Adobeman

I whipped this one up after I found a great open source program called "Sound eXchange" (a.k.a SoX). SoX is a cool little command line tool that allows you to do all kinds of cool stuff with wav files. So I scripted up way to synthesize 5.1 channel material from 2.0 channel stuff.

Here is the run down:

• This is just for fun and laughs. I know that all it is is audio trickery. But since many had asked about it I decided I'd finally try it.
• It just makes 6channel wav files. You need to feed it 2channel wavs. It then creates all the channels using SoX and then muxes them together using BeSweet.
• I included a script called "Small Club". Think of it as trying to approximate a small bar environment. A bit of echo/delay on the SR and SL channels.
• I included a script called "Large Club". Think of it as trying to approximate a medium large bar environment. This one reminds me of hanging out in the Hard Rock Cafe once in Tijuana one day. It was lunch time and they just had regular tunes plying through the sound system. Some echo on the FR and FL and even more delay on the SR and SL channels.
• I did NOT do a straight 2.0 to 5.1 script since the TL seems to mix 2.0 stuff just fine. I figured if I was going to use up all of the disc space of 6 channels I might as well screw around with the sound.
• This is just a rough script. So you need to make sure you have enough disc space, convert any mp3s, etc.
• I have only tested on XP Pro but I don't see why it would have any trouble on Win2K.
• It tries to provide a framework that anyone can add scripts to. See the read me file.

I tried it with a bunch of different kind of tunes. Blues, sax jazz, female and male vocals, Beatles, Santana, Police and a few others. The "Large Club" is growing on me for the saxophone stuff.

I'd suggest you pick about 10 different songs and make a disc with 3 groups. One just stereo, one as small club and the other as large club. Then you decide. There is a file called "all.bat" this will run both the SmallClub and LargeClub scripts on all the files you feed it.

You can't use my other scripts to make the DVDA. Since this just creates 6ch wav files you will need to use Cirlinca DVD Audio Solo or equivalent.

Use:

• Download the scripts (link below) and unzip it.
• Put your 2 channel source in the directory called "2channelSource" and run one of the .vbs scripts in the main directory by double clicking it. The output files will be in the "multiChannelOutput" directory.
• Burn with Cirlinca DVD Audio Solo or similar that will make 6 take 6 channel wav files.

Enjoy. Get it at http://home.comcast.net/~adobeman/Ad...Adobinizer.zip

Hawhyen51

Mike, just downloaded it, installed it and haven't had time to play with it yet. I like the name "The Adobinizer", so cool! and aptly named. Darn it, now I gotta purchase Solo to burn 6 channel.

Spiritman

Mike, Thanks for the post! What do you do with 2ch audio on a DVD, I mean do you put a LFO Chanel with no data on it? I just made a DVD-A with 24b 96k 2ch stereo. When I play it back (in the TL) there is some random noise coming from the Sub. Thats why I was thinking I needed to "zero" out the LFO Chan. Ever notice this?

triggle

Great name for the new member of the Adobeman DVDA suite.

Adobeman

I use all 6 channels but just at 44.1k/16b since it is basically CD content that I am "goofing with"

• Center is manufactured as all that is common between L and R. It is then put through a bandpass of 500-3000Hz since the TL center channel driver is a small single cone. I did this so I could then redirect the content outside of that band back into the FL and FR drivers since they are wider range pairs.
• FR and FL then have the center channel content removed from them. Basically they are "pure" R and L but also have center channel content >3000Hz and less than 500Hz mixed back in.
• SL and SR are basically the stereo R and L. Various effects and high freq roll off.
• LFE is a mono version of the 2 channel input rolled off at 80Hz w/ a 3rd order filter.

That is the basic "recipe" then I f&ck with it with echo, delay, etc. to try and make it sound interesting. I also play with the gain on each channel to try and get the balance right. You may need to tweak the fader and/or sub. I think it is close though once you start rolling down the road. Parked it is a bit bassy.

Since I don't have a 5.1 setup on my pc I had to do it all by iterative approximation. Once I got it close enough passing 0db pink noise files through it also helped to establish a good way to balance the channels purely on level. It also helped me make sure I didn't clip anything. SmallClub took many tries to get right and then LargeClub was balanced using the pink noise way.

