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Old 04-27-2004, 9:43 PM   #1
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Headlights changing color?

When I've followed friends or my wife in my new TSX, they've informed me that my headlights change color. I thought they were crazy so I took my wife's car out and had her follow me in mine. No kidding, the lights (driver's side in particular) changed from white, to blue, to green, to pink, back to white. I saw it happen several times on a very short ride.

The HID headlights are obviously new to me and I previously read about the blue-color in this forum. I am going to call the dealer but does anyone have an answer? Thank you.
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Old 04-27-2004, 10:44 PM   #2
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http://www.intellexual.net/hid.html

read that
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Old 04-27-2004, 10:57 PM   #3
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I wouldn't get too bothered with it. A change in color on HID lamps usually means a change in temperature of the bulb. It seems like it lasted for at the most a few seconds, so don't worry about it.

I'd worry a little more if it went red permanently, it would mean something would be wrong with the arc, and what produces the arc by extension. Something like a leak in the bulb, meaning the gas would evacuate, preventing the bulb and gas mixture obviously from igniting properly.
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Old 04-27-2004, 11:38 PM   #4
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LoL, sorry to be rude, but where do you guys live? You have never seen HID projector headlights on another car before? I see em all the time, mainly Audis here in Alaska and the lights are awesome. I love how the colors change, it's 100% normal, it is caused by the arc in the projector, it bends the light. If you park your car facing a wall or garage door, look at the very top of the cut off line, you will see a rainbow of color.

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I love HID's!
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Old 04-27-2004, 11:52 PM   #5
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damn wess you in alaska...how the heck you ended up out there..?
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Old 04-28-2004, 12:14 AM   #6
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yeah, i see colors changing all the time as well on HIDs...just tonight, i saw an S2000 coming over a hill, and the colors were changing. I personally like how that happens.
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Old 04-28-2004, 3:07 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by tc86
yeah, i see colors changing all the time as well on HIDs...just tonight, i saw an S2000 coming over a hill, and the colors were changing. I personally like how that happens.
this is because s2k, and ours and audi's and many others who
have projector headlights... at diff angles, the light will have
diff colours, like an rainbow...

headlights like last gen TL which have hid's but won't change colour
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Old 04-28-2004, 3:21 AM   #8
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still, i've noticed that Audi's BMW's esp. bmw all have projectors that seem to be more "bluish" than any other projector xenons, why's that? is it because of the size of the projector lens...? or does it still have to do with the angel in which it's being projected?

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Old 04-28-2004, 4:06 AM   #9
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Is our light tooooooo bright? People always complain!!!
Anybody knows how to adjust them?
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Old 04-28-2004, 10:56 AM   #10
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Ok, LoL, I moved up here from Cali when I was 5. Family issues and we basically started our lives over when we moved up here. It was for the better and here I am, 19 years old with a $27,000 dollar car, I couldn't be more happier . Just takes time to save for a big down payment, that's how I got this car.

Anyways, Park your car in front of a wall or garage, the lights are at a perfect level. That cut off line is below the drivers window if parked next to another car. That means that there is no glare at all, only when going over a bump the lights will "bounce" making them look brighter. So there's no reason to adjust them.

As for the color, I think we have Phillips 4100K, which is pure white. Only reason ours appear blue is becuase of the projector, as I said before it bends the light. BMW may have a bulb with a higher Kelvin. 6100K would be a blue white, 7500K is blue, and 8000K is Diamond white(a purple color). That's true, cars that have HID's and no projector, they wont change colors. Those cars still look nice though .

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Old 04-28-2004, 11:02 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by gfxdave99
http://www.intellexual.net/hid.html

read that
Since people are too lazy to click

HALOGEN

First a background of automotive lighting technology. Before there was HID technology, there was halogen lighting. Halogen is what has been used in automotive lighting for the last 50 years or so and has peaked in its technological advancement. Halogen lighting involves a conventional direct-current direct-circuit setup. The bulb itself houses a filament commonly made of tungsten metal, which is basically a very delicate loose coil of exotic wire. The filament is held up by two chemically-treated, copper-coated steel (or molybdenum) lead wires. On some bulbs, like the 9006/HB4, the glass bulb that encases them is capped at the end with a nickel-plated brass film. The bulb itself is also filled with a noble gas of some sort, which we'll get into later. When electrical current is supplied to the positive lead wire in the halogen bulb, it crosses a path of tungsten wire, which has very high electrical resistance. It is this high resistance that produces heat and ultimately light as a byproduct. This is essentially the same principle of operation as fire: intense heat used to produce light. Halogen low beams will normally operate on 55 watts of power. Fog lights operate at around 35 watts to 55 watts, and high beams at 55 watts to 85 watts. It is a very simple technology fundamentally, but there are flaws in the halogen mostly relating to efficiency of power.




An enhanced picture of a tungsten filament in a halogen bulb


First of all, halogen bulbs produce more heat than they do actual light (incandescence), which translates to an inefficient usage of potential energy. Secondly, as the halogen bulb is used, tungsten atoms begin to evaporate from the filament due to the extreme heat. When the tungsten evaporates, it deposits itself on the relatively cool surface of the glass bulb (this is why dead light bulbs are often black), and the filament becomes thinner and more brittle. Sooner or later the filament will evaporate enough tungsten particles that it snaps in two pieces and breaks the electrical circuit. In simple terms you have a dead light bulb.




