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Old 03-15-2005, 6:02 PM   #1
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did 6 quart drain/fill of tranny fluid (pics of fluid)

I did the drain 3 quarts then fill with 3 new quarts of Honda ATF-Z1 tranny fluid today. I did the first 3 quarts then drove around for a while then did it again with 3 more new quarts of fluid. The milk jug is of the 2nd drain and the other bottle has the first 3 quarts I took out. Also for those who didnt know, the other picture is of the transmission drain plug - it is on the front drivers side and use a 3/8 inch ratchet end to get it off.

It was a pain in the ass to fill it back up through the dip stick hole (since I dont have the oil jet POS), but it all worked out fine. The fluid is pretty dark - especially since I got a full flush done about 15k ago at the dealer; though the second drain (milk jug) does seem to be a little lighter so hopefully I got most of the old fluid out. It does shift nicer now and there is less of the "jerk" when you go from reverse to drive.

Kinda how your engine is much smoother right when you put in new oil - which I did also today - Mobil 1 synthetic of course and I rotated my tires. My car needed some TLC

It was very easy overall and I will probably do it every 10-15k miles, just to hopefully prolong the life - but that also raises a question; if you leave the old shitty fluid in, you may be able to get a new tranny before the warranty expires - but I dont know the importance replacing the fluid so much anyway - whatever you think is best I guess. I know have 85k on the original tranny, so we shall see how everything goes.

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Old 03-15-2005, 6:31 PM   #2
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I also did this twice and the color of my fluid was similar to yours. I also had to fill through the dipstick but wasn't too bad, since it would be a pain to remove that other bolt to fill. When I did my transmission drain, I left it in neutral and got more than 3 quarts, close to 3.5. Is it because it was in neutral or did that not matter?

ou sig, are you planning to get the oil jet kit installed? Hopefully I can bring it in to the dealer before spring break starts and get it out of the way. I'm still on the original tranny with 63k miles (00' TL-P).
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Old 03-15-2005, 6:44 PM   #3
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I only drained 3 quarts/time because I wanted to make sure I had enough to refill it. I could have gotten more out, but I stopped at 3 each time because I bought 6 quarts. I dont know if it matters what gear it is in, I had it in park.

I wont get the oil jet installed, and I wouldnt recommend you do it either if you have made it that long on your original tranny. I have a '99 TL (4 speed) so I dont know if they put the oil jet on my transmission or not. You can talk to your dealer more about that if you wish - I think that the big problem with the 5 speeds is that they will die really no matter what you do, that is why people have problems before and after the oil jet installation - just a bad overall design that is doomed from the start. I would say good maintenance (fluid change) and try to take it easy when you drive most of the time and that is the most you could do.
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Old 03-15-2005, 9:30 PM   #4
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ou sig- I have changed my fluid twice- just 3 qts each time at 15k miles and then at 27k miles. At 27k the fluid was dark like yours. I think like you mentioned, the 5spds might be doomed anyway, but I'm keeping hope. I have an '02 TL-S. I have a '93 accord as well and have changed fluid every 15k. That looks as cherry red coming out as the new stuff..
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Old 03-15-2005, 9:47 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ou sig

It was a pain in the ass to fill it back up through the dip stick hole (since I dont have the oil jet POS), but it all worked out fine.
why didnt you remove the filler bolt? the time you wasted trying to get it to all pour thru the dipstick hole you could have removed teh filler bolt 20 times
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Old 03-15-2005, 9:57 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fsttyms1
why didnt you remove the filler bolt? the time you wasted trying to get it to all pour thru the dipstick hole you could have removed teh filler bolt 20 times
Ya I actually saw that bolt AFTER I was done! It was kinda low light when I was doing it so I didnt notice the ATF on the bolt. But it lookes kinda hard to get at, what would you use to get it loose? Oh well, it was fun riging up a tube to fill it with anyway.

