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Old 07-12-2010, 10:14 PM   #1
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Auto Window rollup - Install Instructions

Finally finished the install instructions for the KP Technologies Window roll-up module. Hope I didn't miss anything.

The PDF file is about 9 meg. Right mouse click on the link and choose "Save target as..." and save it to your computer.

KP Technologies Install Instructions PDF

Link to module... http://www.kptechnologies.com/products.php#/17

The module works great. Press the lock button on the key fob twice within 1.5 seconds of each other and all the windows and sunroof close. It's also nice to get out of the car, shut the door, and press the black button on the door handle and have everything close.

WARNING... If you activate the module, the windows do not have anti-pinch and will continue to try and close even if you put something in the way.

If the car is off and someone is in the car and presses the lock button twice within 1.5 seconds, all the windows are going to go up. Might not be the safest thing with kids.
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Old 07-12-2010, 10:17 PM   #2
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Old 07-13-2010, 11:55 AM   #3
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Incredible writeup, nice color pictures.
thanks,
I will do this mod!
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Old 07-13-2010, 1:51 PM   #4
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Incredible writeup, nice color pictures.
thanks,
I will do this mod!
Thanks. Just remember to test it before reinstalling the door panel. You have to hold the black button in that's on the frame of the car near the drivers seat, to simulate the door being closed.
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Old 07-15-2010, 1:59 PM   #5
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can you make video clip?
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Old 07-15-2010, 3:50 PM   #6
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can you make video clip?
Of the windows rolling up?
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Old 07-22-2010, 2:43 PM   #7
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How much cutting was involved?
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Old 07-31-2010, 10:15 AM   #8
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Attempt #1. Didn't work. Instead of tying into the pink wire, I tied into the wire that looks kind of pink. Oooops. Try again.

Attempt #2. Didn't work again. Must be the clips I was using??? Headed out now to try again...

Thanks for the instructions!

Attempt #3. Turns out in order to test functionality, the door panel has to be plugged into the 2 main wire harnesses on the door. I did that, and everything worked fine. Great mod! Great instructions!
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Old 08-01-2010, 9:47 PM   #9
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Attempt #3. Turns out in order to test functionality, the door panel has to be plugged into the 2 main wire harnesses on the door. I did that, and everything worked fine. Great mod! Great instructions!
My fault for not mentioning that, sorry. Glad you got it working!
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Old 08-17-2010, 12:18 PM   #10
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My fault for not mentioning that, sorry. Glad you got it working!
FAST4DR,

Thank you very much for your detailed instructions on this install. I actually did this install on 2 different cars over the weekend. I started with my fiancee's 2008 Honda Accord and ran into some issues until I read your posting which cleared quite a few things up for me. My TL install went very smoothly thanks to you. I did not want to disconnect the cables to the door handle because I wasn't real "comfy" about getting it back together correctly.

There are some clips on the back of the door panel that hold the door handle assembly. I just released those and the whole assembly stayed with the door and allowed me to remove the panel. I followed your instructions and 20 minutes later I was done! Thanks again for a great post!
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Old 05-25-2011, 8:34 PM   #11
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will this work on a 2010 tl
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Old 05-25-2011, 10:26 PM   #12
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I need to get this.....




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Old 06-07-2011, 7:52 PM   #13
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The green wire that connects to the door lock switch output,what color wire does it connect to. im getting like 2.5v from the pink and blue wires comming fron the plug that plugs into the power window and door lock switchs. Ive tried both wires and no luck. And with the blue wire that goes to the door lock motor ive tried the orange and bule going into the door lock motor and no luck, im positive its the blue wire, any help would be great,thanks
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Old 06-12-2011, 9:53 PM   #14
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Any help?
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Old 06-15-2011, 1:57 AM   #15
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Fast4dr! Do you have the tech package with push button start
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Old 06-23-2011, 6:21 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richs09TL View Post
The green wire that connects to the door lock switch output,what color wire does it connect to. im getting like 2.5v from the pink and blue wires comming fron the plug that plugs into the power window and door lock switchs. Ive tried both wires and no luck. And with the blue wire that goes to the door lock motor ive tried the orange and bule going into the door lock motor and no luck, im positive its the blue wire, any help would be great,thanks
For the switch output you need to find a wire that drops to 0vdc when they key is turned to the "LOCK" position in the drivers door key cylinder. The voltage, at rest, should be higher then 2.5vdc but it doesn't HAVE to be, as long as it drops to 0vdc when the key is turned.

