.

George Knighton

I don't know how I lucked out, considering everything I've read in here, but I got a decent price on the RLX Advance (P-AWS) and it worked well enough that I still had faith enough to buy the Sport Hybrid after driving it for ½ hour.

I felt the P-AWS Advance was a great car for the money, and provided exactly what the typical owner would want.

At full retail price, and considering the lease payment that our friend told us about, and then adding in all the problems he has described, I believe I would not like the car.

George Knighton

That's more than my current car cost. When you add in the problems you've described...I don't know how I'd feel.

holografique

Is it really? I was simply following the expectation that Acura created with their previous products. I dont think it was unreasonable for me to expect a "better" experience from my 3G TL...afterall...I paid $38k dollars more to Acura for my RLX versus my TL. Should I not have expected a better experience without having to do research? Isnt that the point of having loyal customers? Customers who trust in your ability as a company to always deliver without having to go through all the guess work, research and time to decide otherwise?

But ultimately I cant do anything about it, so I have only myself personally to blame for having put so much faith in the brand to deliver on their reputation for quality products.

And Acura messed up far more than just on the suspension. The 2014 is laden with all sorts of quality control issues. I remind you to go back and look at the growing list of TSB's for the 2014 models. Who know's what else is in store for 2014 owners. The only resolution I have is that I leased and I get to get rid of it.

Acura is just as much at fault for not delivering on their reputation just as much as I am at fault for blindly believing that they could deliver as they have based on my past experience.

holografique

Thank you. Seriously I dont understand why that's soo hard for some of you to understand.

I paid $63k ($980/month) for a 2014 PAWS Advanced that has 36 TSB's and growing...some of which Acura cant even resolve properly themselves.

Some of you paid considerably less for an SH-AWD Advanced and dont have a fraction of the quality control issues experienced in the earliest batch of 2014 PAWS models.

And to whoever said I want my cake and eat it to, are you seriously saying this is the type of experience one is supposed to expect at $980/month? Do you have any idea the types of cars I could be driving right now for that type of monthly lease payment?

holografique

Honestly, at this point I'm going to refrain from participating on this forum until I am able to resolve my situation come next year. It's clear most people can't relate with the situation I am in. And it's clear I am not happy with the product nor my situation. So I'm not doing any good continuing to share my view points here.

You guys enjoy your hybrids, and enjoy your awesome deals on your PAWS RLX's. I'll check back in next year when I'm hopefully out of this situation.

Signing off.

Pens Fan

Not a good situation when a loyal Acura customer has this type of experience and feelings after leasing a new "flagship' vehicle. Sadly one must come to the conclusion that a customer of any first year (or three) of a new model will likely be confronted with potential problems. I am often amazed at what is added as content in an MMC and the 2016 RLX has many features and enhancements as well as improvements (suspension) that should have been included/rectified before introduction. We all get excited at the anticipation of a new model and look to jump in with our favored brands, but the early adopters pay a price for it. I for one will (try) to wait it out going forward, no matter the car in question.

sooththetruth

holographique is not unique in having had a deal turn very bad for him. I have examples in my life of much worse losses, and then I saw the start of the "great recession" in 2007 destroy the lives of many of my patients, that went from having $125K a year jobs to $40K a year jobs. Most of them are happy again, and the same people they were before the drop. Yes, they went through grief, with anger, depression and the whole gamut. There is no substitute for time, though. There will be the suffering and with time there will be acceptance.

But I guarantee that ANYONE making decisions, and having the courage to CONTINUE to make decisions so as to be running their own life, instead of having our society run it for you, will make good and bad decisions. So holographique and me are not done making decisions, and because of the infinite variables of life, some of them will turn out poorly. And that is the cost of choosing for yourself.

Acura did not set out to take advantage of anyone. If anything, this is a company struggling with a poor and struggling home economy, a previously artificially depressed dollar and, until their latest Accord, was potentially in trouble. Acura has had to make decisions, and the viability of their company depends on it. If it were worth marketing the RLX, they would be doing it, but their production capacity, the cost of making the RLX, the profit margin, THE RETURN ON THEIR INVESTMENT, is all part of the equation.

So, holographique is going to be O.K., he just needs time, and there is no solace from our words, except to say that I could tell of horrific ways I have lost much more money than on a car, and I hope to have learned from it, and I owe it to my family to be happy, productive, and go on making decisions, because that is really what makes life what it is.

Good luck to you, holographique. I think you should remain a participant on the board. Any post that implies that you should have known better is written by someone who is PRETENDING they have not had similar experiences, or is someone who doesn't think for themselves. Yes, I am calling them out for doing it. Just because this board "warned" that the pattern of Acura was to suffer early depreciation doesn't mean they understood what you valued, what you believed, and so they have no right to judge.

So, WARNING, I am on a soapbox: On this board there are those that celebrate buying a vehicle that other people DON'T want (i.e.: the masses) The majority of people buy a car so their peers will not second guess them: In some groups that is BMW/Mercedes/Audi, in other groups it's Mustangs/Camaros/Challengers.

The idea that holographique should have waited to buy because the board said so is buying into that group think, and is what I cannot do. But the majority of people outside of "group think" will SUFFER THEIR INDIVIDUALITY. (But I also believe will often benefit and celebrate their individuality)

So, I say, holographique, suffer with the dignity of knowing you chose a path at the time, without possibly knowing what was coming, and not even you should judge you. And, may you continue making your share of bad decisions in the future, because that means you have had the courage to continue thinking for yourself. And, finally, that because you learn from experience that your future will be better for the mistakes of your past.

acuranj18

This is the reason I posted separately about Acura stepping up with pull aheads and loyalty money on leases so loyal customers like many of us could get the newly enhanced 2016 model at a price substantially lower than what we are currently paying. Not a case or sour grapes or regret, but if the company values customer loyalty and in hindsight if the early models have some elements that were less than what should have been expected, then it's appropriate for Acura to do whatever possible to maintain a loyal customer base for its flagship car.

