geocord

Excuse me but I didn't say I quoted, I said I made a direct copy from the RDX online manual as posted in myacura.com. You do know what a screen copy is don't you. It means that it is an exact copy not an interpretation or retype.

Also, but what part of "less than 87 octane" don't you understand? It say if you use LESS THAN 87 it can cause engine damage. It does NOT say using less than 91 will cause engine damage. I acutally use premium 91(sometimes 89) in my RDX but it is not because I think 87 will damage my engine.

You quote from a TL manual and call others out on that. How childish. C'man, do you think you are the only one that wants to take care of their vehicles.

AnyaBoo

The recommended fuel for the RDX is 91 Octane as well on the Acura.com website. You can look up in your owners manual to see if any adverse can happen to your engine from using regular unleaded. I can only pull up the manual for my model online.

AnyaBoo

You didn't state your source originally. You know, you are very defensive person. Forums are about opinions and facts. The fact is the TL manual say use 87 octane or higher temporarily. It doesn't say using less than 87 may cause engine damage. It says use of 87 octane regularly may cause engine damage. That's because it doesn't have high grade detergent which without can leave deposit in the engine and over time damage it.

I'm sorry but if you don't want to spent money getting the recommended maintenance on the car, you shouldn't have bought it. You should have bought a car that accepts 85 octane.

I don't get why people buy luxury cars just to tear them up because they want to be cheap. I guess the old "trade it in when problems arise" motto is what's followed. And then it becomes the new owner's problem.

geocord

Page 263 of the RDX owner's manual:



■

Use of lower octane gasoline can cause occasional metallic knocking noise in the

engine and will result in decreased engine performance.

Use of gasoline with a pump octane less than 87 can lead to engine damage.

control system. For further important fuel-related information for your vehicle, or on information on gasoline that does not contain MMT, visit My Acura at owners.acura.com In Canada, visit www.acura.ca for additional information on gasoline. For more information on top tier gasoline, visit www.toptiergas.com.

AnyaBoo

Okay so the RDX doesn't say 87 Octane may damage the engine but less than 87 will. The TL manual say use 87 Octane temporarily as long term use may damage the engine. But not recommend 91 Octane, which is what I would use. It wouldn't be recommended for nothing. In the case of the RDX, using a lower grade sacrifices engine performance but won't damage the engine but it will damage the engine of the TL.

In Colorado, we have 85, 87, and 91. So yes, 85 Octane does exist at every gas station in Colorado.

Again, it is up to you. Just like when the car tells you it's time for your recommended maintenance...you can blow that off too. No one is forcing you to follow the recommended Acura guidelines but I do because when or if it breaks down, I want to know that it wasn't my carelessness that caused it. That's just me...my opinion.

TLtrigirl

iTrader: (1)

^^i think geocord's point is that you shouldn't be quoting the TL's fuel needs in a RDX fuel thread. the ongoing debate within this thread is solely with the 2G RDX b/c 87 can be used without damage and only a loss in performance. for optimal performance 91 is recommended. if you read the other posts in the thread they are trying to ascertain why the option to use 87 vs 91+ exists.

in the TL 91+ is REQUIRED. not all acura's have the same fuel requirement.

AnyaBoo

Ugh! You guys never get comparisons on here nor know how to dicipher the similarities of both vehicles. Your statement above is a cop out. Refusal to read about the RDX because the TL is mentioned in the same paragraph...never fails. Both vehicles can with 87, the TL only temporarily. And if 87 or lower is used on the RDX over time can cause performance degradation. And lastly (and most importantly) Acura recommends 91 Octane for BOTH vehicles. My points still stand regardless of the forum category. Go ahead, keep talking yourselves comfy.......