Also, it is not a good idea to just "try" wires - use your volt meter to verify the wiring before making connections. "Guessing" can lead to problems.

As far as the blue wire goes have you verified it with a volt meter? The HM20 window module, assuming it's less then a year or two old, has an undocumented diagnostic LED inside the unit. If you look through opening where the wires come out you should be able to see the LED flash every time the doors are power locked (from remote or interior switch). You can use this "trick" to verify that the blue door lock wire is hooked up properly.

The LED will also come on and stay on for the duration of the roll up cycle with the module is properly triggered. You can use this knowledge to verify if the green wire isn't not hooked up properly or of you just not triggering the module properly.
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Old 06-23-2011, 7:13 AM   #17
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I have the tech package, its push button start! Is it not compatible?
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Old 06-23-2011, 9:35 AM   #18
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I have the tech package, its push button start! Is it not compatible?
Neither of those should be an issue assuming you can raise the windows with the key in the drivers door key cylinder (turn and release to lock, then turn and hold in lock position).

The different packages may bring different wire colors which is why you need to verify everything with a volt meter before making connections.
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Old 07-27-2011, 1:41 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msmith56 View Post
FAST4DR,

Thank you very much for your detailed instructions on this install. I actually did this install on 2 different cars over the weekend. I started with my fiancee's 2008 Honda Accord and ran into some issues until I read your posting which cleared quite a few things up for me. My TL install went very smoothly thanks to you. I did not want to disconnect the cables to the door handle because I wasn't real "comfy" about getting it back together correctly.

There are some clips on the back of the door panel that hold the door handle assembly. I just released those and the whole assembly stayed with the door and allowed me to remove the panel. I followed your instructions and 20 minutes later I was done! Thanks again for a great post!
How similar was the Accord wiring to the TL's ?
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Old 04-28-2012, 12:37 PM   #20
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I'm trying to install the KP window roll-up module in my 2012 TL. I've wired everything according to this how-to but it doesn't work. I think the skinny pink wire in my 2012 might not be the right wire to connect the output green wire to from the module. It's hard to tell from the photo in the how-to, but it looks like the pink wire in the 09 TL is on the opposite side of the connector from the turquoise one whereas on my 2012 TL the skinny pink wire is right next to the turquoise one.

So, I'm having trouble finding the wire that goes to ground when the door cylinder lock switch is activated. Any pointers?
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Old 04-28-2012, 1:43 PM   #21
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I found a wire on the opposite side of the turquoise - it's a skinny yellow one. It seems to float near 5V until the cylinder is turned in the lock direction and then it goes to near 0V. When I unlock with the cylinder it pops up to near 12V for about 10 seconds then floats down to near 5V. But it definitely goes to near 0V when I lock with the cylinder.

Seems to the right one based on KP's post above. But, alas, the module still doesn't work.

I am connecting up the door lock switches and pushing in the door switch in the door frame for testing. I am soldering to the really skinny wire and tapping in to the other wires with PosiTaps. I have tested all the signals at the connector going to the module and all test out OK. I have studied the diagnostic LED on the module and it pulses when I lock the doors and goes steady on when it's triggered as expected.

Everything seems to work except my windows don't go up (but do with the key in the cylinder). Maybe the 2012 doesn't work the same way and the module is not compatible?
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Old 04-28-2012, 2:39 PM   #22
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It's possible that you have damaged the modules output by hooking it up wrong. The first thing I would do is unhook the KPtech green wire. Connect the green wire to the black probe of your volt meter. Touch the red probe of the volt meter to the KPtech red wire for a 12vdc reference. Hit the interior door lock button twice so that the diagnostic LED inside the module turns on and stays on. At this point check your volt meter - you should have ~12vdc. If you don't, the output has been damaged.

If you have 12vdc then the output is OK.

Do the windows go up with the key in the cylinder by turning the key to "LOCK", releasing the key, then turning and holding the key in the "LOCK" position?

One other thing you can try is to get a fuse holder with a 3A fuse in it and short the wire you think is the key cylinder to ground, release it, then short and hold it to ground and see if the windows go up (assuming that is how the windows are controlled). This would simulate the output of the module. I recommend using the fuse in case you are on the right wire and you short out something that isn't designed to short to ground!

Quote:
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I found a wire on the opposite side of the turquoise - it's a skinny yellow one. It seems to float near 5V until the cylinder is turned in the lock direction and then it goes to near 0V. When I unlock with the cylinder it pops up to near 12V for about 10 seconds then floats down to near 5V. But it definitely goes to near 0V when I lock with the cylinder.

