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Old 01-16-2014, 12:30 PM
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Microsoft: Windows 10 News and Discussion Thread

Steven J. Vaughan Nichols: Windows 9 in 2015: Desperation isn't pretty

Yes, Windows 8's been a failure. It's been worse than Vista. But is the solution really to push out a new operating system in double-quick time?

Seriously, Microsoft? You want to get Windows 9 -- Windows freakin' 9 -- out in 2015?

I get that you want to distance yourself from the Windows 8.x train wreck. Who wouldn't? But by upgrading Windows on a consumer pace, aren't you taking a big chance that your enterprise customers will turn their backs on you? I mean, companies want desktop operating systems they can rely on for three to five years, not three to five seasons.

Let's start with some fundamentals. As Paul Thurrott, senior technical analyst for Windows IT Pro and the boss of Paul Thurrott's SuperSite for Windows, put it, "Windows 8 is tanking harder than Microsoft is comfortable discussing in public." According to Thurrott, the free upgrade Windows 8.1, which offers major improvements over Windows 8, is installed on fewer than 25 million PCs. "That's a disaster," he wrote. Windows 9 (as it's expected to be designated; Threshold is the code name for now) "will need to strike a better balance between meeting the needs of over a billion traditional PC users" and enticing users to a Windows experience on new types of personal computing devices. "In short, it needs to be everything that Windows 8 is not."

That's not me, Mr. Linux, talking. That's a dyed-in-the-wool Windows expert and supporter speaking.

What Thurrott doesn't mention in that essay is how Microsoft is also facing serious competition on the desktop for the first time in decades. People love Chromebooks. Adding insult to injury, the two biggest PC OEMs, in the world, Lenovo and HP, are shipping Android-powered PCs, and AMD and Intel are supporting architectures that will let OEMs build dual Android/Windows systems.

That's four of what once were Microsoft's staunchest allies. The Intel move is especially significant. If you hadn't realized it before, you should know by now: Wintel is pushing up daisies; it's pining for the fjords; it's an ex-alliance.

And bringing out a new operating system will somehow change this? I understand that radical change is needed to get Microsoft back on track after the Windows 8 derailment, but I'm afraid the company is only going to further alienate its once locked-in customer base.

The company will be asking home users and CIOs to make yet another jump to yet another desktop experience in rapid succession. I don't think they're going to follow Microsoft again.

As it is, an alarming number are still hanging on to Windows XP or Windows 7 tooth and nail. When those folks do move, they seem more likely to move to smartphones, tablets or Chromebooks.

So what should Microsoft do? I think it should pull a page from its past. In 2008, Linux netbooks started carving into Windows' market share. Back then, Vista was the dead whale on the beach that no one wanted stinking up their offices. So the boys from Redmond brought XP back from the grave and gave it away to OEMs.

They can't do that now. XP is more than 12 years old at this point, and it's creaking too much for one more curtain call.

What Microsoft could do, though, is overhaul Windows 7. Users don't want Windows 8's "Metro" interface, but they do still want Windows 7, with its Aero interface.

So why not give it to them? Maybe Microsoft can't bring itself to abandon Metro just yet. Fine. Just make it an option, not a requirement. I'll bet users will flock back to a Windows that feels like "real" Windows to them.

Yes, it will be embarrassing, but which would you rather be, Microsoft? Red-faced, or fading to irrelevance in a world where Windows is no longer the dominant end-user operating system?
http://www.computerworld.com/s/artic...9&pageNumber=1
Old 01-16-2014, 12:42 PM
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I, too, consider W8 to be a rehash of the debacles with Windows ME and Vista. I skipped those OSs and will skip W8 as well. it just does not offer me any advantages. Count me in as one waiting eagerly to see what they come up with next.
Old 01-16-2014, 12:49 PM
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It's still amazing how many users are still running XP.
Old 01-16-2014, 01:01 PM
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I think W7 was a great leap forward from XP (esp in x64) however I can certainly see the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mindset from those who continue to use XP. Plus it was so stable a lot of programs/apps were designed specifically for it (so much so that W7 has XP mode baked right in).
Old 01-16-2014, 06:52 PM
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But Stunna told me 8 was great. Thanks Stunna!

But seriously, does Microsoft really expect end users to tolerate major UI changes with each iteration of the OS?

