transmission cooler installation really helps?
04-26-2015, 03:01 PM
#1
Instructor
Thread Starter
transmission cooler installation really helps?
Im looking to install a transmission oil cooler on my 2003 Acura CLs. Will it make a difference really at all on how the transmission shifts? I recently got a transmission swap at 137k and im now at 147k and flushed 1 time.. will it prolong my transmission?
04-27-2015, 01:14 AM
#2
Senior Moderator
It wont do anything. Fluid temps arent the problem. Getting fluid to the clutchpacks was. I had 4 failures with a trans cooler. Its an internal design flaw and nothing will fix that.
If you were to do anything, The best thing you can do is get a 06-07 Accord V6 trans. They were/are reliable
If you were to do anything, The best thing you can do is get a 06-07 Accord V6 trans. They were/are reliable
04-27-2015, 06:22 AM
#3
Instructor
Thread Starter
It wont do anything. Fluid temps arent the problem. Getting fluid to the clutchpacks was. I had 4 failures with a trans cooler. Its an internal design flaw and nothing will fix that.
If you were to do anything, The best thing you can do is get a 06-07 Accord V6 trans. They were/are reliable
If you were to do anything, The best thing you can do is get a 06-07 Accord V6 trans. They were/are reliable
04-27-2015, 11:13 AM
#4
trans cooler
IMO it will help. see my other posts.
especially with a new rebuilt/reman/ trans. thoroughly cleaned and free of clogging friction material.
yes the oil pump in the valve body puts out insufficient flow
(design flaw) but failure is due to the chain reaction that happens after.
for older trannies not serviced enough, (change of tranny fluid)
often. it will be just a matter of time.
especially with a new rebuilt/reman/ trans. thoroughly cleaned and free of clogging friction material.
yes the oil pump in the valve body puts out insufficient flow
(design flaw) but failure is due to the chain reaction that happens after.
for older trannies not serviced enough, (change of tranny fluid)
often. it will be just a matter of time.
04-27-2015, 11:22 AM
#5
Senior Moderator
IMO it will help. see my other posts.
especially with a new rebuilt/reman/ trans. thoroughly cleaned and free of clogging friction material.
yes the oil pump in the valve body puts out insufficient flow
(design flaw) but failure is due to the chain reaction that happens after.
for older trannies not serviced enough, (change of tranny fluid)
often. it will be just a matter of time.
especially with a new rebuilt/reman/ trans. thoroughly cleaned and free of clogging friction material.
yes the oil pump in the valve body puts out insufficient flow
(design flaw) but failure is due to the chain reaction that happens after.
for older trannies not serviced enough, (change of tranny fluid)
often. it will be just a matter of time.
BUT Failure is also the cause of. Insufficient amounts of fluid get to the clutchpacks causing them to overheat (adding a cooler wont help), The resulting excessive wear is what happens next, usually screens solenoids etc clogging adding more wear to already now fragile components speeding up the failure.
04-27-2015, 02:46 PM
#6
Instructor
Thread Starter
IMO it will help. see my other posts.
especially with a new rebuilt/reman/ trans. thoroughly cleaned and free of clogging friction material.
yes the oil pump in the valve body puts out insufficient flow
(design flaw) but failure is due to the chain reaction that happens after.
for older trannies not serviced enough, (change of tranny fluid)
often. it will be just a matter of time.
especially with a new rebuilt/reman/ trans. thoroughly cleaned and free of clogging friction material.
yes the oil pump in the valve body puts out insufficient flow
(design flaw) but failure is due to the chain reaction that happens after.
for older trannies not serviced enough, (change of tranny fluid)
often. it will be just a matter of time.
Ok.. well i will prolly install it.. i flush my transmission fluid every 2k just because..
04-27-2015, 02:48 PM
#7
Instructor
Thread Starter
Like i said, i had 4 failures with one and 1 without. IMHO it wont do anything. Some failures happened in as little as 16k miles, other 70.
BUT Failure is also the cause of. Insufficient amounts of fluid get to the clutchpacks causing them to overheat (adding a cooler wont help), The resulting excessive wear is what happens next, usually screens solenoids etc clogging adding more wear to already now fragile components speeding up the failure.
BUT Failure is also the cause of. Insufficient amounts of fluid get to the clutchpacks causing them to overheat (adding a cooler wont help), The resulting excessive wear is what happens next, usually screens solenoids etc clogging adding more wear to already now fragile components speeding up the failure.
