2012 TSX has random battery drain.
02-05-2016, 11:48 AM
#1
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Thread Starter
2012 TSX has random battery drain.
First some details about my car. It's a 2012 TSX 4cyl w/ Tech Package and a Viper Remote Starter which was dealer purchased and installed by a local shop. The car was bought in June of 2012 and has 19,600 miles driven. With my stock battery, the car struggled a bit in the winter but nothing horrible but I put in a Duralast Gold. The issue went away, although still odd, for a bit but then when it got cold again the battery died randomly overnight. I replaced the battery because it did have a bad cell and the new one, within a year, had a bad cell and the car began to die again. So now, I have a brand new Optima Yellow Top which is great. Except, after 2 weeks and mild temperatures in the 30s and 40s, yesterday my battery was completely dead after sitting from 6PM to 1130AM. This was after a 14 mile drive to work, sit 10 hours, and 14 miles back.
I took the car to Acura and they ran a full diagnostic at no charge. The couldn't find one single issue, not even the remote starter. So something must be intermittently draining my battery with no way to know when it'll happen. Acura has my car still and they called me this morning asking me if I'd like to stay in the TLX loaner at least for another night and they'll keep monitoring it. Of course I took the offer, but man this is frustrating.
Anyone ever seen this? It's just not adding up and I have no idea how long it could take and if they will let me keep a loaner this long.
I took the car to Acura and they ran a full diagnostic at no charge. The couldn't find one single issue, not even the remote starter. So something must be intermittently draining my battery with no way to know when it'll happen. Acura has my car still and they called me this morning asking me if I'd like to stay in the TLX loaner at least for another night and they'll keep monitoring it. Of course I took the offer, but man this is frustrating.
Anyone ever seen this? It's just not adding up and I have no idea how long it could take and if they will let me keep a loaner this long.
02-05-2016, 02:12 PM
#2
Pro
I know the TL guys always complain about the HFL draining their batteries, but with your remote starter installed, it adds that much more than can go wrong. Jiggle of a wire here or there over a bumpy road?
Chasing battery drains is tedious and sucks. Hope you get an absolute diagnosis.
Chasing battery drains is tedious and sucks. Hope you get an absolute diagnosis.
02-05-2016, 02:48 PM
#3
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
I know the TL guys always complain about the HFL draining their batteries, but with your remote starter installed, it adds that much more than can go wrong. Jiggle of a wire here or there over a bumpy road?
Chasing battery drains is tedious and sucks. Hope you get an absolute diagnosis.
Chasing battery drains is tedious and sucks. Hope you get an absolute diagnosis.
02-05-2016, 03:06 PM
#4
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Is your TSX your DD? If I understand you mileage and purchase date, you are only putting approx 450 miles a month on your car. Are your miles based on short trips? Is your commute short? Do you have frequent engine starts? Short rides don't allow for battery charging and recovery from the alternator. Frequent starts will deep cycle the battery and automotive batteries aren't really designed for deep cycling.
02-05-2016, 03:35 PM
#5
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Thread Starter
Is your TSX your DD? If I understand you mileage and purchase date, you are only putting approx 450 miles a month on your car. Are your miles based on short trips? Is your commute short? Do you have frequent engine starts? Short rides don't allow for battery charging and recovery from the alternator. Frequent starts will deep cycle the battery and automotive batteries aren't really designed for deep cycling.
I drove it Wednesday for 14 miles to work, 14 back and parked it at 6PM. The next morning/afternoon at 1130am, the battery was completely drained.
02-06-2016, 11:33 AM
#6
They can put an ammeter on the battery connection, and figure out how high the drain is. It should be below 0.1A (guess) from silly things like ECUs that stay on 24/7. To drain a fully charged battery in 18 hours requires more than LED indicators, but a lot less than the headlights.
Typically the radio is always powered on to maintain the presets, the keyless unlock receiver, a few other things.