It's easy to see why Mac OS X is successful. They rarely make major changes to the GUI. Sure they may add some buttons or add something new, but the things you used in the last release of OS X are probably in the same place in the latest version. I've been playing with some Linux distros and they are like a breath of fresh air compared to Windows 8. I'm probably going to put Linux Mint on a used Dell Precision Workstation that just showed up at my door. (Dual quad core xeon FTW)

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Old 01-16-2014, 07:05 PM
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Windows 8.1 + Start8 ($5) = a great USEABLE Windows experience that looks like Windows 7 or XP. Up to you.
Old 01-16-2014, 07:05 PM
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As an OS, Windows 8 is most definitely a step up from Windows 7. The Windows 8 interface has proven to be very unpopular, but the underlying OS is indeed very good. Anyone that says Windows 8 is worse than Vista is just clueless.

MS clearly under-estimated how much people hate change and how incapable of assimulation the average Joe is. This, coupled with MS' desire to become more touch screen friendly turned out to be the downfall of Windows 8.
Old 01-16-2014, 07:20 PM
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It's not a matter of 'hating change'. There is simply nothing logical about revamping the entire UI of something that worked well enough before for millions of users.
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Old 01-16-2014, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Ken1997TL
It's not a matter of 'hating change'. There is simply nothing logical about revamping the entire UI of something that worked well enough before for millions of users.
Thank Thank Thank Thank



I have been a loyal Stardock user for years! ObjectDock is on most of my personal use machines.
Old 01-17-2014, 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Ken1997TL
Windows 8.1 + Start8 ($5) = a great USEABLE Windows experience that looks like Windows 7 or XP. Up to you.


Though 8.1 is a vast better version then 8. Once you deleted a bunch of crap.
I have regular 8.1 pro recently installed on a 4Gb RAM, quad core that's 5 years old & it's running pretty good.
Does everything I need it too.
MS clearly under-estimated how much people hate change and how incapable of assimulation the average Joe is. This, coupled with MS' desire to become more touch screen friendly turned out to be the downfall of Windows 8.
The tiles work so much better with a touch screen. What idiot at MS decided to release 8 on everything not with a touch screen? I hope they no longer work there...

Last edited by fuzzy02CLS; 01-17-2014 at 06:39 PM.
Old 01-18-2014, 02:18 AM
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I have too many of my clients who won't upgrade their computers because of Windows 8. Im starting to agree that there is 0 reason why MS should have pushed the metro UI out. It does nothing but confuse people and gives no value. Yes, 8 is faster and more secure then 7, but most users don't care about that. Windows 9 needs to come out fast and look a lot like Windows 7 with the performance and security of 8 and maybe the option to run metro apps...maybe...
Old 01-18-2014, 09:17 AM
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So I assume Windows 9 will = Server 2015?

Does anyone know if companies are deploying 2012 or sticking with 2008? In my group we have some test mules running around but nothing in QA or Prod. It requires teams of employees to be retrained. I guess if we added on one of those 3rd party start buttons it would help with the transition. 2012 has a lot of nice remote management options but really we can still get by with 2008. The Hyper-V in 2012 has a lot of nice improvements. It's almost a serious VMWare competitor now.

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Old 01-18-2014, 05:45 PM
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Originally Posted by fuzzy02CLS

The tiles work so much better with a touch screen. What idiot at MS decided to release 8 on everything not with a touch screen? I hope they no longer work there...
He doesn't, he was fired shortly after the release of Windows 8

Hence why the start button came back in 8.1 and the start menu will probably come back in 9 in some form.

Sad, that star dock found a better way to integrate metro into the desktop than ms did. Start8 + Modern Mix (which allows you to run metro apps in a window on the desktop) are what MS is rumored to do in 9

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Old 01-18-2014, 08:20 PM
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Does anyone know if companies are deploying 2012 or sticking with 2008?
The contract work I have been doing the last year has it at 2008. I have yet to encounter anyone running 2012. I have a copy of 12 though for my own testing. haven't yet touched it...maybe next few weeks.
Old 01-19-2014, 03:19 AM
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Originally Posted by #1 STUNNA
He doesn't, he was fired shortly after the release of Windows 8...
Sinofsky fired? That's a stretch...