A 9006 halogen bulb


Now stepping back to the gas filling as mentioned earlier. Because tungsten evaporates away rather quickly, researchers learned to fill the bulbs with inert gases like argon, krypton, and yes the infamous XENON! The sole purpose of these heavy gases is to create a level of pressure within the bulb that deters tungsten evaporation. Once a tungsten atom leaves the surface of the filament, it is immediately blocked by giant xenon particles that are crowding it and pushing it back towards the surface of the filament. Xenon is most commonly used because it is the heaviest of the inert gases and is also tied to HID lighting; therefore an opportunity for marketing deception arises. The reason why xenon-filled halogen bulbs don't work indefinitely is because tungsten is a smaller atom and still manages to escape the xenon, redepositing itself somewhere else on the filament, which still thins the filament where the atom originally evaporated from. Halogen bulbs can also be broken by a forceful jolt strong enough to fracture the filament, or by overpowering/mispowering bulbs to a degree that flash-boils the tungsten.



HIGH INTENSITY DISCHARGE

HID technology also known as gas discharge is quite different from halogens. HID uses a capsule (bulb) with two adjacent electrodes positioned in close proximity to each other. The capsule sends these two leads to an electronic HID ballast. The ballast is an electronic module that has a circuit board lined with several small high current capacitors, transistors, and resistors. This ballast acts as an ignition box to fire up the gas discharge process, and as a control unit to regulate a steady power flow. The HID capsule is filled with a rich mixture of noble gases as well as alkali earth metal salts. In this setup, the noble gases and metal salts are actually used as part of the lighting processes instead of as a buffer (as with halogens). For quick ignition, the ballast takes in a small amount of input power of 35 watts at 12 volts and inducts a solid-state charge of 25,000 volts to the positive electrode. This creates a very high-powered arc of electricity across the electrodes, which excites xenon gas into discharging photon particles (light). This process is known as the Gas Discharge Principle.

The light is relatively cool burning compared to halogen, consumes much less power, and produces much more light at a much higher color temperature. Halogen lighting in automobiles has become an archaic technology and is steadily being replaced by HID lighting systems in more and more automobiles. They are no longer limited in availability as high-end luxury amenities. Nissan, Toyota, and Ford are already offering factory HIDs in some of their cars.




A normal D2S gas-discharge bulb




DIFFERENCES/BENEFITS

Some of the benefits of HID over halogen are...

Up to three times less wattage is used (HID = 35w, halogen = 55-100w)
Up to four times more bright light produced (HID = 2400-3200lu, halogen = 800-1700lu)
Up to ten times more intense light produced (HID = 202,500cd, halogen = 21,000cd)
Up to six times longer lifespan (HID = 2500hr, halogen = 400hr)
HID light contains less infrared and ultraviolet light, which fatigues the driver and surrounding motorists
HID light illuminates the road with better contrast and more lifelike tones of color
Halogen filaments naturally produce a color of 2300K to 4000K (2300K is yellowish, 4000K is whitish) Anything bluer requires the use of light-dimming color filters
HID produces a natural color of 4100K to 6000K (4100K is daylight white, and 6000K is slightly bluish white) Anything bluer requires the use of light-dimming color filters
HID lighting produces a wider and deeper beam pattern with razor sharp cut off lines and autolevelling motors*
HID has low lumen maintenance, meaning bulbs do not dim down as much towards the end of their lives
HID has high flux properties, meaning light is very evenly distributed when installed properly
*Only available in factory/OEM installed HID systems excluding Acura


BULB SELECTION

HID bulbs come in two common standards today known as: D2S and D2R. D2S uses the D2 base and a clear, naked bulb. D2R uses the same D2 base and a bulb with a metallic strip along one edge to combat unwanted glare in the reflector headlamp. So in OEM HID applications D2R is used in reflector-type HID assemblies whereas D2S is used in projector-type assemblies. When you're purchasing an HID kit, you want to go with a D2S bulb because it emits slightly more light than the D2R.

As far as color selection goes, there are two main color temperatures out there: ~4100 kelvin, which is OEM color, and ~6000 kelvin, which is aftermarket color. By the way, the term 'color temperature' does not have any correlation with the property of 'thermal temperature'. I personally do not see any reason for buying anything other than 4100K OEM, but that's me. Some people like blue light and are willing to pay extra money for extra blueness and less brightness---and thus the 6000K market. I'm sure the reason isn't because people like to see everything on the road in bluescale, but because they want their headlights to appear blue to onlookers. The proper way to achieve more blue/violet in your HIDs is to do an OEM projector HID retrofit and upgrade the projector lenses to ECE-spec. For more info on this, refer to the Retrofit Section of the tutorial.