You could pull the fuses for each of these, and see if any one of them drops the current level substantially. Of course, kind of a pain, you lose the radio presets, or other functionality afterward.
But yeah, with your short commute, I'd invest in a charger, or better yet, one with starting capability. Cheaper than being late for work.
Typically the radio is always powered on to maintain the presets, the keyless unlock receiver, a few other things.
You could pull the fuses for each of these, and see if any one of them drops the current level substantially. Of course, kind of a pain, you lose the radio presets, or other functionality afterward.
But yeah, with your short commute, I'd invest in a charger, or better yet, one with starting capability. Cheaper than being late for work.
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02-06-2016, 02:05 PM
#8
it's a car-drive it
when I did not drive my tsx for a few days, the car would not start. had the battery replaced. It still did it. It was finally determined the Bluetooth connection was defective. disconnected it. no problems afterwards.
02-06-2016, 02:22 PM
#9
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
They can put an ammeter on the battery connection, and figure out how high the drain is. It should be below 0.1A (guess) from silly things like ECUs that stay on 24/7. To drain a fully charged battery in 18 hours requires more than LED indicators, but a lot less than the headlights.
Typically the radio is always powered on to maintain the presets, the keyless unlock receiver, a few other things.
You could pull the fuses for each of these, and see if any one of them drops the current level substantially. Of course, kind of a pain, you lose the radio presets, or other functionality afterward.
But yeah, with your short commute, I'd invest in a charger, or better yet, one with starting capability. Cheaper than being late for work.
Typically the radio is always powered on to maintain the presets, the keyless unlock receiver, a few other things.
You could pull the fuses for each of these, and see if any one of them drops the current level substantially. Of course, kind of a pain, you lose the radio presets, or other functionality afterward.
But yeah, with your short commute, I'd invest in a charger, or better yet, one with starting capability. Cheaper than being late for work.
02-06-2016, 02:23 PM
#10
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
The HFL tends to be the issue for most people. I won't go without it though so something needs to be figured out. It could be a faulty unit but generally the HFL is a constant issue so its tricky.
02-06-2016, 02:25 PM
#11
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
Did you see this thread?
https://acurazine.com/forums/audio-b...attery-941035/
Sounds like the signal to the radio lights wasn't working right.
https://acurazine.com/forums/audio-b...attery-941035/
Sounds like the signal to the radio lights wasn't working right.
Sorry for 3 replies in a row. Using mobile and responding 1 by 1
02-06-2016, 02:46 PM
#12
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14 mile commute is not short but you could try and figure out what is drawing power. I have read other threads on this and believe there is a fairly straight forward way of determining which fuse/circuit is causing the draw and killing your battery. I would just need to look for that thread again......
02-06-2016, 03:44 PM
#13
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Thread Starter
14 mile commute is not short but you could try and figure out what is drawing power. I have read other threads on this and believe there is a fairly straight forward way of determining which fuse/circuit is causing the draw and killing your battery. I would just need to look for that thread again......
02-06-2016, 04:10 PM
#14
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Here are a few I found, but not sure how helpful they will be. Because these are 3G, most folks always suspect and talk about the HFL.
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...esting-608959/
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...-drain-752497/
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...rnight-910561/
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...esting-608959/
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...-drain-752497/
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...rnight-910561/
02-07-2016, 05:25 PM
#15
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
Here are a few I found, but not sure how helpful they will be. Because these are 3G, most folks always suspect and talk about the HFL.
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...esting-608959/
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...-drain-752497/
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...rnight-910561/
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...esting-608959/
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...-drain-752497/
https://acurazine.com/forums/problem...rnight-910561/
I'll keep you all posted. Car was fine this morning but again that's how it always goes. A few weeks from now it'll likely die.
02-08-2016, 02:37 PM
#16
In cold weather, it could be.
When I jump start cars, I always tell them to run for 30 minutes to get a decent charge.