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Old 01-19-2014, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Whiskers
I have too many of my clients who won't upgrade their computers because of Windows 8. Im starting to agree that there is 0 reason why MS should have pushed the metro UI out. It does nothing but confuse people and gives no value. Yes, 8 is faster and more secure then 7, but most users don't care about that. Windows 9 needs to come out fast and look a lot like Windows 7 with the performance and security of 8 and maybe the option to run metro apps...maybe...
Why they couldn't let the OS be self aware of hardware is totally beyond me. If there is a touch screen, offer Metro as a CHOICE. if no touch screen, no metro offered (but selectable as an option).

The real issue IMO was that MS got greedy and wanted to force everyone into the MS app store for added app marketshare.
Old 01-19-2014, 12:09 PM
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I don't so much mind the metro interface. You can hit a checkbox to boot into the desktop. What drives me batshit is that once you get to the desktop, it's unusable. I'm going to give that Start8 a try.
Old 01-19-2014, 12:23 PM
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I asked my wife why she hates 8, she gave an example about how she cant reboot without turning the computer off and on again. I tried to tell her how to reboot and she didn't want to hear it....Thats why MS did wrong...
Old 01-22-2014, 01:35 PM
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There are features i STILL miss from XP that MS decided to ignore...

Currently on w7 explorer there is no way to display or sort folders by size. XP was the last OS with that as a column option. Thanks MS, apparently no one need to see the sizes of folders anymore without right clicking or hoovering over 50 of them one at a time.
Old 01-22-2014, 01:39 PM
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Hmm, never noticed....
Old 01-22-2014, 01:46 PM
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http://www.classicshell.net

Old 01-22-2014, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by stogie1020
There are features i STILL miss from XP that MS decided to ignore...

Currently on w7 explorer there is no way to display or sort folders by size. XP was the last OS with that as a column option. Thanks MS, apparently no one need to see the sizes of folders anymore without right clicking or hoovering over 50 of them one at a time.
The explorer search function was better in XP, IMO. I used to be able to flip a few options in search to specify what I wanted. Now we are left with using that stupid search box with a bunch of switches.

You want to find a file named test.txt? You better put filename:test.txt or you will get a bunch of useless crap back. Need to find files modified in a certain date range? In xp you hit a few radio buttons. In Win 7 you need to be a search ninja to do that.

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Old 01-22-2014, 03:01 PM
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^agreed.

The mere fact they REMOVED the ability to display and sort a directory listing by folder size is redic.
Old 01-22-2014, 03:07 PM
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Originally Posted by doopstr
The explorer search function was better in XP, IMO. I used to be able to flip a few options in search to specify what I wanted. Now we are left with using that stupid search box with a bunch of switches.

You want to find a file named test.txt? You better put filename:test.txt or you will get a bunch of useless crap back. Need to find files modified in a certain date range? In xp you hit a few radio buttons. In Win 7 you need to be a search ninja to do that.
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/peterlau/arc...edirected=true
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Old 01-22-2014, 06:23 PM
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Holy shitballs! CNTRL-F wtf

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Old 01-23-2014, 02:19 AM
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lol
Old 08-22-2014, 12:50 AM
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Windows 9 to be revealed on Sept. 30?

http://www.theverge.com/2014/8/21/60...vent-september

Microsoft set to unveil Windows 9 on September 30th

Microsoft is planning to unveil its Windows 8 successor next month at a special press event. Sources familiar with Microsoft’s plans tell The Verge that the software maker is tentatively planning its press event for September 30th to detail upcoming changes to Windows as part of a release codenamed "Threshold." This date may change, but the Threshold version of Windows is currently in development and Microsoft plans to release a preview version of what will likely be named Windows 9 to developers on September 30th or shortly afterwards. The date follows recent reports from ZDNet that suggested Microsoft is planning to release a preview version of Windows 9 in late September or early October.

The early technology preview will give developers a first look at the new mini Start Menu in Windows 9, alongside the removal of the Charms bar feature and several UI changes. Microsoft is currently compiling builds of Threshold ready for the preview that include an early version of Cortana, but it’s not clear if this particular feature will be made available as part of the technology preview.