Now in selecting the brand of HID bulbs, you really only have two right choices to make. The safest, most dependable bulb manufacturers to go with are quite simply Philips and Osram-Sylvania. Between the two, I tend to favor Philips as, mano a mano, the Philips are slightly brighter and bluer than Osram. Both are incredibly reliable brands though. All automakers make seemingly simple business decisions on which companies they subcontract their manufacturing to. They ask themselves questions like "Which bulb brand should we use in this car?". A basic question like that leaves millions of dollars hanging in the balance. One minor defect in a sub-par HID bulb could force up to 100,000 bulb recalls per year. So if you follow these successful corporations who pour many hundreds of man-hours worth of scientific research into this stuff, you'll notice that they unanimously select German Philips or Osram-Sylvania bulbs. Even the Japanese cars that use Japanese ballasts and Japanese projectors will still use German bulbs. Philips and Osram bulbs have a lifespan of between 2000-2500 hours (the longest in production). Studies have shown that the average "alternative" Taiwanese and Korean-made bulbs last about 176 hours. This is largely due to massive defects attributed to poor manufacturing technique, workmanship, quality control, and distribution channels. These other smaller companies simply lack the major R&D money needed to develop the optimal chemical mixtures inside the capsules, which serves to preserve the electrode tips and prevent them from eroding prematurely. Automakers using exclusively Philips or Osram or both include: Acura, Audi, BMW, Cadillac, Chrysler, Ferrari, Ford, GM, Honda, Infiniti, Jaguar, Lexus, Lincoln, Mercedes, Nissan, Porsche, Saab, Toyota (2003), VW. No other automaker in the world uses any other name brand.

The following is probably one of the largest and most deceitful marketing ploys exploited on the internet today. So I will state, for the record: Osram-Sylvania's highest color temperature bulb is 5400K and Philips' highest color temperature bulb is 5800K (marketed at 6000K Ultinon). Nowhere on either of their corporate or consumer websites do they claim, endorse, or offer any HID bulb or kit that produces light over 6000K. I subscribe to both companies' online newsletters so in the nearly impossible event that they do make a 7000K or higher bulb, I will be one of the first ones in public to know about it and this page will be editted on that same day. But here is why Osram and Philips will never sell you a 7000, 8000 or 12000K bulb. Osram and Philips control the entire market on OEM bulbs, and they make enough money off selling OEM 4100K bulbs to ride it out indefinitely. So there is no reason whatsoever for either of them to nurture the trendy idea of high Kelvin blue/purple bulbs at the expense of their professional reputations.



MISCONCEPTIONS

There are many companies and private merchants out there that will advertise 7000K, 8000K, and even 12000K HID kits. Most of these vendors lurk around on ebay, online car forums, websites, and ricer accessory shops. 100% of the people that buy these kits do so because they are uninformed, uneducated, or misguided in the field of lighting, and will buy these junk kits thinking three things: that these bulbs are brighter, that these bulbs should cost more money, and/or that they will perform better. All three statements are completely false. Perhaps this misconception and frenzy for purple lights originates from BMW and Audi's infamous Hella projector HIDs.

So allow me to explain the real truth of the matter... Philips is the number one manufacturer of HID bulbs. The Philips OEM D2S bulb is rated at 4100K at 12.8 volts and produces 3200 lumens of light. The Philips Ultinon D2S is 5800K at 12.8 volts and produces 2400 lumens of light. As you can see, with all other factors remaining constant, the brightness of an HID bulb declines the higher up the color index you go. Vision, a Korean bulb manufacturer, makes an 8000K bulb, which they used to advertise on Acura-Forums as 2000 lumens bright. This is barely a marked improvement over halogens, and will produce more glare and eye fatigue than it is beneficial. 4100K has been proven through tireless independent research by the Germans, Japanese, and Americans to be the most functional, truest white and thus the brightest possible color temperature (ceteris paribus).

Every car manufacturer in the world (including BMW and Audi) uses none other than a standard 4100K gas-discharge bulb. No exceptions. The reason being is that 4100K is daylight white in color and produces the same color visible light as direct sunlight. This is least fatiguing functional color on the eyes and produces the most comfortable contrast on the road.

So the million dollar question is now: Why do BMW & Audi lights appear blue when they use a white bulb?

Well, this coloration is the result of the light projectors; the lenses: it's transparency, it's curvature, the tiny grooves etched into it; the projector assembly, the shield, and the reflector bowl. All these components work together to produce a signature of light unique to that particular optic's design. On the Audi and BMW projectors, the lens curvature at the edge bends the white light producing a "prism effect". White light is broken down to it's fundemental colors. Since blue lights is high energy, it is absorbed last and thus travels farther. So with this prism effect, you'll notice that BMW HIDs are only purple and blue from the sides, the top, and the bottom edges, but are always daylight white on the road and in the beam pattern. This phenomenon can be demonstrated when you watch an oncoming BMW hit a pot hole or speed bump in the road and the car's nose pitches up and down. The headlights will flicker and "throw colors off", but returns to a solid white beam pattern directly on the road.

Trying to emulate this color-flickering effect with a solid-state blue or purple bulb is only detrimental to lighting performance, it doesn't fool anyone, but most importantly it endangers other motorists around you. Blue light has what we call a very high diffuse density, which causes it to radiate outwards as opposed to forwards. What results is a wide glow of light outside the beam pattern that is blinding to motorists you share the road with. A blue HID bulb will produce color bleed around the headlight, around the objects it lights up, outside of the beam pattern, and around the cut off line. This is effect is known as "glare", and these illegal and improperly installed HID kits are the reason why HIDs get a bad wrap. As common evidence of glare, observe a traffic light at night in a dimly lit area. There is red light and green light. Red is opposite blue and green is next to blue, thus we can substitute green for blue. If you observe the aura, or glow, of light around a red light and compare it to that of a green light, you'll notice that the green light produces much more glare than red. Blue is even worse. Purple, the worst.

