Acura: TLX News
04-23-2014, 10:08 AM
#8722
Azine Jabroni
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VR1 (04-23-2014)
04-23-2014, 10:11 AM
#8723
takin care of Business in
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If the car is worth waiting for...
I am eagerly awaiting 2 cars...
1> Hyundai Genesis....now the new model is effin awesome....I hate buying the first year models since they work the issues out, so am awaiting the 2016 model which will launch around May/June 2015
2> Infiniti Eau Rogue....dont think this needs an explanations as to why I am waiting for it...
I am eagerly awaiting 2 cars...
1> Hyundai Genesis....now the new model is effin awesome....I hate buying the first year models since they work the issues out, so am awaiting the 2016 model which will launch around May/June 2015
2> Infiniti Eau Rogue....dont think this needs an explanations as to why I am waiting for it...
04-23-2014, 10:12 AM
#8724
Aren't they typically called 'waiting lists'? That's the equivalent of automotive 'lines'.
04-23-2014, 10:18 AM
#8725
Azine Jabroni
04-23-2014, 10:20 AM
#8726
Moderator
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04-23-2014, 10:28 AM
#8727
takin care of Business in
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04-23-2014, 10:38 AM
#8728
The Third Ball
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CarbonGray Earl (04-23-2014)
04-23-2014, 10:42 AM
#8729
Some dude
04-23-2014, 10:57 AM
#8730
04-23-2014, 11:29 AM
#8731
Azine Jabroni
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ttribe (04-23-2014)
04-23-2014, 02:14 PM
#8733
Senior Moderator
This delay needs to be for a MMC.
04-24-2014, 01:19 PM
#8734
You'll Never Walk Alone
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Let's not get into this because it is going to be the longest debate ever.
But FYI depends on the size of the turbo and the way the engine is setup. when you are going 20, 40, or 60, in the appropriate gear (assuming it is 6mt), the throttle response is immediate without any turbo lag.
Turbo lag is usually associated in lower RPM with small displacement engines with turbo that is too big. It is inevitable if the goal is to have high speed runs with big power. Most of the current production FI cars ATS, 3 series and etc.. have turbo that is so small that they barely qualify as FI just for 1 purpose - minimize any turbo lag to improve low end torque for better fuel consumption.
That is especially true nowadays with cars that have sport and Sport+ mode, where the throttle response feels like s2000 in 3rd at 5000 rpm.
But FYI depends on the size of the turbo and the way the engine is setup. when you are going 20, 40, or 60, in the appropriate gear (assuming it is 6mt), the throttle response is immediate without any turbo lag.
Turbo lag is usually associated in lower RPM with small displacement engines with turbo that is too big. It is inevitable if the goal is to have high speed runs with big power. Most of the current production FI cars ATS, 3 series and etc.. have turbo that is so small that they barely qualify as FI just for 1 purpose - minimize any turbo lag to improve low end torque for better fuel consumption.
That is especially true nowadays with cars that have sport and Sport+ mode, where the throttle response feels like s2000 in 3rd at 5000 rpm.
Now if you are talking about picking the appropriate gear, I'm assuming that's when the engine is in its sweet spot (or range). In that case, hp comes into play and that determines how fast a car is assuming all other factors are similar. What I mean is that a 200hp/200lbft car wouldn't be much, if any faster than a 200hp/150lbft car. Using the S2k as an example like you did, even though it only has 153lbft of torque, it still accelerates like a 240hp car with 2800lb of weight. This is why I think a 206hp/182lbft TLX might not be that much slower than say a 211hp/258lbft A4. The only reason the A4 is faster is mostly due to it being underrated - namely it's making more like 230hp at the crank or something.
04-24-2014, 01:54 PM
#8735
Team Owner
It does not have to be at the sweet spot for turbo cars, that is the difference.
When the car makes at 250, 300 lbs of torque at 2k rpm, you can accelerate pretty much from any speed = similar acceleration "feel" you get in the "sweet' of NA cars.
Another HUGE difference is you can accelerate comfortable in 6th gear going 40mph with cars equip with tiny turbos. Something you can't do in Honda's NA engines, well you can but it sucks.