In winter, you are often running headlights, heater fan, radio, seat heaters, all of which slow the rate of charge. Cold weather can mean a harder start too.
Will poke around later see if I can find a process for checking fuses.
Do you own a decent voltmeter with an amps or milliamps range?
When I jump start cars, I always tell them to run for 30 minutes to get a decent charge.
In winter, you are often running headlights, heater fan, radio, seat heaters, all of which slow the rate of charge. Cold weather can mean a harder start too.
Will poke around later see if I can find a process for checking fuses.
Do you own a decent voltmeter with an amps or milliamps range?
02-09-2016, 09:53 PM
#17
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
In cold weather, it could be.
When I jump start cars, I always tell them to run for 30 minutes to get a decent charge.
In winter, you are often running headlights, heater fan, radio, seat heaters, all of which slow the rate of charge. Cold weather can mean a harder start too.
Will poke around later see if I can find a process for checking fuses.
Do you own a decent voltmeter with an amps or milliamps range?
When I jump start cars, I always tell them to run for 30 minutes to get a decent charge.
In winter, you are often running headlights, heater fan, radio, seat heaters, all of which slow the rate of charge. Cold weather can mean a harder start too.
Will poke around later see if I can find a process for checking fuses.
Do you own a decent voltmeter with an amps or milliamps range?
14 miles generally takes me 25 minutes so it should be sufficient. It's died before after an hour drive so its not a cut and dry answer which makes this more frustrating. I've driven less miles when I had an 08 Civic and never had an issue. Not much different here options wise. Except my Civic ran fine on a stock battery while my TSX failed with stock, Duralast and now Optima Yellow Top.
again thanks for any ideas!
02-19-2016, 10:01 AM
#18
Mine is doing the same thing at 167,000 miles. I've replaced both O2 sensors, checked all the coil packs and cleaned the IACV and EGR. I have a leak at the front main and rear main seal, so combined with the assumed need for a valve adjustment, the logical move was to buy a J35A3.
02-19-2016, 02:05 PM
#20
Mine seemed to have been a defective relay powering the accessory outlet
02-20-2016, 12:02 PM
#22
Pro
Funny you bring that up. I was always taught to unplug everything after shutting down. Guess it's just become 2nd nature now to me.
02-25-2016, 06:59 AM
#24
Three days ago after I got had and went insure the store I unlocked my car just fine. All my lights and dashboard worked when I put the key in. When I turned the key to start the car everything went black. I opened and sit the hood and about five minutes later the car started no problem.
Last night I got back into my car after going to the bank. Turned the key and everything went black. I hooked up another car with jumper cables for 15 minutes. The lights came on but as soon as I started cranking, black. Eventually a tow truck have me a jump that worked. When he jiggled the connector the puddle lights came on. His unit showed no issues with the alternator and my scan gage showed 13.8v. As soon as the key went from 2 to 1 everything went black, I had driven about twenty minutes.
I swapped the battery for a new one just for piece of mind, no issues yet.
Does it make sense that I could go from no issues, zero struggle in the cold, to no power? Could it really be just a loose battery connection? Should I have the dealer take a look when I go in for oil consumption check 4?
Last night I got back into my car after going to the bank. Turned the key and everything went black. I hooked up another car with jumper cables for 15 minutes. The lights came on but as soon as I started cranking, black. Eventually a tow truck have me a jump that worked. When he jiggled the connector the puddle lights came on. His unit showed no issues with the alternator and my scan gage showed 13.8v. As soon as the key went from 2 to 1 everything went black, I had driven about twenty minutes.
I swapped the battery for a new one just for piece of mind, no issues yet.
Does it make sense that I could go from no issues, zero struggle in the cold, to no power? Could it really be just a loose battery connection? Should I have the dealer take a look when I go in for oil consumption check 4?