What I'm trying to illustrate here is the glow of blue light (or glare) that radiates off 8000K bulbs. This glow breaks out of the beam pattern and blinds oncoming motorists. Also note how small the actual brightness gain is when you go from factory halogen to 8000K HID. Is it even worth your while?

Blue light also shifts the color hue of everything on the road to blue scale, which fatigues your eyes more than a standard halogen bulb, and it's brightness isn't that much of a marked improvement over a xenon-filled halogen bulb. As evidence of this blue eye fatigue, anyone in the Armed Forces, or anyone who is an astonomer/stargazer, knows to read maps and charts at night using a red light. This is because red light (on the opposite end of the visible light spectrum from blue) doesn't burn into your eyes and affect your night vision like blue light does. As an experiment, momentarily shine a red LED in one of your eyes and a blue LED in the other. Close both eyes and notice how the blue LED burns into your cornea a lot more than the red does. This is because blue light is higher energy and thus causes more strain and wear on the light receptors in your eyes than red light. Kind of like blasting your car stereo at 100db for half an hour straight would fatigue your ears.

Color in light is caused by the absence of other primary colors; therefore a blue bulb is a bulb that lacks red and green hues. This also means that a white light is the presence of all primary colors of light. White light is more intense than any single color by itself. Why do you think those novelty black lights are so dim compared to regular incandescent bulbs? In fact a 5800K bulb is 800 lumens dimmer than a 4100K bulb made by the same manufacturer. It is also useful to know that 6000K is the highest marketed color temperature produced by the top lighting manufacturers in the world. Most bulbs marketed at 6000K are actually producing color slightly lower than 6000K. The reason 6000K is the plateau isn't because they physically can't make an 8000K bulb. It is because anything above 6000K is not effective as a lighting instrument. So don't believe those ebay auctions boasting "Revolutionary 12000K HID bulbs from Germany". That is just BS marketing gimmick at work.

One trick these HID con artists use is to market their HID kit as "German Philips 8000K HID kit". When I inspect these advertisements closely, what they are in fact doing is selling you a real Philips ballast, but some cheesy, generic, unlabelled 8000K HID bulb. But what it sounds like is that you're getting genuine Philips 8000K bulbs. Not the case. Many of these 8000K bulbs aren't really even producing 8000K light internally. I've seen 5000K, 7000K, and 8000K HID bulbs with blue films coated over the bulb, which act to filter out all light produced except blue and purple. This in effect dims your light output substantially.

All of the bulb manufacturers that make bulbs over 6000K are smaller, relatively nameless start-ups. This explains why they are producing a poor selection of bulbs. Philips and Osram control the oligopoly on the HID bulb market, and the only way for these small guys to stay afloat is to appeal to the niche market of rice-boys who want their cars to look unique in any and all ways possible regardless of tact or taste. So they manage to successfully peddle these 8000K bulbs to a smaller group of uninformed buyers knowing that they'll have no chance trying to head-off Philips or Osram in the OEM market.
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Old 04-28-2004, 11:34 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by gfxdave99
HID lighting produces a wider and deeper beam pattern with razor sharp cut off lines and autolevelling motors*
*Only available in factory/OEM installed HID systems excluding Acura
Just curious, do no current Acuras have HID leveling? Or was this referring to the non-projector style lights on previous models?

Nice article though. Thanks for the link.

Kev
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Old 04-28-2004, 12:17 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by gfxdave99
Since people are too lazy to click

HALOGEN

First a background of automotive lighting technology. Before there was HID technology, there was halogen lighting. Halogen is what has been used in automotive lighting for the last 50 years or so and has peaked in its technological advancement. Halogen lighting involves a conventional direct-current direct-circuit setup. The bulb itself houses a filament commonly made of tungsten metal, which is basically a very delicate loose coil of exotic wire. The filament is held up by two chemically-treated, copper-coated steel (or molybdenum) lead wires. On some bulbs, like the 9006/HB4, the glass bulb that encases them is capped at the end with a nickel-plated brass film. The bulb itself is also filled with a noble gas of some sort, which we'll get into later. When electrical current is supplied to the positive lead wire in the halogen bulb, it crosses a path of tungsten wire, which has very high electrical resistance. It is this high resistance that produces heat and ultimately light as a byproduct. This is essentially the same principle of operation as fire: intense heat used to produce light. Halogen low beams will normally operate on 55 watts of power. Fog lights operate at around 35 watts to 55 watts, and high beams at 55 watts to 85 watts. It is a very simple technology fundamentally, but there are flaws in the halogen mostly relating to efficiency of power.




An enhanced picture of a tungsten filament in a halogen bulb


First of all, halogen bulbs produce more heat than they do actual light (incandescence), which translates to an inefficient usage of potential energy. Secondly, as the halogen bulb is used, tungsten atoms begin to evaporate from the filament due to the extreme heat. When the tungsten evaporates, it deposits itself on the relatively cool surface of the glass bulb (this is why dead light bulbs are often black), and the filament becomes thinner and more brittle. Sooner or later the filament will evaporate enough tungsten particles that it snaps in two pieces and breaks the electrical circuit. In simple terms you have a dead light bulb.