MarcDavidoff - ya my dad mentioned how dark the fluid was, and he was very surprised when I said it was only about 15k old. these trannies just arent built quite tough enough for the power of our engines I guess - who really knows what will help the life, but for about $25 and some time, its worth it to me for the piece of mind.
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Old 03-15-2005, 9:59 PM   #7
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i just used a socket and extension. (17mm if memory remembers correctly)
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Old 03-15-2005, 10:01 PM   #8
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You should get the oil jet kit installed anyhow. The oil jet recall has nothing to do with the typical failures of these transmissions. The oil kit will keep the gear from overheating and breaking which could cause the transmission to lock up. The higher mileage transmissions are at a greater risk of this happening.
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Old 03-15-2005, 10:05 PM   #9
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very true...but do they put the oil jet on the '99 4 speed transmissions?
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Old 03-15-2005, 10:06 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ou sig
MarcDavidoff - ya my dad mentioned how dark the fluid was, and he was very surprised when I said it was only about 15k old. these trannies just arent built quite tough enough for the power of our engines I guess - who really knows what will help the life, but for about $25 and some time, its worth it to me for the piece of mind.
I hear ya on the piece of mind. I figure a few quarts of fluid every 10 or 15k miles is worth it. Even though it is probably in vain. Quite some time ago the guys at A&H Motorsport suggested draining the fluid (although it is only a 3rd of what is in there) on my accord every 15k (the manual says 30k on that car). I took their recommendation and now over 100k later the tranny still shifts like new.
It's funny how the owners manual in the TL says to change the fluid like every 100k or something. Like it will ever last that long. It will look as black as my black seats!
BTW, I rigged a tube up as well attached to a funnel. That feels good on the back pouring in fluid at a snails pace. I just did not want to mess with the oil jet rig they installed in place of the filler bolt. Actually, the first time I went to remove the filler bolt it was so tight I did not want to force it so went the dipstick route..
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Old 03-15-2005, 10:13 PM   #11
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Ya I remember people saying that the bolt was real tight so I kinda dismissed that option and went for the slower dip stick hole method. I really would think that since you have changed it from the beginning, that HAS to help out quite a bit, but only time will tell.
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Old 03-15-2005, 10:22 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ou sig
very true...but do they put the oil jet on the '99 4 speed transmissions?
i don't think so.....although they should..
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Old 03-15-2005, 10:23 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ou sig
Ya I remember people saying that the bolt was real tight so I kinda dismissed that option and went for the slower dip stick hole method. I really would think that since you have changed it from the beginning, that HAS to help out quite a bit, but only time will tell.
the bolt is very tight...
breaker bar, my friend...
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Old 03-16-2005, 7:20 AM   #14
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i don't think so.....although they should..
Be careful what you wish for.
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Old 03-16-2005, 7:43 AM   #15
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While my brother had my car for while at home, I asked him to get the SRS light reset and the dash vent looked at.