TLtrigirl

iTrader: (1)

^^wow defensive aren't we? "Refusal to read about the RDX because the TL is mentioned in the same paragraph...never fails". <==

how is my statement a cop out? all of your posts on AZ come off as if you know it all. then when folks who actually own the vehicle namely the folks that predominate this thread call you out on it you get all defensive. Note: i do not own an RDX, but i do know a bit about the RDX from reading what their owners have written (here on AZ), talked with folks at the dealer, reading reviews of the vehicle and actually having driven the car. however certainly i do not consider myself an expert on the RDX (hence i read to LEARN about it).

if you READ my post you would actually be able to determine that i'm not taking sides on the regular vs premium debate for a vehicle that can accept both. i was merely trying to help you UNDERSTAND the differences in what is written in the OM for each car and what has been discussed in this thread if you actually READ any of it to begin with.
BTW Acura "recommends" 91+ for the TSX (i believe), the ILX, and the 2G RDX. it does not REQUIRE 91. the TL, MDX, RL and 1G RDX REQUIRES 91+.

do you know WHY Acura recommends and/or requires premium? or are you just going by what the OM says without knowing the engineering involved?

by all means make contributions across the models, but you need to stay on topic for the specific model that is discussed. there is NO reason to get defensive.

/rebuttal. carry on the debate guys...happy motoring!

AnyaBoo

I am not being defensive. Just stating the fact that you and another poster began blowing off my comments because I am a TL owner. If I wasn't reading the posts, I wouldn't have changed "required" to "recommended" in my last post.

I do not claim to know it all. I read the thread from top to bottom, and had an opinion to make. I researched the RDX on the Acura website and they said use of regular unleaded can cause engine deposits to build up in the engine as it doesn't contain high grade detergent. Those deposits can damage the engine of the TL and cause performance degradation in the RDX. What I don't know for the RDX is, is it possible to do a regular gas treatment on the car that cleans those deposits out. I know there are a lot of additives out but many of them have been blacklisted by mechanics. If you know of a good one, please share so that others can protect their engines if they choose to not use the manufacturer recommended 91 Octane.

Again I think you are taking my older posts and trying to plaster together a picture of who I am which is inaccurate. Part of who I am is a person that follows the Acura recommendations to the "T". And part of me is not a know it all. I am a new member trying to contribute given the research I have uncovered. I learned something from this thread and that is what counts. I just wanted folks to reconsider the type of gas they are pumping into their expensive vehicles. My TL is my baby. I treat her to the best. And I have just been shocked to find out others don't care enough to do the same. It is YOUR car like I said earlier, you can put in 85 octane and blow off scheduled maintenance if you want but I am different. Many members are here on these forums because they CARE deeply about their vehicles, and I am one of them.

TLtrigirl

iTrader: (1)

^^it is your tone and judging of other members (not by name, but implied) in your responses that comes off negatively.

this thread has nothing to do with what i put in either my TL or MDX (which, BTW, i put 93 octane, and follow my MID and OM for my maintenance schedule).

weather

AnyaBoo....I am exactly like you in that I follow Acura's recommendation to a T and anal about it

On another note, TLtrigirl is one the greatest contributor to this forum (over 3500 posts) and she has a lot of knowledge about Acura and is quite up there with the best of the best. When you mentioned that you CARE deeply about your vehicle, trust me, TLtrigirl is one of them, and if you have been reading my posts, I am one also...hence why I am so fond of her

AnyaBoo

Well I am happy to hear you are taking good care of your vehicles. It gets confusing when originally I am addressing the majority of the comments of the thread which posters stated they would rather save $250 a year than pump premium gas in their vehicles. It gets even more confusing when someone new (such as yourself) jumps in the middle of a two way conversation with false assumptions.

I'm sorry if my "tone" sounded harsh but it really isn't. Once again that's an assumption based on reading my words on a screen. You can't possibly know the true tone unless someone types in all caps and uses a bunch of exclamation marks. I am not batting you for defending your friend but then you can't get mad when I respond with things that don't nessarily apply to you because I am addressing the original conversation by responding to the comments you made to me about someone else's car maintenance. In other words, my comments about poor maintenance were not directed at you. Just keep the context of my post in mind before you defend your maintenance habits.

Another thing was you defended a person that doesn't use premium gas versus siding with one who does, so what does that possibly mean?

Again, my whole point of coming here was to express that I use 91 Octane as Acura recommends for the TL and that it is recommended for RDX as well. Many responses were along the lines of "I would rather save $250 a month than have the fuel economy and performance". In this case, why by a performance car when you are going to kill the performance using regular unleaded? At this point, you are only driving it for looks. IMHO, that doesn't make sense. I want my TL to perform as well as it did on day one 3 years from now.