A 9006 halogen bulb


Now stepping back to the gas filling as mentioned earlier. Because tungsten evaporates away rather quickly, researchers learned to fill the bulbs with inert gases like argon, krypton, and yes the infamous XENON! The sole purpose of these heavy gases is to create a level of pressure within the bulb that deters tungsten evaporation. Once a tungsten atom leaves the surface of the filament, it is immediately blocked by giant xenon particles that are crowding it and pushing it back towards the surface of the filament. Xenon is most commonly used because it is the heaviest of the inert gases and is also tied to HID lighting; therefore an opportunity for marketing deception arises. The reason why xenon-filled halogen bulbs don't work indefinitely is because tungsten is a smaller atom and still manages to escape the xenon, redepositing itself somewhere else on the filament, which still thins the filament where the atom originally evaporated from. Halogen bulbs can also be broken by a forceful jolt strong enough to fracture the filament, or by overpowering/mispowering bulbs to a degree that flash-boils the tungsten.



HIGH INTENSITY DISCHARGE

HID technology also known as gas discharge is quite different from halogens. HID uses a capsule (bulb) with two adjacent electrodes positioned in close proximity to each other. The capsule sends these two leads to an electronic HID ballast. The ballast is an electronic module that has a circuit board lined with several small high current capacitors, transistors, and resistors. This ballast acts as an ignition box to fire up the gas discharge process, and as a control unit to regulate a steady power flow. The HID capsule is filled with a rich mixture of noble gases as well as alkali earth metal salts. In this setup, the noble gases and metal salts are actually used as part of the lighting processes instead of as a buffer (as with halogens). For quick ignition, the ballast takes in a small amount of input power of 35 watts at 12 volts and inducts a solid-state charge of 25,000 volts to the positive electrode. This creates a very high-powered arc of electricity across the electrodes, which excites xenon gas into discharging photon particles (light). This process is known as the Gas Discharge Principle.

The light is relatively cool burning compared to halogen, consumes much less power, and produces much more light at a much higher color temperature. Halogen lighting in automobiles has become an archaic technology and is steadily being replaced by HID lighting systems in more and more automobiles. They are no longer limited in availability as high-end luxury amenities. Nissan, Toyota, and Ford are already offering factory HIDs in some of their cars.




A normal D2S gas-discharge bulb




DIFFERENCES/BENEFITS

Some of the benefits of HID over halogen are...

Up to three times less wattage is used (HID = 35w, halogen = 55-100w)
Up to four times more bright light produced (HID = 2400-3200lu, halogen = 800-1700lu)
Up to ten times more intense light produced (HID = 202,500cd, halogen = 21,000cd)
Up to six times longer lifespan (HID = 2500hr, halogen = 400hr)
HID light contains less infrared and ultraviolet light, which fatigues the driver and surrounding motorists
HID light illuminates the road with better contrast and more lifelike tones of color
Halogen filaments naturally produce a color of 2300K to 4000K (2300K is yellowish, 4000K is whitish) Anything bluer requires the use of light-dimming color filters
HID produces a natural color of 4100K to 6000K (4100K is daylight white, and 6000K is slightly bluish white) Anything bluer requires the use of light-dimming color filters
HID lighting produces a wider and deeper beam pattern with razor sharp cut off lines and autolevelling motors*
HID has low lumen maintenance, meaning bulbs do not dim down as much towards the end of their lives
HID has high flux properties, meaning light is very evenly distributed when installed properly
*Only available in factory/OEM installed HID systems excluding Acura


BULB SELECTION

HID bulbs come in two common standards today known as: D2S and D2R. D2S uses the D2 base and a clear, naked bulb. D2R uses the same D2 base and a bulb with a metallic strip along one edge to combat unwanted glare in the reflector headlamp. So in OEM HID applications D2R is used in reflector-type HID assemblies whereas D2S is used in projector-type assemblies. When you're purchasing an HID kit, you want to go with a D2S bulb because it emits slightly more light than the D2R.

As far as color selection goes, there are two main color temperatures out there: ~4100 kelvin, which is OEM color, and ~6000 kelvin, which is aftermarket color. By the way, the term 'color temperature' does not have any correlation with the property of 'thermal temperature'. I personally do not see any reason for buying anything other than 4100K OEM, but that's me. Some people like blue light and are willing to pay extra money for extra blueness and less brightness---and thus the 6000K market. I'm sure the reason isn't because people like to see everything on the road in bluescale, but because they want their headlights to appear blue to onlookers. The proper way to achieve more blue/violet in your HIDs is to do an OEM projector HID retrofit and upgrade the projector lenses to ECE-spec. For more info on this, refer to the Retrofit Section of the tutorial.