02-25-2016, 09:25 AM
#25
Racer
Three days ago after I got had and went insure the store I unlocked my car just fine. All my lights and dashboard worked when I put the key in. When I turned the key to start the car everything went black. I opened and sit the hood and about five minutes later the car started no problem.
Last night I got back into my car after going to the bank. Turned the key and everything went black. I hooked up another car with jumper cables for 15 minutes. The lights came on but as soon as I started cranking, black. Eventually a tow truck have me a jump that worked. When he jiggled the connector the puddle lights came on. His unit showed no issues with the alternator and my scan gage showed 13.8v. As soon as the key went from 2 to 1 everything went black, I had driven about twenty minutes.
I swapped the battery for a new one just for piece of mind, no issues yet.
Does it make sense that I could go from no issues, zero struggle in the cold, to no power? Could it really be just a loose battery connection? Should I have the dealer take a look when I go in for oil consumption check 4?
Last night I got back into my car after going to the bank. Turned the key and everything went black. I hooked up another car with jumper cables for 15 minutes. The lights came on but as soon as I started cranking, black. Eventually a tow truck have me a jump that worked. When he jiggled the connector the puddle lights came on. His unit showed no issues with the alternator and my scan gage showed 13.8v. As soon as the key went from 2 to 1 everything went black, I had driven about twenty minutes.
I swapped the battery for a new one just for piece of mind, no issues yet.
Does it make sense that I could go from no issues, zero struggle in the cold, to no power? Could it really be just a loose battery connection? Should I have the dealer take a look when I go in for oil consumption check 4?
12-26-2017, 05:48 PM
#26
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
Old thread but my car continues to die. I took it to Acura back in February of 2016 and they couldn’t replicate it and denied it was the HFL. They had the car for 3-4 days too. Today, after sitting for 15 hours, my car was dead again. 10.2 volts on the meter. I went to Acura and they checked it again for “$70” and when they came back said it’s the HFL draining at 220ma when the car is turned off. My options are $1990 to replace or nearly $300 to disconnect. Haha, no thank you...
so so I argued that they have a history of me complaining about this issue. It’s documented and just because my warranty is now over doesn’t mean they are free from fixing it. Look, if I brought it in multiple times for an issue and you fail to find it, I still want it fixed when you actually do! Especially considering an Optima Yellow Top pulling over 515Cold Cranking Amps when factory spec is 450 dies overnight. Needless to say, they’re telling me they can’t verify the issue before was related to this issue despite the symptoms being the same. Nice one Acura, really nice... I get my warranty ended a year ago but it doesn’t excuse this as it’s ongoing.
After giving my firm but polite mind to the service advisor, I asked for the service director. He gets it - a 2012 TSX with 31,775 miles on it should NOT have this issue nor should it ever exist. He wrote out a good will request to corporate but due to the holidays they’re not in today. He also waived the $70 fee and disconnected my HFL at no charge. I always knew something was wrong because it always sounds weak. But they kept saying it’s normal but I knew it wasn’t. At least they finally admitted to it... hopefully corporate agrees without me having to take this further because I am not going without HFL but I’m also not paying them to fix it.
so so I argued that they have a history of me complaining about this issue. It’s documented and just because my warranty is now over doesn’t mean they are free from fixing it. Look, if I brought it in multiple times for an issue and you fail to find it, I still want it fixed when you actually do! Especially considering an Optima Yellow Top pulling over 515Cold Cranking Amps when factory spec is 450 dies overnight. Needless to say, they’re telling me they can’t verify the issue before was related to this issue despite the symptoms being the same. Nice one Acura, really nice... I get my warranty ended a year ago but it doesn’t excuse this as it’s ongoing.
After giving my firm but polite mind to the service advisor, I asked for the service director. He gets it - a 2012 TSX with 31,775 miles on it should NOT have this issue nor should it ever exist. He wrote out a good will request to corporate but due to the holidays they’re not in today. He also waived the $70 fee and disconnected my HFL at no charge. I always knew something was wrong because it always sounds weak. But they kept saying it’s normal but I knew it wasn’t. At least they finally admitted to it... hopefully corporate agrees without me having to take this further because I am not going without HFL but I’m also not paying them to fix it.