AnyaBoo

I mean to say $250 per YEAR not month. That would be insane!

nj2pa2nc

Read your post and had to respond. I do not have a RDX or TL. I own a 06 6MT tsx. I have all the maintenance done by Honda/acura dealers. The OEM tires lasted 74k miles, the next tires lasted 70k miles. Still have the original brakes. My car gets excellent gas mileage with more than enough power on regular gas. My car has 148k+ problem free miles.

AnyaBoo

We have been talking about how Acura models have slightly different fuel requirements. On the TL, premium gas should be used most of the time and regular unleaded (at least 87) temporarily if 91 is unavailable. On the RDX, use of less than 87 may cause performance degradation. The key word here is "may". Use of 87 consistently on the TL may cause engine damage. Again, key word..."may". I don't know what the requirements are for the TSX because I haven't looked them up yet.

I am glad you have no issues with your TSX. If your TSX does recommend 91 (key word is "if", I haven't seen Acura's recommendation for the TSX yet), then you are taking a gamble. I prefer to not take gambles and follow recommendations as stated by Acura. Just because you haven't had any problems doesn't mean it should be done. I personally recommend that everyone find out from the manufacturer what is required/recommended for their vehicles rather pumping 85 gas because someone on Acurazine does and they haven't had problems because that doesn't guarantee that you won't have problems.

If the TSX can accept 87 or 85 without any warnings from the manufacturer, by all means pump it up! If there are adverse warnings from the manufacturer and you ignore them, you either don't care if what they say may happen, happens or you are taking a gamble to save a couple of bucks when you fill up at the pump. As for me, I do neither.

AnyaBoo

I just looked up the requirements for the TSX on the Acura website and it says, 91 Octane recommended for the 4 cyl and 91 required for the V6. Keep in mind that the fuel requirements I have been discussing for the TL, RDX, and TSX are for 2012-2013 models. Older models may have different fuel requirements.

CoachRick

Boo, you're killin' me. The octane rating of a fuel has absolutely NOTHING to do with the quality of the additives it contains. We can buy 87 octane fuel that is rated 'top tier' and be assured that the fuel contains better than the minimum required additives AND/OR we can buy 91 octane fuel that DOES NOT contain higher levels of cleaning additives and may contain nasty metallic additives that may harm the engine.

Conversely, we could buy el cheapo 87 and put our engines in a world of hurt, especially over time. We could also buy el cheapo 91 or 93 and NOT get the proper additives and cause fuel system troubles down the road.

The OCTANE rating does not bear a direct relationship to the cleaning capability of the fuel. That cleaning/maintenance capability is NOT a function of octane...87 does NOT contain a lower level of cleaners than 91 or 93(unless someone specifically ADDS cleaners to 'whatever' rating they wish).

Honda is one of the manufacturers who support the 'Top Tier' rating system, specifically to inform consumers about the availability of fuel that qualifies for the 'top tier' rating. It is NOT a function of octane.

W-A-Y too much confusion results from referring to 'regular' gasoline as 85/87 octane and 'premium' as 91/93. The octane is not a function of the quality of the fuel. Again, an 87 octane fuel CAN be a top-tier fuel; BUT a 93 octane fuel might NOT be.

Here's a bit from the "Top Tier" folks...remember, Honda is one of the companies that supports this organization and the effort to inform consumers about the quality of available fuels...
http://www.toptiergas.com/index.html

1. Is TT only for my premium gasoline? No. TOP TIER fuel marketers use the same detergency treat rate for all octane grades of gasoline sold at their stations.
2. If I already use a high detergency rate, why can’t I just say I’m TT? The TOP TIER program is not just about a high detergency rate. It is about an engine cleanliness and performance specification. If a fuel marketer completes all of the engine and fuel injector testing required in the TOP TIER program and passes, then they can claim to be TOP TIER.

It is false economy to assume a 91 octane rated fuel is absolutely better for an engine without considering the quality of the fuel; just as it is disingenuous to suggest that running a high-quality 87 octane can lead to harmful deposits on fuel injectors and intake valves.