Now in selecting the brand of HID bulbs, you really only have two right choices to make. The safest, most dependable bulb manufacturers to go with are quite simply Philips and Osram-Sylvania. Between the two, I tend to favor Philips as, mano a mano, the Philips are slightly brighter and bluer than Osram. Both are incredibly reliable brands though. All automakers make seemingly simple business decisions on which companies they subcontract their manufacturing to. They ask themselves questions like "Which bulb brand should we use in this car?". A basic question like that leaves millions of dollars hanging in the balance. One minor defect in a sub-par HID bulb could force up to 100,000 bulb recalls per year. So if you follow these successful corporations who pour many hundreds of man-hours worth of scientific research into this stuff, you'll notice that they unanimously select German Philips or Osram-Sylvania bulbs. Even the Japanese cars that use Japanese ballasts and Japanese projectors will still use German bulbs. Philips and Osram bulbs have a lifespan of between 2000-2500 hours (the longest in production). Studies have shown that the average "alternative" Taiwanese and Korean-made bulbs last about 176 hours. This is largely due to massive defects attributed to poor manufacturing technique, workmanship, quality control, and distribution channels. These other smaller companies simply lack the major R&D money needed to develop the optimal chemical mixtures inside the capsules, which serves to preserve the electrode tips and prevent them from eroding prematurely. Automakers using exclusively Philips or Osram or both include: Acura, Audi, BMW, Cadillac, Chrysler, Ferrari, Ford, GM, Honda, Infiniti, Jaguar, Lexus, Lincoln, Mercedes, Nissan, Porsche, Saab, Toyota (2003), VW. No other automaker in the world uses any other name brand.

The following is probably one of the largest and most deceitful marketing ploys exploited on the internet today. So I will state, for the record: Osram-Sylvania's highest color temperature bulb is 5400K and Philips' highest color temperature bulb is 5800K (marketed at 6000K Ultinon). Nowhere on either of their corporate or consumer websites do they claim, endorse, or offer any HID bulb or kit that produces light over 6000K. I subscribe to both companies' online newsletters so in the nearly impossible event that they do make a 7000K or higher bulb, I will be one of the first ones in public to know about it and this page will be editted on that same day. But here is why Osram and Philips will never sell you a 7000, 8000 or 12000K bulb. Osram and Philips control the entire market on OEM bulbs, and they make enough money off selling OEM 4100K bulbs to ride it out indefinitely. So there is no reason whatsoever for either of them to nurture the trendy idea of high Kelvin blue/purple bulbs at the expense of their professional reputations.



MISCONCEPTIONS

There are many companies and private merchants out there that will advertise 7000K, 8000K, and even 12000K HID kits. Most of these vendors lurk around on ebay, online car forums, websites, and ricer accessory shops. 100% of the people that buy these kits do so because they are uninformed, uneducated, or misguided in the field of lighting, and will buy these junk kits thinking three things: that these bulbs are brighter, that these bulbs should cost more money, and/or that they will perform better. All three statements are completely false. Perhaps this misconception and frenzy for purple lights originates from BMW and Audi's infamous Hella projector HIDs.

So allow me to explain the real truth of the matter... Philips is the number one manufacturer of HID bulbs. The Philips OEM D2S bulb is rated at 4100K at 12.8 volts and produces 3200 lumens of light. The Philips Ultinon D2S is 5800K at 12.8 volts and produces 2400 lumens of light. As you can see, with all other factors remaining constant, the brightness of an HID bulb declines the higher up the color index you go. Vision, a Korean bulb manufacturer, makes an 8000K bulb, which they used to advertise on Acura-Forums as 2000 lumens bright. This is barely a marked improvement over halogens, and will produce more glare and eye fatigue than it is beneficial. 4100K has been proven through tireless independent research by the Germans, Japanese, and Americans to be the most functional, truest white and thus the brightest possible color temperature (ceteris paribus).

Every car manufacturer in the world (including BMW and Audi) uses none other than a standard 4100K gas-discharge bulb. No exceptions. The reason being is that 4100K is daylight white in color and produces the same color visible light as direct sunlight. This is least fatiguing functional color on the eyes and produces the most comfortable contrast on the road.

So the million dollar question is now: Why do BMW & Audi lights appear blue when they use a white bulb?

Well, this coloration is the result of the light projectors; the lenses: it's transparency, it's curvature, the tiny grooves etched into it; the projector assembly, the shield, and the reflector bowl. All these components work together to produce a signature of light unique to that particular optic's design. On the Audi and BMW projectors, the lens curvature at the edge bends the white light producing a "prism effect". White light is broken down to it's fundemental colors. Since blue lights is high energy, it is absorbed last and thus travels farther. So with this prism effect, you'll notice that BMW HIDs are only purple and blue from the sides, the top, and the bottom edges, but are always daylight white on the road and in the beam pattern. This phenomenon can be demonstrated when you watch an oncoming BMW hit a pot hole or speed bump in the road and the car's nose pitches up and down. The headlights will flicker and "throw colors off", but returns to a solid white beam pattern directly on the road.

Trying to emulate this color-flickering effect with a solid-state blue or purple bulb is only detrimental to lighting performance, it doesn't fool anyone, but most importantly it endangers other motorists around you. Blue light has what we call a very high diffuse density, which causes it to radiate outwards as opposed to forwards. What results is a wide glow of light outside the beam pattern that is blinding to motorists you share the road with. A blue HID bulb will produce color bleed around the headlight, around the objects it lights up, outside of the beam pattern, and around the cut off line. This is effect is known as "glare", and these illegal and improperly installed HID kits are the reason why HIDs get a bad wrap. As common evidence of glare, observe a traffic light at night in a dimly lit area. There is red light and green light. Red is opposite blue and green is next to blue, thus we can substitute green for blue. If you observe the aura, or glow, of light around a red light and compare it to that of a green light, you'll notice that the green light produces much more glare than red. Blue is even worse. Purple, the worst.

What I'm trying to illustrate here is the glow of blue light (or glare) that radiates off 8000K bulbs. This glow breaks out of the beam pattern and blinds oncoming motorists. Also note how small the actual brightness gain is when you go from factory halogen to 8000K HID. Is it even worth your while?

