Acura and Timing Chain...
 

Hey All! I was reading earlier about people opinions on the quality of Acura/Honda and read a little about timing chains instead of timing belts. I was at an Nissan/Infinite dealer about a month ago when my parents bought their QX4 and they guy there mentioned a timing chain instead of a timing belt. I read up on it and REALLY REALLY REALLY like this chain. Well...with the belt you have to have it replaced at 60K miles (give or take 5K-10K), with the chain, you get a checkup/tuneup on it at 105K! Great isn't it! Well, I was wondering if anybody knows anything about Acura adoption this new feature. Considering Nissan did while ago, I would have figured Acura would have already done so. I'm getting married in a year and a half (May 2005) and I want to get both a brand new MDX and 3.2TL (Type-S if they have it) that fall when the 2006 come out. I WOULD LIKE IT TO HAVE the chain instead of the belt. Any info would be great! Cheers All! ;)


Jatses
jatses@email.com

PS I know this is a stupid question and thread all-together! :p


*EDIT* The caps up top is what I meant to say (stupid late nights). Sorry if this aggivated anybody! *EDIT*

I'm 99.9% sure that all Hondas use timing belts, I'm not aware of any that use timing chains. There are advantages and disadvantages to both and it's whatever the manufacturer thinks are the better features that determines what they choose.

Timing belt:
cheaper, quieter, takes less power to run, needs periodic replacement, may have a tendency to stretch or break.

Timing chains are opposite.

Just like with motorcycles, some manufacturers use chains, some use belts and some use shaft drive.

It all depends on what the manufacturers priorities are when they design the component.

I'm sure others will chime in with other things I might have missed...

Our TL's do not have chains. They have belts....they just have teeth, unlike alternator belt/power steering.

As I understand it, pretty much all Hondas and Acuras use a timing belt. However, I do know that the TSX uses a CHAIN. :)

Since the TSX uses a chain. How long do you think it will take for them to switch the rest of them over to it? Thanks All! ;)


Jatses
jatses@email.com

a little but important correction here. the timing belts on the 02TL and up are long life belt which pushes the replacement out to 105k mile.
considering that there really isnt a good enough reason to regress in technology.

I thought the 03 TL-S had a timing chain? I just had mine iin for the chain tensioner recall.

Absolutely a Timing Belt. The recall was for the "Belt" tensioner.

The new generation Accord 4 bangers also use a timing chain. The 6 cylinders still use a timing belt but like Yield2S indicates it is good for 105K miles.

is that really gonna effect what car you buy?

I Like Timing Belts. They are more efficient, less horsepower to run. Many of the cars I have owned had them. just change them as scheduled. Be aware chains used in overhead cam engines can get very long. They weigh a lot and streach more than a belt. The streach throws off cam and ignition timing. As I recall MB timing chains were as long as I am tall and needed replacement at about 120k. Unless you got a 380 and they just break. Ferrari, Lotus, Maserati, have belts, I hope Honda sticks with belts, chains are a step backwards.

Chains can break too (I've seen it happen).
Arent the chains actively lubricated?; belts definately are not.
Chains are louder (Pre mid 80's autos predominantly had chains).

Things like water pumps should be replaced around the same time. Honestly you save money in the long run b/c supposedly the water pump has to be removed in the process of getting to the timing belt.

Buddy of mine had that done to his '97 Accord. Saved him a lot of money in labor costs b/c he did it together vs. seperate. So maybe a timing belt isn't too bad for that reason in addition to others :)

My .02

Saying the chain is better that the belt is pure sales talk marketing baloney.

Hondas and Toyotas have use belts for years and were successful. Even older Nissans (ex. 240SX) had timing chains and have never proven to be better than Honda engines. I'm sure it would be pretty obvious on a similar year Honda or Nissan which one holds value and retains reliability.

you dont need to replace the belt that often, i personally like belts better. there quieter, less expensive, less to go wrong. with chains, chains DO STRETCH. if something gets into where the chain is it will break teeth on the gears. i wouldnt worry about chain over belt. hondas have the most reliable engines out there and they have been running belts forever. i have 132k on my belt. i had 1 honda with 275k on the original belt

My 94 accord manual called for belt replacements every 90k miles, my tl is 105k. Belts are better than chains for ohc applicatios for the reason mentioned above. They would need to be long. So long that they would be much much heavier than belts.
As mentioned above, ferraris use belts too. Im very knowledgeable about ferraris and their maintenance and ferrari recommends changes every 30k miles or 5 years. Belts on them DO break without much milage for some reason. The worst part is to get a belt changed, it can cost up to $5k (testarossa), or more depending on if all you need was a belt. If you think about it, its better to pay the 5k for the new belt than the 25k when you need your engine rebuilt when the old belt breaks.
The guy who mentioned the ferrari belts wsa wrong about Maserati though. The new maserati (whose engine is actually built in a ferrari factory) uses timing chains. Ferrari insiders are predicting that the 360 replacement may, infact, have chains since it will probably use a variation of the current maserati V8. Others doubt this since it will cut dowen on service intervals which means less $ for the dealers who service cars. This is a problem beacuse the ferrari dealers make their money servicing cars, NOT selling them.

I still think that the poster of this thread is an idiot for basing his car purchases based soley on the system used to drive the cams.

My dad had an '81 Mercedes Diesel sedan which used a timing chain and it was noisy.

NO I'm not stupid enough to base my purchase off whether it has a belt or chain. From what everybody has said the belts they use today are 10 times better then the chain. One reason I posted this was because I am used to GM products that you had to change it at 60K miles. That was almost 10 years ago. Been awhile since my family had a new vehicle besides our 2001 QX4 and it didn't have a manual, so I still don't know. Well...I believe the belt is the way to go since they last so much longer. 105K, I am more then satisfied with that long! Cheers All! ;)



Jatses
jatses@email.com

GM and American companies alike use chains more often. My Z06 had a chain. Of course, it was a good 'ole pushrod V8 :) I sold it just before the warranty expired so no experience in having or knowing when to have the timing chain serviced hehe The car had other issues.

Who cares, you only will change the belt/chain maybe twice in the lifetime of a Honda/Acura anyway!

My Chevy Astro has 160K miles with a pushrod V6 with the original timing chain. Chains typically last the life of the vehicle (200K + miles) but do tend to streach. A belt will eventually break if left in past it's usefull life.

ACURA RSX uses a timing chain also, for those who didn't know...

You guys mentioned 02+TLs require the belt to get changed at 105k how about a 2k TL? just curious i was already planning on changing the belt but i'm not sure i got about 55k on it.