The point is, both N/A and FI cars will get the job done if pushed. But for everyday driving certain engines are better fitted for certain cars.
N/A engines is definitely more rewarding to drive and i prefer it myself but now you can get V8 performance and torque with V6/I6 fuel consumption nowadays in these mass produced family sedan, Why not? It is not so much about giving in to BMW or anyone.
It is 2014, get with the program.
When the car makes at 250, 300 lbs of torque at 2k rpm, you can accelerate pretty much from any speed = similar acceleration "feel" you get in the "sweet' of NA cars.
Another HUGE difference is you can accelerate comfortable in 6th gear going 40mph with cars equip with tiny turbos. Something you can't do in Honda's NA engines, well you can but it sucks.
The point is, both N/A and FI cars will get the job done if pushed. But for everyday driving certain engines are better fitted for certain cars.
N/A engines is definitely more rewarding to drive and i prefer it myself but now you can get V8 performance and torque with V6/I6 fuel consumption nowadays in these mass produced family sedan, Why not? It is not so much about giving in to BMW or anyone.
It is 2014, get with the program.
04-24-2014, 02:14 PM
#8736
I drive a Subata.
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iforyou,
PM me your address. I have a gift for you.
PM me your address. I have a gift for you.
04-24-2014, 02:14 PM
#8737
Senior Moderator
I boost. I have cables in my car in case the battery is dead. 
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00TL-P3.2 (04-24-2014)
04-24-2014, 03:35 PM
#8738
The sizzle in the Steak
^^ Boost, not jump
04-24-2014, 03:53 PM
#8739
I drive a Subata.
iTrader: (1)
Damn.
Someone take away Yummy's mod card for a day.
Someone take away Yummy's mod card for a day.
04-24-2014, 03:57 PM
#8740
Senior Moderator
04-24-2014, 04:14 PM
#8741
The sizzle in the Steak
04-24-2014, 04:17 PM
#8742
I drive a Subata.
iTrader: (1)
04-24-2014, 04:22 PM
#8743
Senior Moderator
04-24-2014, 04:25 PM
#8744
Team Owner
Hey bro, let me boost your car... Nah
04-24-2014, 04:27 PM
#8745
Senior Moderator
04-24-2014, 04:32 PM
#8746
Senior Moderator
Okay...so, back on topic, slores.
Who's still standing in line for the TLX outside of the Acura dealesship despite the delay?
Who's still standing in line for the TLX outside of the Acura dealesship despite the delay?
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RPhilMan1 (05-01-2014)
04-24-2014, 04:38 PM
#8747
I drive a Subata.
iTrader: (1)
Is it free?
04-24-2014, 04:45 PM
#8748
Team Owner
04-24-2014, 04:46 PM
#8749
Senior Moderator
It does not have to be at the sweet spot for turbo cars, that is the difference.
When the car makes at 250, 300 lbs of torque at 2k rpm, you can accelerate pretty much from any speed = similar acceleration "feel" you get in the "sweet' of NA cars.
Another HUGE difference is you can accelerate comfortable in 6th gear going 40mph with cars equip with tiny turbos. Something you can't do in Honda's NA engines, well you can but it sucks.
The point is, both N/A and FI cars will get the job done if pushed. But for everyday driving certain engines are better fitted for certain cars.
N/A engines is definitely more rewarding to drive and i prefer it myself but now you can get V8 performance and torque with V6/I6 fuel consumption nowadays in these mass produced family sedan, Why not? It is not so much about giving in to BMW or anyone.
It is 2014, get with the program.
When the car makes at 250, 300 lbs of torque at 2k rpm, you can accelerate pretty much from any speed = similar acceleration "feel" you get in the "sweet' of NA cars.
Another HUGE difference is you can accelerate comfortable in 6th gear going 40mph with cars equip with tiny turbos. Something you can't do in Honda's NA engines, well you can but it sucks.
The point is, both N/A and FI cars will get the job done if pushed. But for everyday driving certain engines are better fitted for certain cars.