As far as all the different formats the TL will recognize, I'm not sure. I was thinking of making some test disks just to see what it might handle as far as channels and then see how it might re-direct signals when less than 6 are present.

johnny--2k

nice. Im gonna have to try this!

csmeance

thanks
sound so good on my pc, its like a concert live!!!!!
will try in da tl and reply on the niceness!!!!!!!
thanks again!!!

Adobeman

For the curious here are the flow diagrams of what's going on

• "K" is just straight gain. Used to balance out the mix.
• "1/x" = inverting the signal. Same as K= -1. Causes cancellation of signal when summed with other signals.
• "Echo/Delay X% / Y% ZmS" = X% of input signal, Y% of echo at Z milliseconds of delay.
• The 3KHz low pass filters on the RS and LS seem to make the echos more natural. Otherwise there is too much slap-back in the symbols, snare drums, etc.
• The 500Hz to 3Khz bandpass on the center channel is because the TL doesn't have a full range center driver. Anything out side of that range stays in the FL and FR signals. Arguable I know.
• The LFE has a 3rd order filter at 80Hz. I prefer a steep roll off and am trying to use it for deep low end re-enforcement at speed.

Klutch

how come nothing happens when i click one of the VBScripts....i have a song in the 2chsource

Adobeman

You say "click", but you are double-clicking...right?
1) Do you get any messages at all ?
2) Does the file in the "2channelSource" directory end in .wav ?
3) Do you have any software that might be blocking the the use of .vbs (vbscript) files ?
4)What operating system ?
5) If you do a right-click-properties on one of the .vbs files does it say "Type of File: VBScript Script File: and "Opens With: Microsoft (r) Windows Based Script Host" ? It should.

When you double click the .vbs files you should see a window open and a log like the one below start to print out to the screen.

From SmallClub.vbs script

trenz1

I just tried running your program and got this message. I put 9 wav files ripped from Dark Side of the Moon into the 2ch source folder and got this message when double clicking your scripts. Any ideas. The only thing I have done to the wavs is correct the DCoffset with EAC. Not sure if this could cause the problem. I am using XP Home SP 2. Thanks

trenz1

Adobeman, I posted the same time as your answer to the previous question. My answers are

1) yes, see above
2) yes
3) not sure
4) XP Home SP 2
5) yes

trenz1

Answered my own question by looking closely at post #10 by Adobeman. The adobinizer folder has to be on the root of C drive (not sure if this is the right terminoligy) I had originally created a folder on my desktop and just put it there but when I copied it to the C drive it ran fine.
Haven't had a chance to listen yet. Have to use headphones this late. Hope to try in the car tomorrow.

One question: would there be any advantage to converting to a sample rate of 48k and/or converting bits to 32 before running the scripts?
I was currently looking over at Doom9 to do this 2 to 5.1 conversion with methods I found there and was going to use r8brain to do the sample/bit conversions based on things I read in their forums.

Thanks

Garbage

It works! The first DVD i made was a coaster, but the second try was a success. Appearantly according to Cirlinca, there is a common enough problem to add it to the support FAQ's in that during the finalization of the DVD, it stops/errors out. That was my coaster. I did what they suggested and slowed down my burn from 16x to 8x and it appears to have worked.

I am using a LITE-ON 16x burner with TDK 16x DVD-R's... slowing it down to 8X it worked on that drive. I will try it on another burner i have installed in my pc which is a TDK 4x indi-dvd to see if that works any more smoothly.

Basically they say that "this error can happen with the newer DVD writers and discs rated at more than 8X. To solve this problem, try setting a lower speed from the list (e.g. 4X) or enter it manually. If this doesn't work, try different brands or type (e.g. DVD-R vs. DVD+R) of discs, which usually solves the problem."

I did that.. and it worked.

Thanks alot for all you are doing to help us out here do what we can to take full advantage of our DVD-A systems in our TL's considering the selection of pressed DVD-A's sucks a$$!!!