Blue light also shifts the color hue of everything on the road to blue scale, which fatigues your eyes more than a standard halogen bulb, and it's brightness isn't that much of a marked improvement over a xenon-filled halogen bulb. As evidence of this blue eye fatigue, anyone in the Armed Forces, or anyone who is an astonomer/stargazer, knows to read maps and charts at night using a red light. This is because red light (on the opposite end of the visible light spectrum from blue) doesn't burn into your eyes and affect your night vision like blue light does. As an experiment, momentarily shine a red LED in one of your eyes and a blue LED in the other. Close both eyes and notice how the blue LED burns into your cornea a lot more than the red does. This is because blue light is higher energy and thus causes more strain and wear on the light receptors in your eyes than red light. Kind of like blasting your car stereo at 100db for half an hour straight would fatigue your ears.

Color in light is caused by the absence of other primary colors; therefore a blue bulb is a bulb that lacks red and green hues. This also means that a white light is the presence of all primary colors of light. White light is more intense than any single color by itself. Why do you think those novelty black lights are so dim compared to regular incandescent bulbs? In fact a 5800K bulb is 800 lumens dimmer than a 4100K bulb made by the same manufacturer. It is also useful to know that 6000K is the highest marketed color temperature produced by the top lighting manufacturers in the world. Most bulbs marketed at 6000K are actually producing color slightly lower than 6000K. The reason 6000K is the plateau isn't because they physically can't make an 8000K bulb. It is because anything above 6000K is not effective as a lighting instrument. So don't believe those ebay auctions boasting "Revolutionary 12000K HID bulbs from Germany". That is just BS marketing gimmick at work.

One trick these HID con artists use is to market their HID kit as "German Philips 8000K HID kit". When I inspect these advertisements closely, what they are in fact doing is selling you a real Philips ballast, but some cheesy, generic, unlabelled 8000K HID bulb. But what it sounds like is that you're getting genuine Philips 8000K bulbs. Not the case. Many of these 8000K bulbs aren't really even producing 8000K light internally. I've seen 5000K, 7000K, and 8000K HID bulbs with blue films coated over the bulb, which act to filter out all light produced except blue and purple. This in effect dims your light output substantially.

All of the bulb manufacturers that make bulbs over 6000K are smaller, relatively nameless start-ups. This explains why they are producing a poor selection of bulbs. Philips and Osram control the oligopoly on the HID bulb market, and the only way for these small guys to stay afloat is to appeal to the niche market of rice-boys who want their cars to look unique in any and all ways possible regardless of tact or taste. So they manage to successfully peddle these 8000K bulbs to a smaller group of uninformed buyers knowing that they'll have no chance trying to head-off Philips or Osram in the OEM market.


Damn, I'm too lazy to scroll.
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Old 04-28-2004, 12:36 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by gfxdave99
http://www.intellexual.net/hid.html

read that
Did you all see a Lexus in Japanese soil in the pictures section? Some of you might know what I'm talking about . . .
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Old 09-06-2006, 6:46 AM   #15
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Boys:

I drive an M3 in the summer and I know what the lights are about. (My 06/TSX is my winter car), before that I had an Audi S4. Both of those cars had the Xenon self leveling lights. I think the one article explains things the best. It is all about the lenses in front of the bulb. Does anyone remember the album by Pink Floyd? Its the album with the pyramid on it with white light going through it and coming out as a rainbow. This is basic physics and light prism result.

The short of the story is if you want the look you will pay. I think a good $850.00. We looked into it for our F150 King Ranch and decided it was not worth it.

See you
M3 babe
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Old 09-06-2006, 7:05 AM   #16
She said: it's GINORMOUS!
 
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holy thread resurrection!

caroline, that pink floyd album is called the dark side of the moon. so where are the pics of the two beauties?
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Old 09-06-2006, 7:16 AM   #17
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holy thread resurrection!

caroline, that pink floyd album is called the dark side of the moon. so where are the pics of the two beauties?
Her and her TSX?
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Old 09-06-2006, 7:20 AM   #18
She said: it's GINORMOUS!
 
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Originally Posted by LoveMyTSX
Her and her TSX?
the TSX and the M3 (hopefully, an E46 - the only bangle design i'll ever love)
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Old 09-06-2006, 12:01 PM   #19
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Unhappy My car

Thanks for the FYI on the album. Great album I have it and seen the band in concert. I was not sure if anyone else would know that. I do not have a picture of the TSX, but I will take a few tonight and post. For now here is the M3 E46 2003 with 15k. Black with Cinniamon interior. Needless to say it also has many upgrades.