Seems to the right one based on KP's post above. But, alas, the module still doesn't work.

I am connecting up the door lock switches and pushing in the door switch in the door frame for testing. I am soldering to the really skinny wire and tapping in to the other wires with PosiTaps. I have tested all the signals at the connector going to the module and all test out OK. I have studied the diagnostic LED on the module and it pulses when I lock the doors and goes steady on when it's triggered as expected.

Everything seems to work except my windows don't go up (but do with the key in the cylinder). Maybe the 2012 doesn't work the same way and the module is not compatible?
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Old 04-28-2012, 2:42 PM   #23
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Thanks for the help, KP. I'll try your suggestion to check the module but first I want to report something:

I cannot find a wire that pulses to 0V with the door lock cylinder key in the lock position and floats up when the key is in rest position. I can find a wire that does the opposite - goes to 0V with the key in the unlock position. That's clearly how the car module knows when to lower the windows. Right now I cannot figure out how the power door/window module knows when you're turning the key to lock - I simply cannot find a signal that indicates that. There's only the yellow wire that goes to 0V when the key is turned to lock but it stays at 0V.
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Old 04-28-2012, 2:45 PM   #24
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The manual door lock switch has a sensor on it - if you arm the alarm, wait 60 seconds, then manually unlock the door it will set the alarm off - that is most likely what the yellow wire is.

Is it possible to trace any wires to the actual key cylinder? If the key raises the windows there has to be a wire connected to it.
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Old 04-28-2012, 2:46 PM   #25
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Do the windows go up with the key in the cylinder by turning the key to "LOCK", releasing the key, then turning and holding the key in the "LOCK" position
Yes, indeed they do. There must be a wire/signal to tell the controller that the key is in lock position versus neutral position but back probing every wire has not led me to find the one that indicates that the key is in the lock position.
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Old 04-28-2012, 2:53 PM   #26
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If you can't find a wire that goes to 0vdc when the key is in the "lock" position see if you can find one that does the opposite - goes to 12vdc in the "lock" position. This would be a "better" way of controlling the disarm and window roll down feature and maybe Honda "upgraded"?
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Old 04-28-2012, 3:22 PM   #27
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Wow, this is really a PITA. I pulled the plastic sheeting to trace the harness to the lock handle. I opened the harness and of course the wires are all different colors in there compared to the at the connector. Somewhere in the harness in the door, the wires must change color.

I poked at each wire, compromising the insulation, with a pin and measured for voltage. I can't even find the unlock one there let alone a lock one.

I need to take a break and think this through. I've been at it for hours and my back hurts. It's barely above freezing here too. I think I'll put it all together and try again another day. :-(
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Old 04-28-2012, 10:06 PM   #28
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BartmanEH, you really need the service manual to continue.

It is very easy to damage something electrically, if you blindly probing around all the wiring.
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Old 04-29-2012, 8:27 AM   #29
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I agree that a Service Manual (FSM) would be golden at this point. I have access to Mitchell OnDemand up to 2010 but there is no electronic copy of the FSM for the 4G TL. The only thing available for 2012 is the Helm book and at $195 I haven't popped on it yet.

It's pretty hard to damage anything by poking around with a high impedance volt meter. I would also point out that KP has provided some really great advice on doing diagnostics by using a fused jumper etc. The worst I've done so far is compromise insulation with probe pinholes - electrical tape fixed those and I did break the tiny yellow wire which I soldered back together and electrical taped.

I did try connecting the KP Roll-up Module's output to two different wires so far and neither worked. The first one was based on this thread's instructions which by all odds should've worked since my TL is a 4G TL just a different year. I agree I took risk there and I would point out that KP advises against this. He very clearly advises to measure everything with a volt meter first. If you do this, it is all but impossible to damage anything.

Since I suspect there are wiring differences in the door between the 09-11 TL and my 2012 TL, my Mitchell OnDemand is useless as it's too old for my 2012. Maybe I can cajole the dealer into showing me their online FSM info for the wiring harness in the door. They're always a PITA about doing that and start yammering at me about voiding warranty etc.

I want to summarize so far by stating that although I'm frustrated with the process of this mod install, I only blame myself and my newer 2012 TL and not KP Technologies. I think KP has designed a great module and he provides really excellent support. I posted my cry for help and within 2 hours KP was on here helping me. Wow, that's really awesome.
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Old 04-29-2012, 8:56 AM   #30
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I grabbed the part of the schematic for the 09/10 TL concerning the door lock circuit from Mitchell OnDemand:
Click the image to open in full size.