Note: It’s died many more times than I complain about here. Every morning it sounds like the car struggles with its cold. The remote starter won’t even work it’s so weak. I have complained at each service visit and then a few times in between so it’s not like a once a year it dies type of deal.
Last edited by KrylonBlue; 12-26-2017 at 05:52 PM.
12-26-2017, 06:04 PM
#27
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Good luck with this. Sounds like you might be making some progress with the Service Manager. Keep us posted.
12-27-2017, 03:26 PM
#28
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
Will do. I haven’t heard back from him yet but given the holiday schedule it does make sense as he told me it may not be immediate. My car started without any issues this morning because they disconnected HFL and it was -7 degrees (-18 with wind chill) so it appears we’re on the right track.
12-27-2017, 04:48 PM
#29
I have long suspected that this is the problem with my 2012 Acura TSX (Tech Package). I upgraded the battery, but the car seems to be chewing the new battery up. It starts, but I can tell the battery isn't nearly as strong as the first day it was installed. Where exactly is the HFL module located on your 2012 Acura TSX? I need to unplug mine to see what happens.
12-27-2017, 06:10 PM
#30
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
I have long suspected that this is the problem with my 2012 Acura TSX (Tech Package). I upgraded the battery, but the car seems to be chewing the new battery up. It starts, but I can tell the battery isn't nearly as strong as the first day it was installed. Where exactly is the HFL module located on your 2012 Acura TSX? I need to unplug mine to see what happens.
That I am unsure of because I was able to get my dealership to disable it without charging me. But it is likely to be the cause based on what it sounds like. Also, my remote starter is drawing 60ma which I’m sure doesn’t help but it’s not what’s killing my battery. I may consider disconnecting that too in the future.
12-29-2017, 12:56 PM
#31
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
My battery is much better right now but after sitting overnight I’m seeing about 11.4 on a voltage meter so it’s draining. While it does start, it slightly struggles more than it should and I believe the 60ma draw from my remote start is causing it since the 220ma from the HFL is off the books. The shop that installed it for my dealer said they’ll look at it for no charge and disconnect it if I choose to do so. I’m no expert but it seems to me 60ma is quite a large draw in this cold.
12-29-2017, 12:58 PM
#32
Senior Moderator
You'll need to do a parasitic draw test to see what circuit is draining to determine the culprit..
12-29-2017, 01:10 PM
#33
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
The shop that installed my remote starter is actually going to do this for me so I’ll knock that one out. Acura hasn’t been the best option for these tests so I am going to have a third party check it.*To clarify, this shop installed for my original dealership. They don’t work with the one I am currently dealing with so there isn’t a conflict of interest.
01-01-2018, 02:50 PM
#34
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
It’s been cold (-8 degrees before wind chill) and my car sat for 30 hours due to the holiday. Anyways, car was dead today and the Voltage meter read 11.4 but as soon as I turned the key it would drop to 4.4 so naturally nothing but clicking. Of course, my moms car started, although struggled, after sitting a week with the same type of Optima battery I currently have and my brothers older car but no electronics started after 9 days of sitting. My friend who lives down the road was able to start her 2012 RDX with a stock battery no issues after 48 hours but again they’re not the same cars. I’m getting sick and tired of this car because sure it was negative out but this happens other times too. Hopefully I get some answers this week because it was likely dead overnight in this cold and I will not continue to ruin my battery or waste my time jumping it.
I will likely disconnect the remote start and look for other issues at that time. For now I have it on a slow charger so it starts tomorrow.
I will likely disconnect the remote start and look for other issues at that time. For now I have it on a slow charger so it starts tomorrow.
Last edited by KrylonBlue; 01-01-2018 at 03:02 PM.