Especially for those owners who want to keep their babies running smartly for many years, I'd pump 87 octane high-quality fuel over 93 from 'El Cheapo' any day.

And while we're picking nits, there's really no reason to bring 85 octane fuel into the discussion. I'd dare say 90+% of us have never seen it and NO ONE suggested running 85 was a good idea. The manual flat out states that octanes below 87 can be dangerous to the engine...no one here is arguing that they want to stick with running 85.

geocord

I am tired of this holier than thou attitude you come across with. Who are you to tell anybody that $250 or $500 is not material? You do not walk in their shoes. I told you that I use 91 octane in my RDX. I take of my vehicles as I just traded in a 10 year old Infiniti that was almost like new so I take of my vehicles as my didn't "blow up". I originally posted just to correct misinformation which you had posted to the effect that anything under 91 octane will damage your engine. I provided a copy and paste directly from the RDX manual. You came back and said I was wrong and that I misinterpreted the manual. Well how can I misinterpret a copy and paste.

All the time you kept referring to the TL information which is different. The 3.5L engine in the TL is different than the 3.5L engine in the RDX. The one in the RDX is the same as the Honda Accord and the Honda Odyssey, both of which run on 87 octane. The RDX is tuned a little different but it is still the same engine. There could be some power degradation and/or a slight and I mean very slight MPG affect as well. However, in easy, everyday driving from what I've read here and in several other forums it is hard to notice unless under very hard acceleration.

Bottom line: A forum such as this is to provide information and discussion, not to tell others what to do or to tell they are wrong for doing so unless you have some pretty damn good evidence that you are right.

AnyaBoo

Just because you haven't seen 85 Octane, it exists in every gas station in the state of Colorado. Next time I am at the pump I will take a picture of what is offered in my neck of the woods. There are 3 million people in Colorado which means A LOT of people pump 85 Octane. And it is probably available in other mid western states as well so just because you don't have it, doesn't mean that it is irrelevant. There are millions that use 85 Octane and there are way more people reading this thread than just us posting. Lets quit acting like 85 Octane is a green leprechaun because it is not.

Acura has the same verbiage on their website as well. They ARE the same company. I never use Cheapo gas. I have blacklisted gas from grocery store chains, 7 Eleven, and some others that when I see them I drive by. I go to ConocoPhillips most of the time and Shell if ConocoPhillips is not available. Just because I didn't get into these nits doesn't mean I don't follow them. I careless about the price at the pump. If it is too high, I cringe and pump anyway. I also use premium "premium" high quality 91 Octane.

AnyaBoo

Get over it and pump what the hell you want to pump in your damn car. I don't care not one bit. If you are pissed because I have a different opinion, you will continue to be pissed because I am not changing how I feel. There are others reading these posts and I wanted to state a different opinion for consideration. There is nothing wrong with that. You can call me holier than thou or whatever you want to call me but I am following the guidelines that Acura put forth...end of story. You are going down a dead end road with me.

AnyaBoo

Oh and your statement who am I to tell people that $250 a year in savings [by pumping the wrong Octane] is not material" and blah blah blah...you don't know their financial situation. My statement to the above is don't buy a car you can't afford it, period. Don't overly try to justify not following the recommendations because you can't afford it! Buy something you can live comfortably with. I live very comfortably with my Acura TL. Could I with a Land Rover? Hell no. So I don't buy what I can't FULLY afford. The end.

Shahryar

I brought this up in this thread earlier and will bring it up again: The reason I, along with others, am not going with Premium gas in my 2013 RDX is not because I can't afford it. We just have not seen the proof and evidence needed to justify spending the extra amount (which while affordable, is significant enough to warrant more answers).

So let's stop assuming that those who don't want to spend the extra on premium are not doing it because they can't afford it. That's a silly accusation to make. And yes, the Acura is in the 40k (although now realistically mid-to-high 30k mark), but it's really the most economical "luxury" route you can go. Hell, their ad campaign for this time of year is "Season of Reason."

If we're discussing this point in a Bentley forum, yeah my argument's a bit harder to make, but the point still stands: Many people just want to make their money count because they work hard to earn it and don't want to waste it on an assumed precaution.