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04-28-2015, 09:32 AM
#8
Senior Moderator
Last edited by fsttyms1; 04-28-2015 at 09:34 AM.
04-28-2015, 09:41 AM
#9
Instructor
Thread Starter
Easy on it or not it really doesnt matter (over the years here ive seen people who drove like sunday grandma drivers with multiple failures and those that beat on it not have any, its the luck of the draw. I even knew someone who had the replacement fail leaving the dealers lot after having been replaced) . Its the up and down shifting between gears (the biggest issue is 3rd) that is the problem. During shifts temps in the 3rd gear drum were documented to get over 300 C. Its the simple fact that not enough fluid is getting to the drum to cool it. Once that happens excessive wear starts to happen, causing the clutch packs to start to wear. When that happens fine debris starts to clog solenoids causing pressure loss in the shifting causing more slip in the clutchpacks causing more heat thus more wear. I have personally rebuilt these trans, i have seen the issues first hand, and been an active member of these forums for a long time and have read just about every single documentation acura has put out about the issues. Im not trying to sound like an ass so please dont take it wrong, you may know some of the acura line but you really dont know these cars very well. Especially if asking about a cooler and not really knowing the real issue. Will a cooler help, sure it will help drop the temps (i would see usually around 30-60 deg less trans temp with one while driving sometime even more) of the trans fluid. But if it cant physically get to the part it doesnt do much to help nor will it help.
04-28-2015, 07:31 PM
#10
Senior Moderator
Like i said, the cooler wont do anything to keep it from failing. Fluid temp isnt the issue. Getting fluid to the part to cool it is.
04-29-2015, 06:54 AM
#11
No one ever mentions our transmission also have a warmer... Yea a warmer!
The rad fluid goes through the transmission and this also heat it up. The cooler will help balance out the temps, but it still gets very hot in the Trans. Like 200F hot on a 30C day.
The cooler definitely helps lower temps in the Trans. Does this save the Trans.. No. Does it help. Well it probably does. There is no proving it one way or the other. So..
Technically the best thing to do would be to not use the warmer after it has heated up the transmission to normal temp with some sort of automatic diverted valve.
But I am done with this car and tinkering with its massively flawed transmission. I am riding out this last rebuild and then whenever it dies. I will part out the car and buy a tl-sh awd. If I can afford it. And it will be 6 speed so help me god. I hate automatic
The rad fluid goes through the transmission and this also heat it up. The cooler will help balance out the temps, but it still gets very hot in the Trans. Like 200F hot on a 30C day.
The cooler definitely helps lower temps in the Trans. Does this save the Trans.. No. Does it help. Well it probably does. There is no proving it one way or the other. So..
Technically the best thing to do would be to not use the warmer after it has heated up the transmission to normal temp with some sort of automatic diverted valve.
But I am done with this car and tinkering with its massively flawed transmission. I am riding out this last rebuild and then whenever it dies. I will part out the car and buy a tl-sh awd. If I can afford it. And it will be 6 speed so help me god. I hate automatic
04-30-2015, 10:39 PM
#12
when they basically started using the 2007 accord design in the rebuilt transmissions, tha tis what helped. The case has enlarged oil passages and that's what saves the day. My original trans died at 71K, the new one ha 67K on it and shifts way better and it was replaced in mid 2008.
05-01-2015, 09:45 AM
#13
Instructor
Thread Starter
when they basically started using the 2007 accord design in the rebuilt transmissions, tha tis what helped. The case has enlarged oil passages and that's what saves the day. My original trans died at 71K, the new one ha 67K on it and shifts way better and it was replaced in mid 2008.
05-06-2015, 08:28 PM
#14
Pro
The warmer also helps cool after the trans is warmed up. It is a two fold system. Its just a more simple design than the regular setup they had in the earlier models where they routed the atf to the bottom of the radiator.
I have done a few rebuilds myself and the only failed clutchpack I see is 3rd. 1,2,4 and 5 are still like new everytime. My last rebuild the trans had 290k on it without a rebuild and 3rd was 100% gone, literally no clutch material left on any of the discs. The other packs looked like factory and I used my magnetic dial indicator to check clutch wear, all packs were within specs.