George Knighton

That's certainly not why I buy a car. LOL....

I think that the posts he has to look at are as much a part of the problem as his dissatisfaction with the car and finances. I've almost said it myself, but you might be wacking a hornet's nest.

You certainly got philosophical on us. :-)

sooththetruth

Well, I THOUGHT I was saying that most Acura buyers are not those people afraid of buying something different.

fsmith

Again, with respect, holografique. It's obviously your choice, but I would hope you would stay and share your continuing experiences with your car. I think you may be mistaking some comments (including my own) that you took your chances and didn't get what you wanted with a lack of empathy. I THINK YOUR SITUATION SUCKS (shouting intended). I would hate to have spent all that money and then not like the car I was driving. I, for one, totally get that you are disappointed with the car and with the company. The company let a lot of people down. That's totally obvious. I feel bad for you. But I really don't read most people's comments as a lack of empathy, so please don't always read them that way. It's just that we all get it, but there is only so much value in beating a dead horse IMHO. Please don't confuse back and forth discussion about the car with a lack of empathy for your personal bad situation. I think most everyone in this forum feels your pain, even though they'd rather not dwell on it.

flagship

I think it is simple in hindsight:
We expected Honda and Acura to be 10 out of 10 in most cases and categories related to design and ownership experience and not less than an 8 out of 10 and in contrast I have heard the RLX car called a dud.

The suspension issues were not acceptable especially on a luxury car that advertises quiet glass and other ride refinments.

Some paid a premium for the car, and trusted in number #1 (high quality a given in brand) as many could have done. The issues and the turn to very low resale speaks for itself.

The press and user feedback related press (reliability, feedback and issues) have not been kind to the car and at some point reflects reality. Even if you lower standards, last place or bottom half vs top group. Marketing can be a red herring.

It seems the 2016 fixed a lot, I drove one and it felt much better than the 2014, let's hope the next model will be better.

The SH-AWD group seemed really happy, consistently, that is good.

George Knighton

Some of us are so effusively happy that I wonder what drugs we're on.

fsmith

Maybe it's totally group-induced, self-reinforcing behavior, and we're all stoned and tripping over each other in praise of what is in reality a plain-vanilla, overpriced, underpowered, poorly made, and under-performing car. Ha!

wstr75

Years ago my next door neighbor was a sales manager at a local dealership. He drove whatever demonstrator was available. His wife drove a six year old Oldsmobile that he took as a trade-in. He did not adore cars. He did not lavish on cars. I've encountered many folks in the car sales industry who bought dirt cheap trade-in vehicles for their family members. I've also seen the same phenomena with local home builders who build expensive homes with all amenities for their customers and yet build surprisingly simple, relatively unadorned homes for their own use. Ironic, isn't it? The folks on the other side of the transaction from "us" buyers take an impassive approach to buying cars and homes. I live in a relatively small city (population 22,500) and know of three quite wealthy guys who are unaffiliated, yet share the same investing strategy. Using an almost sociopathic approach, they make extremely low offers to folks selling property in an unblinking fashion. If they are rejected, they don't shrug, say anything or show any other kind of emotion. It is just another logical business deal to them and they get their share of takers. Hard for many of us to understand, but this is the other side of the business deal universe.

This is a long-winded way of saying I buy cars for transportation. No matter how I slice it, a car costs me $3500 to $6000/year when all costs are calculated. I prefer to buy used and to keep a car five to six years so as to fit into the $3500 - $6000/year window loss/cost averaged over the ownership span. Yes, the 2014 RLX buyers got the first year issues (I bought my 2014 PAWS with 15,000 miles and so far it has been a wonderful car with no glaring issues). My wife likes our car. I recently bought a 2004 BMW 330CiC (convertible) to be a weekend fun car. While we plan to keep the BMW for a long time, the number of repairs and replacement of worn parts has made me appreciate Honda/Acura all the more. Honda designs cars to run 200K+ miles before major component replacements start occurring. BMW designs cars to start having component replacements occurring in the 60 to 90K window and to be repeated every 60 to 90K miles.

pgeorg

It would be a big loss, if you did not participate anymore holografique......
I always like to read your post, either they are positive or negative. I also believe you have contributed a lot on everything that has to do with the RLX, and beyond. I have read your posts from the beginning (since you leased the RLX), and i can see how much you enjoyed the car before all the problems showed up. I also understand how all the problems you've had and continue having, would take away all that enjoyment:-(
I hope you stick around until your lease is over, and continue after that if you decide to give Acura another chance.....

George Knighton

Basically, so do I.

I'll drive about 24,000/year or maybe a little more sometimes.

So I'll gravitate toward cars that I'd tend to believe will do well for over 100K miles, and I'll look for a car that is engaging and comfortable, which can be important if you're having to drive a lot and still have to make decisions at the end of the drive, sometimes with just one foot out the car door.

LOL....

:-)

neuronbob

You'll be welcomed back when you're ready. I do feel you got screwed somewhat, and that was before the accident, which I think simply made things worse than they already were.

It's too bad you couldn't get into a hybrid easily. You could be as positive as the rest of us. Well, other than my griping about mileage.

George Knighton

I haven't looked at the lifetime meter recently.

The last time I looked, it was 30.9 but it was still climbing. I wonder if I hit 31.0 yet. :-)

It's still a puzzle to me, somewhat, why yours is so much different. I do *not* baby the car, but I think my percentage of EV mode in daily commutes helps a lot.