AnyaBoo

This may be my last post here because we are going around in circles. I read from the official Acura website that 91 Octane is recommended NOT required as it is on the TL model. It states that using less than 87 can cause performance degradation. It sounds like you don't have 85 Octane in your state or country so there is no harm there so for RDX owners just pump 87 Octane and BE HAPPY! There are no warnings from the manufacturer for 87 Octane in the RDX like there is are for the TL model. If I owned a RDX (which I am considering in the future), I would pump 91 Octane as it would give me peace of mind knowing I am following Acura's recommendation for the vehicle and not operating in a gray area. Now before you get trigger finger happy and dive for the reply button, just realize that this is who I am and what I feel comfortable doing. I am in no means saying that 87 Octane is bad for the RDX. We don't know (like you said). I stated my preferences and you can follow your own for the RDX.

Lastly, I did not imply that folks were pumping 87 Octane because they can't afford more expensive gas. I was RESPONDING to someone who made that assumption by saying "IF" that is the case, buy a car within your means. Yes the commercials say "Season of Reason" but that isn't a green light for people to purchase. The target demographics still point to a $100,000 a year household income for a $35K car. It is "Season of Reason" because folks with slightly lower incomes can buy a nice luxury vehicle within their means through Acura. The higher end luxury car companies have demographics that point to a $150-250K household income (depending on the price of the vehicle). Not saying that someone with a lower income can't buy an mid range priced Acura but they will have less disposable income and ownership won't be as comfy. There are also people at higher income levels than Acura's target that will buy an Acura because a lot of their income is tied in other things or they aren't the type of person to buy a land rover or high end Lexus or Infinity because they want to maximize cash flow.

Now hopefully this won't get any nasty responses because it shouldn't. You should just say to yourself, "It is her money and if she wants to spend extra so as not to operate in a gray area, that's fine". Continuing to bash my habits and preferences, is counterproductive. To each his/her own.

geocord

Who the heck was bashing your habits? Absolutely nobody. The only things that you were bashed about were the fact that you were providing wrong information and trying to tell everyone else what they should put in their tank based on that wrong information. Has anyone on this forum ever said that you should not put 91octane in your vehicle or that it was unwise to do so? I don't think so. So take the chip off your shoulder and have a civil discussion with people that are looking for answers, not being told they are dumb for looking at reasonable options.

AnyaBoo

I said I was being bashed because one of the posts above stated that I was being "holier than thou" by pumping 91 Octane in my vehicle.

I stated later on in my posts clarification on the recommendations/requirements of the 2nd Gen RDX but even after stating that I learned something new from ya'll and stated new accurate information, I am still bashed for being inaccurate in my earlier posts. I made a mistake and clarified information in my latter posts. People make mistakes and can always learn something new.

Lastly, I am not telling people what Octane to put in their cars. I questioned it. I have constantly reiterated for folks to pump what they want in their cars but I also constantly reiterated what Acura recommends for the RDX and TL. Folks can read both sides of the discussion and make a determination on what they would like their Acura vehicles to run on after weighing the pros and the cons.

Not everyone agrees with the consensus of others all the time. And when there is disagreement, there should be respectful discourse in the conversation. Not bashing an outsider because they don't agree.

So again (for the record), pump the Octane you feel is best for your vehicle given the recommendations from Acura and your own personal preferences.

weather

I am amazed how much postings this thread has caused...and how much viewings. All for about 3-5$ a tank.

** I guess by posting here makes me just a guilty *lol* **

Djames210

Somebody said that "long term wise, regular will cause the engine to lag and lead to poor MPGs which in turn will make you fill up more (spend more money on gas) vs premium fuel."

To me, this sounds like theory as opposed to fact. I would like to see some real-world numbers. At the least, I would like to hear from an Acura engineer and marketing VP to determine who dreamed up the premium fuel recommendation.

Djames210

I take delivery of my new RDX tomorrow so I'll see what the dealer says.

its_ikon

dealer told me i can fill up with 87, but i will stick with Acura's recommendation and use 91 or higher. 91 is only available in Vegas so i am limited to that. i pay for a luxury car, for the $3 difference is not a big deal. funny thing is that when i went in to look at the RDX, a couple was complaining about the use 91 and was asking if they could get away with use regular for a few fill ups and then using premium for one. i can't help but laugh at that.