I have done a few rebuilds myself and the only failed clutchpack I see is 3rd. 1,2,4 and 5 are still like new everytime. My last rebuild the trans had 290k on it without a rebuild and 3rd was 100% gone, literally no clutch material left on any of the discs. The other packs looked like factory and I used my magnetic dial indicator to check clutch wear, all packs were within specs.
05-06-2015, 10:51 PM
#15
Instructor
Thread Starter
The warmer also helps cool after the trans is warmed up. It is a two fold system. Its just a more simple design than the regular setup they had in the earlier models where they routed the atf to the bottom of the radiator.
I have done a few rebuilds myself and the only failed clutchpack I see is 3rd. 1,2,4 and 5 are still like new everytime. My last rebuild the trans had 290k on it without a rebuild and 3rd was 100% gone, literally no clutch material left on any of the discs. The other packs looked like factory and I used my magnetic dial indicator to check clutch wear, all packs were within specs.
I have done a few rebuilds myself and the only failed clutchpack I see is 3rd. 1,2,4 and 5 are still like new everytime. My last rebuild the trans had 290k on it without a rebuild and 3rd was 100% gone, literally no clutch material left on any of the discs. The other packs looked like factory and I used my magnetic dial indicator to check clutch wear, all packs were within specs.
05-06-2015, 11:17 PM
#16
Pro
I have never used a cooler so I cannot offer input as to the benefits/negatives. Although I personally feel a coolers benefits will be negligible as fluid flow to the clutch packs is paramount over fluid temperature for keeping these transmissions running longer. Installing a cooler I have also heard from random people can cause fluid pressure reduction. Although I do not know how much and if this really is the case.
If I would suggest anything in helping to aid these transmissions life I suggest you run Redline D4 ATF. It is a full synthetic with similar friction modifiers to the Honda DW-1 and in itself it stays cooler and it runs a bit thinner when hot thus helping keep proper pressure to the clutch packs most notably the 3rd clutch pack.
Also something that would cost a tad bit more although some might see it as overkill, would be to replace all solenoids with new units. I always do this with good results. A new solenoid kit complete with everything on Amazon runs 250.
If I would suggest anything in helping to aid these transmissions life I suggest you run Redline D4 ATF. It is a full synthetic with similar friction modifiers to the Honda DW-1 and in itself it stays cooler and it runs a bit thinner when hot thus helping keep proper pressure to the clutch packs most notably the 3rd clutch pack.
Also something that would cost a tad bit more although some might see it as overkill, would be to replace all solenoids with new units. I always do this with good results. A new solenoid kit complete with everything on Amazon runs 250.
Last edited by musiclevelz5; 05-06-2015 at 11:20 PM.
05-07-2015, 08:44 AM
#17
Senior Moderator
I have never used a cooler so I cannot offer input as to the benefits/negatives. Although I personally feel a coolers benefits will be negligible as fluid flow to the clutch packs is paramount over fluid temperature for keeping these transmissions running longer. Installing a cooler I have also heard from random people can cause fluid pressure reduction. Although I do not know how much and if this really is the case.
If I would suggest anything in helping to aid these transmissions life I suggest you run Redline D4 ATF. It is a full synthetic with similar friction modifiers to the Honda DW-1 and in itself it stays cooler and it runs a bit thinner when hot thus helping keep proper pressure to the clutch packs most notably the 3rd clutch pack.
Also something that would cost a tad bit more although some might see it as overkill, would be to replace all solenoids with new units. I always do this with good results. A new solenoid kit complete with everything on Amazon runs 250.
If I would suggest anything in helping to aid these transmissions life I suggest you run Redline D4 ATF. It is a full synthetic with similar friction modifiers to the Honda DW-1 and in itself it stays cooler and it runs a bit thinner when hot thus helping keep proper pressure to the clutch packs most notably the 3rd clutch pack.
Also something that would cost a tad bit more although some might see it as overkill, would be to replace all solenoids with new units. I always do this with good results. A new solenoid kit complete with everything on Amazon runs 250.
And as for fluid,and solenoids, I agree as well. I would also go as far as to say i would remove the solenoids yearly and clean them at the same time as doing a drain fill and external filter replacement.
05-07-2015, 04:30 PM
#18
trans cooler
IMO yes install it. If I had my cl brand new and knew of the flaws of our trans, I would have installed one right away.