Acura of Troy installed the oil jet kit without even telling him. I was pissed off, but it's been holding up fine. My car's got 36k miles on original fluid, so I should probably change it soon.
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Old 03-16-2005, 8:33 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ou sig
very true...but do they put the oil jet on the '99 4 speed transmissions?
No, they do not put the oil jet kit on the 99 TL's, but I did not want ou sig to discourage anyone with the five speed transmission to not put the oil jet kit on. Especially the higher mileage cars that are at a higher risk.
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Old 03-16-2005, 1:44 PM   #17
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Why are some on this thread saying it's better to put it on while others are totally against it? I wanted to bring the car in today and have it checked out and possibly install the oil jet kit but now I'm hesitant again. (00' TL-P w/63k miles)
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Old 03-16-2005, 1:52 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xasnxkiddox
Why are some on this thread saying it's better to put it on while others are totally against it?
There's anecdotal evidence that tranny failure happens soon after the oil jet kit is installed.
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Old 03-16-2005, 1:52 PM   #19
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its fine to do it, but if you search you will find many threads all about it and basically there are people that had tranny problems within 100 miles of the "oil jet" installation. I dont know why, but that isnt fixing anything, though it should. So it wont hurt, but if your tranny is bad, it will probably die with or without the oil jet being installed. And with 63k on your original one, you may have a good one and yours may actually last like a normal car - but only time and miles will tell.
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Old 03-16-2005, 2:02 PM   #20
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I have had the oil jet kit installed at 15k. Drain and filled tranny at 20k. Did the same at 30k. Right now I have 32k on the car and the fluid is still pink. So far so good. Doesn't look like it will fail anytime soon but I have noticed that the tranny doesn't shift as smoothly as it use to. Will probably change the fluid again soon and see if it helps.
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Old 03-16-2005, 2:41 PM   #21
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Okay how about this. If I don't install the oil jet kit and my tranny happens to fail let's say next week *knocks on wood*, will it still be covered under the transmission replacement warranty? The only reason why I'm thinking of getting the oil jet kit installed is because I don't know if they are going to blame me for not bringing the car in to get the oil jet kit installed, causing the transmission to break down abnormally (even though most are doomed from the start). Just trying to prevent any issues that may interfere with the warranty if I so happen need to use it. By all other means, I plan NOT TO install the oil jet kit if it won't interfere with replacing a new transmission if mine does go bad.
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Old 03-16-2005, 2:56 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xasnxkiddox
Okay how about this. If I don't install the oil jet kit and my tranny happens to fail let's say next week *knocks on wood*, will it still be covered under the transmission replacement warranty? The only reason why I'm thinking of getting the oil jet kit installed is because I don't know if they are going to blame me for not bringing the car in to get the oil jet kit installed, causing the transmission to break down abnormally (even though most are doomed from the start). Just trying to prevent any issues that may interfere with the warranty if I so happen need to use it. By all other means, I plan NOT TO install the oil jet kit if it won't interfere with replacing a new transmission if mine does go bad.
I still sense some confusion on the oil jet issue. The oil jet is being installed to keep the second gear from overheating and breaking. This is a completely separate issue from the transmissions that are "slipping". If the transmission fails (starts slipping) after you have the oil jet kit installed it will be covered as long as you are still under warranty. If you choose not to put the oil jet kit on and the second gear breaks, the transmission could lock up on you and strand you. This is the reason it is a safety recall. Be safe and get the oil jet kit installed.
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Old 03-16-2005, 8:03 PM   #23
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Old 03-16-2005, 10:30 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ou sig
its fine to do it, but if you search you will find many threads all about it and basically there are people that had tranny problems within 100 miles of the "oil jet" installation. I dont know why, but that isnt fixing anything, though it should. So it wont hurt, but if your tranny is bad, it will probably die with or without the oil jet being installed. And with 63k on your original one, you may have a good one and yours may actually last like a normal car - but only time and miles will tell.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xasnxkiddox
Okay how about this. If I don't install the oil jet kit and my tranny happens to fail let's say next week *knocks on wood*, will it still be covered under the transmission replacement warranty? The only reason why I'm thinking of getting the oil jet kit installed is because I don't know if they are going to blame me for not bringing the car in to get the oil jet kit installed, causing the transmission to break down abnormally (even though most are doomed from the start). Just trying to prevent any issues that may interfere with the warranty if I so happen need to use it. By all other means, I plan NOT TO install the oil jet kit if it won't interfere with replacing a new transmission if mine does go bad.
the oil jet DOES NOT help fix the problem of failures that 99.9% of us have. it is designed for the major failure that causes the 2nd gear shaft to break and lock up the front wheels. the problem we all have here is the 3rd gear clutchpack, and the oil jet kit DOES NOT influince that at all, nor does it keep it from dying.

Whan you bring the car in for inspection and oiljet kit instalation they CAN NOT, nor do they try to look for damage to the 3rd gear clutchpack.
people who have had failures shortly after it was installed is purte coincidence, and odds are it was on its way out way before they brought it in for the jet kit and didnt even realze it and the subtle telltail signs. i have had the jet kit in for over 15,000 miles now
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Old 03-25-2005, 10:56 AM   #25
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Just curious- I have seen others mention what symptoms they have had before their tranny went, but does anyone have all the telltale signs? I have heard of the rpms going higher than normal on 2nd to 3rd shift. I have also scanned thru the NHTSA info and what some of the data had said. I am pretty in tune with my vehicles so I can usually feel or hear an issue right away. The only thing I have ever noticed on my '02 TL-S is it perhaps not going into reverse as quick or smooth as usual. But this has only happened maybe 5 times and it is not real harsh or anything. My wife did'nt even notice the last time it happened. Maybe it is just my imagination sometimes?
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Old 05-24-2005, 1:27 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fsttyms1
why didnt you remove the filler bolt? the time you wasted trying to get it to all pour thru the dipstick hole you could have removed teh filler bolt 20 times
fsttyms, can you pls post a pic of that bolt or explain where abouts to look for it.

thx

BTW can i walk into any honda/acura for the ATF, and does our engines have a filter?
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Old 05-24-2005, 3:20 PM   #27
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if you stand on th edrivers side of the car looking over teh fender into the engine compartmentlook to the right of and down of the rubber intake tube. you will see this bolt 17mm

Click the image to open in full size.

if you have teh jet kit it will look a little different. if you do you will just have to remove a 10mm bolt (the blue one to the left of the circled filler bolt)and pull straight up on the jet kit

Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 05-24-2005, 5:06 PM   #28
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be aware..that bolt can real tight.
u might need a breaker bar.
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Old 05-24-2005, 5:10 PM   #29
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a LUBE CONNECTION place near does a tranny flush.
they use a machine....99.00.
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Old 05-24-2005, 5:44 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joseph_99tl
a LUBE CONNECTION place near does a tranny flush.
they use a machine....99.00.
they dont recomend those machines on hondas since they dont have a pan or filter to remove to get any thing that may have fallen due to that method
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Old 05-25-2005, 3:17 AM   #31
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great pixs, and thanks for the quick replies!