CoachRick

It's interesting that the price of 87 around here is dropping while the 89 and 93 are holding pretty much. That's resulted in a 45 cent margin between 87 and 93 at some of the top tier stations. That will get your attention when you consider the $7 difference each week for each vehicle...that's over $700 for the year...enough to cover our insurance on one vehicle!

QN52

That's insane. The difference where I am in Canada is about 10 cents/litre more. On Thursdays, it's 7 cents more.

Works out to be an extra $100 a year for the amount that we drive.

its_ikon

it would be a difference of about $300 a year for me to use regular and i would rather have my engine running as advertised. i am used to paying for premium anyway

Shahryar

As I mentioned earlier, I'm not convinced that putting in Premium will help with my 2013 Acura RDX's long term Engine health. It just seems most people "feel" that's the case and want to do a "better safe than sorry" route.

however, I do wonder if by going with Regular instead of Premium, I'm losing some kick off the starting line. I'm now 1k+ miles and almost a a month into ownership of my new RDX. It does feel like that pick up I was experiencing during my test drives isn't quite there. I assume that the car had come then w/ premium gas from the manufacturer. Could this be the case or is it in my head?

I may be going on a long drive over the holidays from DC to Chicago (Normally I don't enjoy long drives but with a new car it's kind of fun). I was thinking of gassing up only in premium along the way so that the ECM or whatever would adjust and see if I notice that same pickup which I think I recall. Could the difference in drive between Regular and Premium in the tank be that much?

Any thoughts?

its_ikon

I say test it out, only way to know is to run 3-4 tanks of one grade and then 3-4 tanks of another grade after the break-in period. MPG will be bad and fluctuate for the first 1k miles and will get stable between the 3k-5k mark. I had an 07 FJ that required premium fuel and it had the same engine as the Tacoma that didn't require it. Toyota released a service bulletin and said it was ok to use regular in the FJ, but noted the horsepower/ performance numbers wouldn't be the same because the advertised numbers were based on using premium. I tested 5 tanks of regular and got a lot worse mileage to the point I was saving money use premium. Of course, it all comes down to where you drive and how you drive.

CraigT

Checkout the News Release from Honda on the Acura 2013 RDX:

http://www.honda.com/newsandviews/ar...spx?id=6554-en

FUEL TANK AND DRIVING RANGE
The RDX's 16-gallon fuel tank is located in a protected position under the body and forward of the rear wheels. The RDX has an EPA estimated* city/highway/combined fuel economy of 19/27/22 mpg (AWD) and 20/28/23 (2WD), which gives it an estimated highway range of approximately 430 miles (AWD) and 450 miles (2WD) miles on one tank of fuel. The use of Premium fuel is recommended (but not required) for the 3.5L V-6 engine in the 2013 RDX.

I have been using premium, but may go down to mid grade.

CraigT

I found this on Acura web page http://www.acura.com/Engine.aspx?mod...modelYear=2013

If you click on the '20' next to the 'Recommended Fuel' a box with the following statement is displayed.

"Customers who choose to use Regular gas should expect reductions in power, performance and fuel economy."

CoachRick

Interesting...right above that quote it states:
"Octane- TSX 4cyl and TSX SW"
...but, it is on the RSX page...hmmmm?
What the heck, Dr. Oz???

realtimeduck

My new rig just runs so sweet on Premium. I tried regular and the excelleration is just not quite there and the hum of the engine fades. Sweet rig likes sweet gas. Feed it.

CraigT

I went to the other models (TL, TSX, MDX...) pages and if you click on the # next to the 'Required Fuel' it states -

"Octane -RL, TL, ILX, RDX, MDX, TSX V-6

Using gasoline with an octane lower than 91 octane may cause damage to the engine. Please consult the owner's manual for details."

http://www.acura.com/Engine.aspx?mod...modelYear=2013

I'm staying with Prem... It is worth the $4 more per week for me.

CoachRick

Clear as mud...as they say.

How many people put a check-mark in the 'runs fine on 87 octane' box when shopping for CUVs and gave the RDX a point for that? Somebody call a lawyer...I smell a class-action suit.