Do you have any other suggestions on software to burn the 6ch audio? I use the hell out of your ISO creation program you made and then burn with Nero, but i did as you suggested and made 3 groups... standard, small, and large.. i think i am liking the small sound best as i love live music in a small atmosphere! I did definately notice a difference in the 2 different mixes though, and you are correct.. the bass is a little heavy, but nothing a little adjustments didnt fix ( i added a sub with an 850 watt amp too, so that may be part of my problem in regards to being bass heavy)

All in all... GREAT WORK! do you accept donations or anything? Let me know!

G

Adobeman

Thanks for tha catch trenz1.

Dang ! Spaces in the path to the folder are causing it. I thought I protected for that. Grrrr.
The desktop is usually "C:\Documents and Settings\<user>\Desktop\" so that's where the spaces are coming in.

For now run from a path w/o spaces or change line #19 in both .vbs files as shown below. I'll have to put the corrections out there later tonight or tomorrow.

FROM:
Wshshell.Run workDir & "\_" & scriptName & ".bat " & """" & oFile.Path & """ """ & workdir & """" , 1, True

TO:
Wshshell.Run """" & workDir & "\_" & scriptName & ".bat"" """ & oFile.Path & """ """ & workdir & """" , 1, True

nYmALu86

Damn I want to do this so bad but I am sucha NOOB at this sort of thing. Can any of ou guys give me a simple break down of what I have to do in converting and burning what programs I need and the steps in lamen's terms. Any kind of help will be greatful. THANKS.

Adobeman

Here is a basic run down. You may already have some of it

1) A PC (Win2000 or XP is easiest) with a DVD burner. There are two basic types of DVDs "-R" and "+R". Most newer burners will do both types as well as rewritable versions (RW) of each. DVD-R tends to work more for people in the TL.

2) A program to burn DVDs with. For the scripts in this thread you will need something that can burn 6 channel audio. Cirlinca DVD Audio Solo is inexpensive ($35USD) and good at it. It will also let you rip CDs and make stereo DVDA discs. It has a really good trial too so you can make 5 or 6 discs before you buy it. It is one of the best trial options I have seen since you can really know if it works for you before you buy. And then it is inexpensive as well.

3) The free prgram called CDEx. It is a great tool for ripping CDs (accurately) and also usefull for converting mp3 files to wav files. Most programs that make DVDAs want wav files as there input, not mp3. Even if you aren't into mp3, CDEx is great tohave.

That really is the easiest way for a someone new to all of this. As you get more familiar you may choose to use my program to make DVDAs. But the truth is if you buy DVD Audio Solo you will be able to make just about any kind of DVDA disk you want.

Send me a PM if and let me know what you have and I can probably be more specific.

nYmALu86

Ok so I NEED a progam that can burn 6 channel dvd's? I just need 2 know that I have to pay for any kind of prgram rite? I have real player which I use to burn normal cd's. So I need tthat program first rite? Oh thanks again for the help Adobeman I really appreciate it.

Toronto-TL

You can buy Cirlinca's DVD Audio Solo (or trial it first) and it will create the DVD audio format and even burn it for you, although I use nero for burning and DVD Solo for creating an iso image of the disk.

I wouldn't use Real Player at all, use Adobeman's suggestion of CDEx for converting your CDs to 2 channel wave files.

FuZionBreeZe

Adobeman...I really like to try this new version that you have out right now...but I am a little bit confused...I tried your first version and I love it, appreciates all the time you put in to help us TLers...although it was a little roller coaster ride but I am use to it...my questions for this new version are:

1) Do you need to use the old version with this?
2) If not, what file do I install after unzip is done?
3) So from what I have read so far...after the installation you have to create a folder under the C: drive (2channelSource) and then double click on either small club script or large club right?
4)Also, do you know if nero 7.0 ultra is a 6 channel burner?


Thanks,
can't wait to test this baby out!!

Adobeman

Basically this is a totally separate thing from the DVD-A scripts and GUI that were part of "Project Free DVDA". These are just stand alone scripts that take 2 channel wav files and do splitting and sound effects on them to come up with a 6 channel file. All for fun and games. Arguably the TLs head unit could/should have doen this via "Sound Fields" but didn't.