Hey how do I attach a picture?????
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Old 09-06-2006, 2:20 PM   #20
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ooooooh pictures.....
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Old 09-06-2006, 2:22 PM   #21
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it is normal.
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Old 09-06-2006, 9:21 PM   #22
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I take it one can't post a picture correct? Can anyone help a girl?
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Old 09-06-2006, 9:24 PM   #23
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how to post pics : http://tsx.acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24736
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Old 09-07-2006, 2:13 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tc86
yeah, i see colors changing all the time as well on HIDs...just tonight, i saw an S2000 coming over a hill, and the colors were changing. I personally like how that happens.

the S2000 HIDs are crazy bright like the TSXs. and driving in front of one is pretty cool, i like how the colors change as the car bounces on the road. that's HID for ya. i occassionally get flashed by oncoming drivers.......guess my lights are too bright.....
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Old 09-07-2006, 2:25 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Creaminz
Is our light tooooooo bright? People always complain!!!
Anybody knows how to adjust them?

don't adjust them cuz people complain... just be glad that your headlights are really bright, and other are not fortunate enough to have HID's, lol. Sometimes, the only reason i think that the TSX looks so damn sexy is because of its HID lights, because if it didn't, this car would look just like any other normal car.
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Old 09-07-2006, 3:21 AM   #26
mmmmmm....
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NeoChaser
this is because s2k, and ours and audi's and many others who
have projector headlights... at diff angles, the light will have
diff colours, like an rainbow...

headlights like last gen TL which have hid's but won't change colour
Its because of the projectors. The old TL didnt use projectors..thats why it only stays in one color and its not as bright as projectors.
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Old 09-07-2006, 3:31 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acura_ak
the S2000 HIDs are crazy bright like the TSXs. and driving in front of one is pretty cool, i like how the colors change as the car bounces on the road. that's HID for ya. i occassionally get flashed by oncoming drivers.......guess my lights are too bright.....
have you ever got into a car accident? If you havent gone any accident or didnt touched your headlights then you are fine. I get that sometimes by people thinking that, I have my high beams on. You just have to flash back to them so that you aren't using your high beams.
In case if you need to adjust the headlights....here is the links to it.
http://tsx.acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21758
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Old 09-08-2006, 1:18 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S14 n Tsx
have you ever got into a car accident? If you havent gone any accident or didnt touched your headlights then you are fine. I get that sometimes by people thinking that, I have my high beams on. You just have to flash back to them so that you aren't using your high beams.
In case if you need to adjust the headlights....here is the links to it.
http://tsx.acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21758

i never got into any accidents. i actually just got this car from the dealership not too long ago. i should flash them back to let them know those are my low beams. i'm just guessing they are not too familiar with HIDs and don't know that they are supposed to be this bright.
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Old 11-16-2007, 12:36 PM   #29
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2007 Tsx Hid

I just upgraded from a 2004 TSX to the 2007 model year with Navi. I noticed that the HID on the 2007 model is not as bright as the 2004 one. When I drove it home from the dealer last night, I thought one side of the light was out because in comparison to my old one, it is so dimmed. I used to be able to see the two side of the road as bright as the road in front but this new one only shines in front.. the two side of the road were dark! Did anyone have this problem? Is this normal for the newer model due to the lighting projector shade or is it something to do with the car? Thnx.


Quote:
Originally Posted by acura_ak
i never got into any accidents. i actually just got this car from the dealership not too long ago. i should flash them back to let them know those are my low beams. i'm just guessing they are not too familiar with HIDs and don't know that they are supposed to be this bright.
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Old 09-14-2010, 4:33 PM   #30
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Help needed for HiD bulb change

I'm hoping someone can help me here. I have an 05 tsx and when I turned my headlights on the other night, one flickered and now is no longer bright and turning purple. Obviously it's burning out. I have to replace both headlights right? And what should I get for a bulb?? Acura is asking 200... OEM website has them for 150....Can I get them any cheaper anywhere???
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Old 09-14-2010, 5:36 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by brocktonbeth View Post
I'm hoping someone can help me here. I have an 05 tsx and when I turned my headlights on the other night, one flickered and now is no longer bright and turning purple. Obviously it's burning out. I have to replace both headlights right? And what should I get for a bulb?? Acura is asking 200... OEM website has them for 150....Can I get them any cheaper anywhere???
Yes, replace both at the same time. Xenon bulbs do last longer then Halogen, but of course overtime the Lumens diminish. You can pick up Kaixen OEM repalcements for $100/pair from our forum sponsor Excelerate. If you want the light intensity and color of OEM, get OEM bulbs.
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Old 09-16-2010, 2:22 PM   #32
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okay! Here is a question...Which one would you replace in your Acura????
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Old 09-16-2010, 8:19 PM   #33
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okay! Here is a question...Which one would you replace in your Acura????
I replaced them with Kaixen 5000K. It has a bluer color then stock.

I did run a new OEM Xenon bulb in one headlight and a Kaixen 5000K bulb in the other headlight just to see what the difference was. The OEM 4300K bulb was brighter.
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Old 09-29-2010, 6:19 AM   #34
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Thank you. I talked to a kid that I know that works for auto zone and he said usually it isn't the bulbs but the balice. He said it could be my balice due to the fact that the light problem started when the light began to flicker and dim down to purplish rather than bright white. The light eventually began to turn on and once the HID heated up it would shut off. Now the light doesn't turn on as far as I know, maybe after the car has been sitting all night sometimes it does. It seems like whatever the issue is, it is getting worse. Do the lights burn out in these cars or do the balice tend to more? I just don't want to buy bulbs and not need them and not be able to return them when the problem is the balice. Help.
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Old 09-29-2010, 11:19 AM   #35
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A Ballast is about $180 online, otherwise known as the Control Unit Assay.

What you can try is run the problematic bulb on the other side, turn it on and see if the light / color output is normal. If so, then it's likely the ballast. If not, then it's the bulb.
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Old 09-29-2010, 11:19 AM
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