what's a breaker bar? and when is it best to check the atf dipstick ?

cool or warmed engine
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Old 05-25-2005, 9:35 AM   #32
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a breaker bar is a tool. its designed for sockets but doesnt wratchet and allows to exert alot more force (many will stick a pipe over it to allow more leverage)

Click the image to open in full size.

as for checking the fluid, it should be checked warm drive the car around the block or check it after driving the car
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Old 06-14-2005, 2:49 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fsttyms1
if you stand on th edrivers side of the car looking over teh fender into the engine compartmentlook to the right of and down of the rubber intake tube. you will see this bolt 17mm

if you have teh jet kit it will look a little different. if you do you will just have to remove a 10mm bolt (the blue one to the left of the circled filler bolt)and pull straight up on the jet kit]
well so i tried to do it on my own today. My '02 TL has the oil jet kit. Damn..nearly broke my hand trying to get the bolt off. For some reason instead of a 10mm bolt blue bolt they put atleast a 12mm bolt on it and I didnt have the right ratchet to remove it. Greater than 3/8 in is needed.

i guess i'll have to try to get a breaker bar and an long extension. that bolt is ridiculously tight. The gardener at my apt complex was watching me while he was taking care of the landscape and just giggled.
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Old 06-14-2005, 2:59 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suj220
well so i tried to do it on my own today. My '02 TL has the oil jet kit. Damn..nearly broke my hand trying to get the bolt off. For some reason instead of a 10mm bolt blue bolt they put atleast a 12mm bolt on it and I didnt have the right ratchet to remove it. Greater than 3/8 in is needed.

i guess i'll have to try to get a breaker bar and an long extension. that bolt is ridiculously tight. The gardener at my apt complex was watching me while he was taking care of the landscape and just giggled.
yeah it's a 12mm, not a 10 mm...

I used a freaking torque wrench just to get the power to undo it!.... I just tightened to hand tight with a standard sized 3/8 ratchet and it's all good...

just replace the jet kit, tighten the bracket, wiggle the jet kit to ensure its fitting properly, and then check the tightness... im gonna swap the tranny fluid again tonight with 3 qts
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Old 06-14-2005, 4:29 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joseph_99tl
be aware..that bolt can real tight.
u might need a breaker bar.
i told ya!..
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Old 06-15-2005, 2:22 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suj220
well so i tried to do it on my own today. My '02 TL has the oil jet kit. Damn..nearly broke my hand trying to get the bolt off. For some reason instead of a 10mm bolt blue bolt they put atleast a 12mm bolt on it and I didnt have the right ratchet to remove it. Greater than 3/8 in is needed.

i guess i'll have to try to get a breaker bar and an long extension. that bolt is ridiculously tight. The gardener at my apt complex was watching me while he was taking care of the landscape and just giggled.

Just put a pipe over your ratchet. 12-18" should give you enough torque to get the bolt off.
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Old 06-15-2005, 3:20 PM   #37
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Weaklings.. tsk tsk.. I was able to get it off with a 3/8 regular wrench.


Just giving you shit. I know it's on there TIGHT.
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Old 06-16-2005, 2:19 PM   #38
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what does a socket extension look like?
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Old 07-02-2005, 11:12 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suj220
what does a socket extension look like?

well i went to autozone and got a 12 in extenstion and it worked. The 3/8 in ratchet is the right one...but the extension helped a lot.

Unfortunately the drain bolt was a different story. I needed an 18in (1/2in drive) breaker bar and a 1/2->3/8 inch adapter to turn that sucker loose. Once I did...the fluid came gushing out. It was colored an extremely dark purple. The catch pan was in the right place so it didnt splash anywhere else.

After putting back the drain bolt, I put the funnel in the fill hole where jet kit was installed and was pouring in the 3qts when my girlfriend decided to ask me if I wanted orange juice. lost my concentration cuz I didnt know she was there and a little poured over the edge and on to the small crevices next to the fill hole. I was like damn! well i cleaned it up with some shop towels...hope the fluid's deteregency doesn't eat through the wiring and/or plastic parts. After this was done...the I felt the shifting from 1->2 was better. I might do another 3qts later this week.

Without the right tools...simple jobs like this can take forever.
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Old 07-02-2005, 12:41 PM   #40
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ya you should do it at least 2 times - 3 would be best, just to make sure you get most of the old fluid out.
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Old 07-02-2005, 12:41 PM
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