Here's a photo I took of the wiring harness near the driver's side door handle:
Click the image to open in full size.

The colors seem to match between the schematic from Mitchell and the photo I took. I cannot figure out how it's supposed to work. There are several anomolies:

[1] In the schematic, there's wiring for the passenger side door lock switch. Do the pre-2012 TL's have a key cylinder in the passenger door? My 2012 doesn't.

[2] There's only one wire for the door lock cylinder switch - the GRY one on the driver's side. How does the car sense turning the key in the lock versus unlock position?
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Old 04-29-2012, 9:45 AM   #31
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OK, I figured out how it's supposed to work for the pre-2012. The schematic posted above shows the exterior Lock Button circuit in the handle - not the key cylinder position sense circuit.

Here's the other part of the schematic showing the key cylinder circuit:
Click the image to open in full size.
Here it clearly shows that the PNK (pink) wire is the correct one as per the OP's How-To. So the pink wire is in the same connector at the door lock motor where the blue wire is that we connect the Roll-Up Module's Blue wire to for Door Lock Motor Input. The other end of the pink wire is in the big harness connector where the OP shows his connection to it.

So now I need to figure out why it doesn't work in my 2012. There must be something different in how the circuit works in the 2012 TL versus the pre-2012.
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Old 04-29-2012, 9:54 AM   #32
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One other thing to possibly check is for the presence of an analog voltage on the unlock wire. Some cars like to use simple voltage dividers for simple circuits. For instance, unlock would be a signal straight to ground while lock would be a signal to ground through a 470 ohm resistor. Perhaps they multiplexed the signal?
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Old 04-29-2012, 12:01 PM   #33
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How does the Roll-Up Module's Blue wire trigger the module : +12V or Gnd ?

Is the factory pink wire giving a compatible-polarity signal out ?

A forum member posted last week that Helm had now available the 2012 factory service manual, and one can pay a $10 charge to browse though the stuff for a day or something. See if it'll help.

Last edited by Edward'TLS; 04-29-2012 at 12:04 PM.
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Old 04-29-2012, 12:06 PM   #34
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The Roll-Up Module's Blue output works by being high impedance normally and low impedance to ground when triggered to simulate what the key cylinder does in the lock position.

I can't recall precisely what the pink wire is doing in my car. IIRC it is sitting at about 2.5V all the time even when the door is locked or unlocked from the key or remote.

This is the source of my trouble. I don't think the signal in my car is compatible. I'll have to check again next time I take the door apart.
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Old 05-01-2012, 8:14 AM   #35
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A forum member posted last week that Helm had now available the 2012 factory service manual, and one can pay a $10 charge to browse though the stuff for a day or something. See if it'll help.
LOL, that was you and me over at this thread.

There's only a hard copy available - no online access... yet.
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Old 05-01-2012, 1:19 PM   #36
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you have to buy one module for each door right?
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Old 05-01-2012, 2:22 PM   #37
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No, you only need one module. It simulates what happens when you use the key in the door and turn it twice to roll up the windows and close the moon roof. You only need one key in the driver's door to close all windows hence you only need one module to do the same thing with the remote fob.
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Old 05-01-2012, 4:07 PM   #38
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How does this work with the 2012 TLs with push to start? When I double press and hold my unlock key, my windows roll down. If I do it again with this module, will they roll back up? That would be pretty useful.
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Old 05-01-2012, 5:55 PM   #39
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How does this work with the 2012 TLs with push to start? When I double press and hold my unlock key, my windows roll down. If I do it again with this module, will they roll back up? That would be pretty useful.
really... your going to ask that question.. when this thread is full of answer.. specifically to your question..
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Old 05-01-2012, 6:31 PM   #40
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How does this work with the 2012 TLs with push to start? When I double press and hold my unlock key, my windows roll down. If I do it again with this module, will they roll back up? That would be pretty useful.
Sigh....
KP Technologies Window roll up module install 3G Garage #I-097
WINDOW ROLL-UP MODULE (HONDA/ACURA)

Back to reality...
If anyone has info about installing this in the 2012 version, please chime in. I'm still looking for an opportunity to ask the dealer to show me the schematic of the 2012 to see if it's different from 09-11.

KP, thanks for your help. FYI it's raining and generally pretty foul weather here and I don't have a garage so I can't take the door apart again for a while. I'm going to arm myself with schematic info from the dealer and then take measurements again in the door maybe this weekend.
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