N/A engines is definitely more rewarding to drive and i prefer it myself but now you can get V8 performance and torque with V6/I6 fuel consumption nowadays in these mass produced family sedan, Why not? It is not so much about giving in to BMW or anyone.
It is 2014, get with the program.
Though its no where near as fun as putting it into 2nd at 40 
04-24-2014, 05:10 PM
#8750
Team Owner
04-24-2014, 05:30 PM
#8751
Instructor
Another HUGE difference is you can accelerate comfortable in 6th gear going 40mph with cars equip with tiny turbos. Something you can't do in Honda's NA engines, well you can but it sucks.
The point is, both N/A and FI cars will get the job done if pushed. But for everyday driving certain engines are better fitted for certain cars.
N/A engines is definitely more rewarding to drive and i prefer it myself but now you can get V8 performance and torque with V6/I6 fuel consumption nowadays in these mass produced family sedan, Why not? It is not so much about giving in to BMW or anyone.
It is 2014, get with the program.
The point is, both N/A and FI cars will get the job done if pushed. But for everyday driving certain engines are better fitted for certain cars.
N/A engines is definitely more rewarding to drive and i prefer it myself but now you can get V8 performance and torque with V6/I6 fuel consumption nowadays in these mass produced family sedan, Why not? It is not so much about giving in to BMW or anyone.
It is 2014, get with the program.
04-24-2014, 05:36 PM
#8752
Team Owner
Turbos still have their sweet spot, for example the Mazdaspeed3 has a totally wonky power band where it basically only makes torque at 3k-5.5k and everywhere else it's useless, but every engine whether it's NA or turbo has their own characteristics like that. Honda's K24 is nice because the torque is relatively flat throughout its rev range, somewhat like the FRS/BRZ boxer engine. The way I would describe a turbo vs. N/A with the same hp is one is a shower, the other a grower.
This I agree with, but it seems that turbos have a hard time living up to their MPG ratings in the real world.
This I agree with, but it seems that turbos have a hard time living up to their MPG ratings in the real world.
imagine if Vtec opens at 2 or 3k rpm.....
So far all the turbo cars i have driven within he past 2-3 years have achieved its advertised MPG......... ONLY on the way to Vegas.
I am not going to sacrifice the car to get 2-3 MPG more. It can be done but No i don't want to.
Last edited by oonowindoo; 04-24-2014 at 05:47 PM.
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RPhilMan1 (05-01-2014)
04-24-2014, 05:45 PM
#8753
I drive a Subata.
iTrader: (1)
Turbos still have their sweet spot, for example the Mazdaspeed3 has a totally wonky power band where it basically only makes torque at 3k-5.5k and everywhere else it's useless, but every engine whether it's NA or turbo has their own characteristics like that. Honda's K24 is nice because the torque is relatively flat throughout its rev range, somewhat like the FRS/BRZ boxer engine. The way I would describe a turbo vs. N/A with the same hp is one is a shower, the other a grower.
N/A don't have that luxury.
F/I have the option to get a very good mileage if you stay out of the boost. And people typically have this misunderstanding of boosted cars not making any power out of the boost range. They DO make more than adequate power even out of the boost range for daily driving.
The biggest difference maker for real world MPG rating is your right foot. The brands aren't lying about the MPG efficiency of the boosted cars.
04-24-2014, 05:49 PM
#8754
Team Owner
Yep. That's the thing. The boosted engines are extremely easy to tweak. Most of them can be easily adjusted to make the power all the way to the top to certain extent for like $500-600. I've owned/researched thoroughly on MS3 and A4.
N/A don't have that luxury.
Yes, that's because you get the worst MPG when you are always on the boost range.
F/I have the option to get a very good mileage if you stay out of the boost. And people typically have this misunderstanding of boosted cars not making any power out of the boost range. They DO make more than adequate power even out of the boost range for daily driving.
The biggest difference maker for real world MPG rating is your right foot. The brands aren't lying about the MPG efficiency of the boosted cars.
N/A don't have that luxury.
Yes, that's because you get the worst MPG when you are always on the boost range.