01-02-2018, 02:00 PM
#35
What Acura dealer are you going to? I'm curious if its the same one that I visit.
I have a 2012 non tech TSX. I don't think I have drain issue but its rare that the car sits for over a few days. I also upgraded the battery after reading so many complaints about the undersized battery that our I4's came with. It now has a 750cca. Once you get this taken care of maybe you having a bigger battery will compliment all that you have gone through? More info: https://acurazine.com/forums/2g-tsx-...attery-952200/
I'm in Illinois too and it's been brutal outside the passed week. The car has sat for two days in two different instances. Both times started up after about ~4 to 6 seconds of holding down the ignition. The car hated the cold. Brake pedal was very sticky, clutch was slow to move, tires were pissed and were slipping.
I have a 2012 non tech TSX. I don't think I have drain issue but its rare that the car sits for over a few days. I also upgraded the battery after reading so many complaints about the undersized battery that our I4's came with. It now has a 750cca. Once you get this taken care of maybe you having a bigger battery will compliment all that you have gone through? More info: https://acurazine.com/forums/2g-tsx-...attery-952200/
I'm in Illinois too and it's been brutal outside the passed week. The car has sat for two days in two different instances. Both times started up after about ~4 to 6 seconds of holding down the ignition. The car hated the cold. Brake pedal was very sticky, clutch was slow to move, tires were pissed and were slipping.
01-02-2018, 02:10 PM
#36
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
What Acura dealer are you going to? I'm curious if its the same one that I visit.
I have a 2012 non tech TSX. I don't think I have drain issue but its rare that the car sits for over a few days. I also upgraded the battery after reading so many complaints about the undersized battery that our I4's came with. It now has a 750cca. Once you get this taken care of maybe you having a bigger battery will compliment all that you have gone through? More info: https://acurazine.com/forums/2g-tsx-...attery-952200/
I'm in Illinois too and it's been brutal outside the passed week. The car has sat for two days in two different instances. Both times started up after about ~4 to 6 seconds of holding down the ignition. The car hated the cold. Brake pedal was very sticky, clutch was slow to move, tires were pissed and were slipping.
I have a 2012 non tech TSX. I don't think I have drain issue but its rare that the car sits for over a few days. I also upgraded the battery after reading so many complaints about the undersized battery that our I4's came with. It now has a 750cca. Once you get this taken care of maybe you having a bigger battery will compliment all that you have gone through? More info: https://acurazine.com/forums/2g-tsx-...attery-952200/
I'm in Illinois too and it's been brutal outside the passed week. The car has sat for two days in two different instances. Both times started up after about ~4 to 6 seconds of holding down the ignition. The car hated the cold. Brake pedal was very sticky, clutch was slow to move, tires were pissed and were slipping.
Continental Acura of Naperville but it was originally purchased at McGrath Acura of Westmont. Thanks for the info on a bigger battery. It may be the necessary step.
01-02-2018, 06:51 PM
#37
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
I spoke with the Service Director today and he’s still awaiting word from the corporate office. Also, I spoke with the shop that installed my remote starter and I’m bringing it in to them on Friday. When I mentioned it’s drawing 60ma of power, he said that’s way above the normal and basically as much as my whole car draws by itself when there are no issues. I am hoping for some progress this week but we shall see.
On a side note, I ordered an AGM Charger because unfortunately I think it may need a deep charge and my alternator isn’t fully charging it up. I’ll see how this works when I receive it on Friday.
On a side note, I ordered an AGM Charger because unfortunately I think it may need a deep charge and my alternator isn’t fully charging it up. I’ll see how this works when I receive it on Friday.
01-03-2018, 03:43 PM
#40
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
They say it’s drawing too much but can’t say a whole lot because this starter was out on by another Acura dealer. It’s not like I went to a third party shop to get it done. Acura partnered with the shop - as a consumer can’t blame me for that.