Wether its insufficient flow because of small passages or insufficient pump flow, the results are the same "Heat Build UP. The clutch packs were ruined by HEAT not small passages. Heat kills transmissions, and ours is worse than others. So put that cooler on. Its not guaranteed to make your tranny last , but it will definitely help the situation. our 3.2 has too much torque for this tranny and that doesn't help either. if u buy a new tranny form the dealer they tell u that u need a PCM update to dial down the shift points.
if your tranny is toast , then get a new 06-07 accord v6 tranny.
if your original cl tranny is still kicking , do the 3x3(heat dissipation is best with new tranny fluid), replace the 3rd and 4th pressure switches , (see note above on "Torque") replace the temp sensor
change the external filter(03) add another filter in the tranny cooler return.
these are not expensive parts, and all these will help.
if u have some diy skills these are all external, watch you tube.
I have bypassed the warmer in my trans. my cooler has a bypass valve that would let cold fluid pass when tranny is cold and cool warm/hot trans fluid.we don't need a warmer LOL
Wether its insufficient flow because of small passages or insufficient pump flow, the results are the same "Heat Build UP. The clutch packs were ruined by HEAT not small passages. Heat kills transmissions, and ours is worse than others. So put that cooler on. Its not guaranteed to make your tranny last , but it will definitely help the situation. our 3.2 has too much torque for this tranny and that doesn't help either. if u buy a new tranny form the dealer they tell u that u need a PCM update to dial down the shift points.
if your tranny is toast , then get a new 06-07 accord v6 tranny.
if your original cl tranny is still kicking , do the 3x3(heat dissipation is best with new tranny fluid), replace the 3rd and 4th pressure switches , (see note above on "Torque") replace the temp sensor
change the external filter(03) add another filter in the tranny cooler return.
these are not expensive parts, and all these will help.
if u have some diy skills these are all external, watch you tube.
I have bypassed the warmer in my trans. my cooler has a bypass valve that would let cold fluid pass when tranny is cold and cool warm/hot trans fluid.we don't need a warmer LOL
Last edited by cl82793; 05-07-2015 at 04:40 PM.
05-07-2015, 04:57 PM
#19
Instructor
Thread Starter
IMO yes install it. If I had my cl brand new and knew of the flaws of our trans, I would have installed one right away.
Wether its insufficient flow because of small passages or insufficient pump flow, the results are the same "Heat Build UP. The clutch packs were ruined by HEAT not small passages. Heat kills transmissions, and ours is worse than others. So put that cooler on. Its not guaranteed to make your tranny last , but it will definitely help the situation. our 3.2 has too much torque for this tranny and that doesn't help either. if u buy a new tranny form the dealer they tell u that u need a PCM update to dial down the shift points.
if your tranny is toast , then get a new 06-07 accord v6 tranny.
if your original cl tranny is still kicking , do the 3x3(heat dissipation is best with new tranny fluid), replace the 3rd and 4th pressure switches , (see note above on "Torque") replace the temp sensor
change the external filter(03) add another filter in the tranny cooler return.
these are not expensive parts, and all these will help.
if u have some diy skills these are all external, watch you tube.
I have bypassed the warmer in my trans. my cooler has a bypass valve that would let cold fluid pass when tranny is cold and cool warm/hot trans fluid.we don't need a warmer LOL
Wether its insufficient flow because of small passages or insufficient pump flow, the results are the same "Heat Build UP. The clutch packs were ruined by HEAT not small passages. Heat kills transmissions, and ours is worse than others. So put that cooler on. Its not guaranteed to make your tranny last , but it will definitely help the situation. our 3.2 has too much torque for this tranny and that doesn't help either. if u buy a new tranny form the dealer they tell u that u need a PCM update to dial down the shift points.
if your tranny is toast , then get a new 06-07 accord v6 tranny.
if your original cl tranny is still kicking , do the 3x3(heat dissipation is best with new tranny fluid), replace the 3rd and 4th pressure switches , (see note above on "Torque") replace the temp sensor
change the external filter(03) add another filter in the tranny cooler return.
these are not expensive parts, and all these will help.
if u have some diy skills these are all external, watch you tube.
I have bypassed the warmer in my trans. my cooler has a bypass valve that would let cold fluid pass when tranny is cold and cool warm/hot trans fluid.we don't need a warmer LOL
DAmn u kno ya shit man.... good look... thanx for the info... i will be installing it!!!
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