Per your questions

1. You don't need the prior DVD-A scripts and GUI that were part of "Project Free DVDA"
2. Just unzip it to a directory that has no spaces in its name.
3. You should not have to create any folders. Just put 2 channel wav files in the 2channelSource directory. and double click on of the vbs files
4. Nope. Cirlinca DVD Audio Solo is your cheapest and best tool for that.

nYmALu86

Ok I'm going to try the free trial out that you suggested Adobeman. Before I do let me make sure what exactly I have to do:

- I download your program and then use winzip and unzip your fiel correct? (I should download it to my C: drive correct?)

- I have to download winzip so I can unzip your program?

- After I unzip it, does it matter where my music source is? (my music library is D:/Documents and Settings)

- Would there be a problem if the music I have are mp3 files?

- If so what steps should I take to convert the mp3 files into wav. files?

- After I download/unzip your program, do I have to place my music out of my current file and store it under a certain file?

- When I run the program and convert the 2 channel mp3's into 6 channel, where should I store it after teh process is done?

Thanks in advance Adobeman and sorry for sort of hijacking this thread with my n00b questions.

trenz1

I hope this isn't considered hijacking a thread but while setting up a project using The Adobinizer I came across something about DVD-Audio Solo that I would like to ask.

While using the demo the save to box under the dvd/disc tab was grayed out. I figured this was a limitation of the demo. I have now purchased and activated Solo and the box is still grayed out. I can use the direct to dvd, write from, and save only choices, but not the save to choice.
What do I do if I want to save and write at the same time? Am I missing a setting somewhere?

I figured between Adobeman and anyone else familiar with Solo you could help me long before I would get an answer from Cirlinca.

Thanks

Adobeman

Same thing here with an activated version. "Save To" Grayed out. Use "Save Only" and fill in file name. Make sure to put ".iso" at the end since it will not do it automatically for you. By default it saves them in the ISOUDFImages directory where the product is installed. Not sure hat "Save To" is for since "Save As" does what I need.

Seriously, don't worry about the hijacking since this thread has never materialized into a discussion of 2.0 to 5.1 up converting or the Adobinizer anyway.

Has anyone used the Small Club or Large Club script and listened to it in the car ?(Sorry about the yell)

Hey, if it sucks I can handle it. It is all for fun and games anyway. 'jus curious.

trenz1

Just finished buring my disk. Getting in the car in about 1/2 hour. I'll let you know.

trenz1

meant to add this to my last post.

Save to is supposed to save and write at the same time.

When you use save only do you get it to burn also or do you always just go to your image and burn separately?

Garbage

Yea.. i listened to small and large club in my car and i love it!

As i posted before.. i stated i liked small club the best, but i think large club is growing on me... as as i said, you were right about the bass being extra loud... but then again.. i added a sub and i like more bass so that is probably why i like it more.

I did like you stated... made 3 groups, 2ch/small/large and compared them all, and let my co-workeres listen to it also.. we all agree'd that the scripts you made make the audio in the car sound better whether it be small club or large club... i definately makes a difference!

Once again... Thanks for the awesome audio tools/tips/creations!

G

jbrychka

Thanks for this great information. I just purchased a new TL last night. I want to make DVD-A disks since the ipod link doesn't look like it's that great for the money. I downloaded the Solo software you recommended and burned a DVD+R disc. It looks like it created the disk ok because I can read it on the computer but when I put it in the TL, it spits it out. Should I try a DVD-R disk?

I was also trying to see if this would play on my computer but my DVD software doesn't seem to know what to do with a DVD audio disk. What software do I need to listen to a DVD audio disk?

Klutch

ok so lets see if i get this rite....say i want to make a dvd-a with 5.1 audio...and i used "The Adobinizer" to convert that...then can i use your other script to make the dvd-a image(GUI)...and then i need a program that will burn the image??(which is dvd audio solo)

Klutch

large club has more bass or is it the small club?

Adobeman

The Adobinzer is completely different than the other scripts and GUI. The Adobinizer only makes 6 channel wav files. You need to make a DVD-A of them using DVD Audio Solo.

They both have the LFE channel created the same way. But the difference in echo and delay on all the channels between the Small and Large might make them sound different due to phase variations.

Cool. That's kind of funny since my co-workers are (painfully) aware that I was doing all kinds of DVD-A stuff but we haven't actually made it out into the parking lot to listen yet. I think sometimes they wish I never got the TL since I'm always yapping about it in one way or another.