F/I have the option to get a very good mileage if you stay out of the boost. And people typically have this misunderstanding of boosted cars not making any power out of the boost range. They DO make more than adequate power even out of the boost range for daily driving.
The biggest difference maker for real world MPG rating is your right foot. The brands aren't lying about the MPG efficiency of the boosted cars.
04-24-2014, 06:06 PM
#8755
I drive a Subata.
iTrader: (1)
04-24-2014, 06:25 PM
#8756
The sizzle in the Steak
Like he said stay out of boost.
Boost is not RPM dependent.
Engine is operating in a "vacuum" at highway speed with light throttle input....no boost.......even though the engine speed may be 3000 RPM.
04-24-2014, 06:30 PM
#8757
Team Owner
i know.
how about local? where i spent 50% of the time going from light to light?
The computer tells me i am getting 15 mpg the moment i step on the gas in 1st haha.
how about local? where i spent 50% of the time going from light to light?
The computer tells me i am getting 15 mpg the moment i step on the gas in 1st haha.
04-25-2014, 12:25 PM
#8758
You'll Never Walk Alone
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It does not have to be at the sweet spot for turbo cars, that is the difference.
When the car makes at 250, 300 lbs of torque at 2k rpm, you can accelerate pretty much from any speed = similar acceleration "feel" you get in the "sweet' of NA cars.
Another HUGE difference is you can accelerate comfortable in 6th gear going 40mph with cars equip with tiny turbos. Something you can't do in Honda's NA engines, well you can but it sucks.
The point is, both N/A and FI cars will get the job done if pushed. But for everyday driving certain engines are better fitted for certain cars.
N/A engines is definitely more rewarding to drive and i prefer it myself but now you can get V8 performance and torque with V6/I6 fuel consumption nowadays in these mass produced family sedan, Why not? It is not so much about giving in to BMW or anyone.
It is 2014, get with the program.
When the car makes at 250, 300 lbs of torque at 2k rpm, you can accelerate pretty much from any speed = similar acceleration "feel" you get in the "sweet' of NA cars.
Another HUGE difference is you can accelerate comfortable in 6th gear going 40mph with cars equip with tiny turbos. Something you can't do in Honda's NA engines, well you can but it sucks.
The point is, both N/A and FI cars will get the job done if pushed. But for everyday driving certain engines are better fitted for certain cars.
N/A engines is definitely more rewarding to drive and i prefer it myself but now you can get V8 performance and torque with V6/I6 fuel consumption nowadays in these mass produced family sedan, Why not? It is not so much about giving in to BMW or anyone.
It is 2014, get with the program.
Once the boost is in full swing, there's an awesome shove in the back whether you are in 1st gear or 6th gear. That, I know. I have experienced it many times (friends drive 2013 or 2014 335i, a4 2.0t, x3 35i, 528i, etc). For sure, you can't get it with a NA engine that makes much less torque in low rpm.
Let me put it this way, in a NA car at low rpm in a high gear (assuming in sportshift mode), if you floor it, you instantly reach the peak torque at that given rpm. It's not strong, but it's there right away. For a turbocharged car, no matter what, if you do the same (floor it at low rpm in sportshift mode), the peak torque GRADUALLY builds up within a second or so 50lbft....100lbft...200lbft...etc. The process is really fast, but it's still a gradual process. When you are in a high gear, that's alright, as your rpm wouldn't be rising that fast anyway, and the turbocharged machine can pull away easily. But if you are in 1st gear, a second later, the NA car is probably at 3000-4000rpm pulling away while the turbo car is building up boost. At the same hp level, the NA car would be ahead slightly the whole time.
lol hey man don't get me wrong...I actually like boost....
04-25-2014, 12:57 PM
#8759
Senior Moderator
I have run and pulled on a 13 335i from 30 to 130 a few times.
04-25-2014, 12:59 PM
#8760
Senior Moderator
http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=1188610
They're in deeper 
than I thought. 'Chief' engineer seems a bit lost on the technicalities but seems stronger on the BS marketing fluff...hmmmm.
They're in deeper than I thought. 'Chief' engineer seems a bit lost on the technicalities but seems stronger on the BS marketing fluff...hmmmm.