While Threshold is likely to be named Windows 9, it’s unlikely that Microsoft will name its upcoming Windows release at its press event. Instead, Microsoft is said to be planning an overview of key new features of the upcoming operating system, with a technical preview ready for developers and enthusiasts. Microsoft is also building a separate combined version of Windows RT and Windows Phone, and the company may take the time to detail this work during its press event. Either way, Microsoft’s next version of Windows is nearing completion and the company will be ready to talk more about it next month.
Old 08-22-2014, 11:37 PM
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My finger is hovering over the "buy" button for an ASUS Transformer Book right now. I don't need it right away - so I'm interested in seeing how a Win9 upgrade would cost / turn out.
Old 08-23-2014, 01:17 PM
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It's rumored to be free upgrade

If so that'd probably only be for a limited time
Old 08-26-2014, 10:56 AM
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Windows 9 to include interactive Live Tiles as Microsoft aims to revamp the desktop
Microsoft is still busy readying its upcoming technology preview of Windows 9, but details continue to emerge about the company's plans for the future of Windows. WinBeta reports that Windows 9 will include interactive Live Tiles and a notification center. Microsoft has previously experimented with interactive Live Tiles as part of a research effort earlier this year, and The Verge understands it's planning to include this work in Windows 9, currently codenamed Threshold. The Live Tile work, which is surfaced on the new mini Start Menu, coincides with additional changes to the desktop UI that Microsoft is currently testing. A notification center will also be present, similar to the implementation in Windows Phone 8.1 recently.

TECHNOLOGY PREVIEW WILL NOT INCLUDE INTERACTIVE LIVE TILES INITIALLY

Both of these features are expected to ship in the final version of Windows Threshold, expected to be named Windows 9, but they will not be included in the Technology Preview that's due to be distributed late next month. Sources familiar with Microsoft's plans tell The Verge that the company will be updating the Technology Preview once or twice a month to add new features for testers, and the notification center and interactive Live Tiles will come later in testing.



An example of interactive Live Tiles from earlier this year

Microsoft is currently aiming to hold a press event to introduce Windows 9 on September 30th. This date may change, but a Technology Preview of the operating system will be distributed to developers and enterprise users in late September or early October. The early Technology Preview will provide a first look at the new mini Start Menu, the removal of the Charms bar feature, and several UI changes to the way the desktop operates with Windows 8-style applications. Future versions are expected to include a version of Cortana, alongside other new features that Microsoft is working to complete ready for release in spring next year.
http://t.co/cwqYGxEAFN
Old 08-26-2014, 10:59 AM
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I'm just stoked for those interactive live tiles to come to Windows Phone
Old 08-26-2014, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by fuzzy02CLS
The contract work I have been doing the last year has it at 2008. I have yet to encounter anyone running 2012. I have a copy of 12 though for my own testing. haven't yet touched it...maybe next few weeks.
We use 2012 at my office somewhat sparingly. It's not particularly better than Server 2008 R2 SP1. In fact, in a server environment, the metro pieces of Windows 8.1 which help improve usability in the personal realm are much more of a hassle when it comes to running a server, IMHO.
Old 08-27-2014, 09:38 AM
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Classic Shell works for Server 2012
Old 09-14-2014, 11:56 AM
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There's been some leaked videos lately showing of the start menu, multiple desktops, and notification center.

<center style="font-family:Verdana;font-size:14px;"><iframe frameborder="0" allowfullscreen width="970" height="544" src="http://winfuture.de/video/embed/12912.html"></iframe><br/><a style="color:black;" href="http://winfuture.de/videos/Software/Windows-9-Startmenue-geht-auch-ganz-ohne-Live-Tiles-12912.html">Windows 9: Startmen&uuml; geht auch ganz ohne Live Tiles</a></center><br/>




The thing I liked was the ability to close apps in the app switcher, what the fuck took so long!?
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Old 09-15-2014, 08:13 AM
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Wow, that actually looks usable.
Old 09-15-2014, 11:16 AM
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This is usual Microsoft. I can predict future successful versions: Windows 9, Windows 11, Windows 13, Windows 15.. etc.. They also have some bullshit failure in between
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Old 09-15-2014, 04:53 PM
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I dig the look of the Live Tiles being pinned in the Start Menu.


I'm perfectly okay with Win 8.1 on my PC, but I would certainly consider upgrading to 9.




Originally Posted by #1 STUNNA
It's rumored to be free upgrade

If so that'd probably only be for a limited time

Old 09-16-2014, 02:09 PM
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Bad sector anyone? My remedies were to pray, blow on it, slightly move the inner disc, and keep popping it in until it takes it. I'm so glad this is over with, lol

Old 09-17-2014, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by TeknoKing
Bad sector anyone? My remedies were to pray, blow on it, slightly move the inner disc, and keep popping it in until it takes it. I'm so glad this is over with, lol

You left out wiggling the disk up and down while in the disk drive
Old 09-17-2014, 04:11 PM
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