Not sure what other scripts should/could be done next. It seems anything more than the Large Club will sound to much like a subway station and anything smaller than SmallClub will be too subtle. I guess there is always goofy scripts but the would probably be a waste of DVD media since the novelty would wear off quickly. How about some good blues in the LF,C and RF for me up front and Disney soundtracks through the RS and LS for the kids in back....Naaaaa

trenz1

I really like the small club.

I made 1 group:
song 1 stereo, large club, samll club
song 2 stereo, large club, small club
etc.,etc.

This made it easier to compare songs

based on the recommendations of people here, I used -R as it is supposed to more compatable with the TL


If you are using a Creative soundcard than I believe everything from the Audigy 2 and up came with the Creative MediaSource DVD-Audio player. Other than that I believe WinDVD Platinum has the DVD-A decoder also

trenz1

For anyone that might be curious about the "save to" function of Solo, I received this response just a short time after sending them an email. Pretty good customer service for a Saturday


Hello,

The option "Save to" is disabled in current version, you can accomplish the "Save to" in two steps:
1. Save the DVD Image to an ISO format file.
Select DVD Image Save only and enter a file name, e.g. Disc1.iso.

2. When Save file is completed, write the saved ISO file to a DVD disc.
Select DVD Image Write from and enter the file name if it is not there.

We disabled the "Save to" option because it was not too stable, creating problem in write disc in some cases.

Best regards,

The Solo Team

keith6945

Hello, i have tried adobinizer, very easy to use, i used cirlinca to create an iso and use nero to burn it onto dvd disk, works fine, i used cirlinca to burn directly, works fine too, but i'm burning a concert cd and how can i make it so there is no pause between tracks? i know how to do it on a regular cd using nero, but no idea when it comes to DVD-A....
thank you very much for all of your help in advance
Keith

keith6945

nvm, i think i found my answer with some research, seems like to make sure there is no pause, i have to combine all the tracks into one single track, otherwise, there will be pause between tracks for DVD-A..... Nero can combine tracks with its Nero Soundtrax

Adobeman

No you don't need one big track. You need to select something like "optimize for inner gapless ..." or something or other like that. I think it is on the DVD tabs somewhere in Solo. This will eliminate hiccups between tracks. If you still have them after that then the problem is probably in your wav files. The other thing is that it is possible that the Adobinizer's outputs are not exatly perfect with respect to the file boundaries required for gap-less tracks. Since I am adding echo and other effects and then multiplexing a big 6 channel wav it may just be that gaps will exist. If you burn a disk with one group direct from your source and one group out of the Adobinizer and you make sure you select the "gapp-less" option in Solo that will tell you for sure or not it it is my stuff adding the gaps.

keith6945

thats what i did but i still end up having gaps between each track....

Adobeman

Did you also try a group with the files in the "2channelsource" directory?

If they have gaps then it is something in the way you are making the wav files.

If the gaps are only in the files that the Adobinizer creates then it is an artifact of what happens to the files when the sound effects are processed. Sorry but I don't think I'd be able to correct that.

BUT, all hope is not lost, it may just take an extra few steps.
Make that big old 2channel wav file and run it through the Adobinizer. Then use a program like CDWav (http://www.milosoftware.com/) and use it to split the 6channel output file at the desired points. I think that CDWav will work with 6channel wav files. The problem is that you system may not "play" 6channel wav files so you may need to split based only on times rather than listening. When you get the program you will see what I mean. If it still "gaps" after that the very technically speaking...your screwed.

pjk

You mentioned the DVD-A burning software called DVD Solo by Cirlinca. I downloaded their trial version which enables you to burn up to 5 discs. So far, I've been messing around with it and had some good luck. Thanks for the posting.

dbett

Adobeman:

Somewhat off topic, but if I get your DVDA GUI, is there any reason I need (to pay for) the DVD Solo program?

I've tried DVD Solo and it works - as long as I save to an .iso file and then use Nero to burn the DVD. But just looking at the interface on your DVDA GUI, I think I would prefer to use that. Especially the way it makes creating different groups much more intuitive than with DVD Solo. And it looks like it replaces DVD Solo (except for the direct burn to DVD function) and adds a bunch of nice options.

I'm not missing something am I?