MisterZDX

Yes the TLX is a sales winner, but with most 4G TL owners (after test driving the TLX), feeling like it is a step down compared to the 4G (size, and build quality wise), is it possible that Acura intended for the TLX to be more of an upgrade for TSX owners and hoped 4G TL owners would move up to the RLX or RLX Sport Hybrid. Seems reasonable given the roomy interior of the RLX which is comparable to the 4G TL. And used 2014 RLX prices are damn near a steal at this point which makes a new TLX even less desirable for some former 4G owners. Also, did any TLX owners here on this forum cross shop used RLXs?

Momyc

MisterZdx , as 4G owner , I think in general you nail it.. but still for me the RLX is more luxury than sport and I'm not quite interested.

Tony Pac

Good point!!!

I have to admit it but RLX is always considered premium luxury vehicle.

Stew4HD

I disagree, I find the TLX to be an upgrade of the TL, having owned a 3G and 4G.

So many of these kinds of threads end up being a flame war. IMO, it's subjective

Tony Pac

Upgrade in which sense? More tech?

Don't get me wrong, I love TLX and I believe it's one the best cars in the market. I don't think there is a major upgrade from TL (4G) in terms of engine, performance, HP, tires, comfort. I don't have one, so I might be wrong, this is my opinion. You have a TLX, you can give us your opinion and it's more valuable.

mapleloaf

Although I am a former TSX rather than a TL owner, I would disagree with your assertion that most 4th Gen TL owners find the TLX to be a step down. There is plenty of evidence on this forum that many find it a step up. On a personal note, I have driven the TL previously as a loaner and just this week went for a test drive with a colleague that is considering a 2012 TL. Certainly a good car, but there are numerous refinements that the TLX has that, in my opinion, make it a superior car. Of course you must compare the TL only to the V6 TLX, and to the comparable trim level. The only discernible advantage, in my opinion, would be the 3.7 TL engine power, but that is minimal and comes with a significant loss of fuel economy.

At the end of the day, it depends upon those features you value most, but for me, as someone who appreciates refined styling, handling, fuel economy, a smooth and quiet ride, and tech features, the TLX is an upgrade.

Tony Pac

mapleloaf - well said. It comes down to personal choice and preference. That's it!

Stew4HD

It's not a major upgrade over the 4G but is over the 3G.

The Tech, the interior look and feel, yes, road noise YES. Trunk room.

HP is not much difference to me since I don't race the car and both are more than adequate.

The TLX needs some tweaks though. The 4G I have was an SH-AWD Advance, like my TLX. I truly dislike the idle stop and the quirks that goes with it, The 4G didn't have that silly (to me) feature so it wins on that part.

I find the TLX to have a smoother ride, both had good road feel.

The 4G is a great car, don't get me wrong. I was an idiot to get rid of it when I did. But, I do see the TLX as an overall upgrade.

As always, it's just an opinion

a35tl

I currently own a 4G TL but will be upgrading to a TLX at some point in the future. The better ride quality, updated styling, noise improvement, better fuel economy and newer tech and safety features alone qualify as enough of an upgrade for me. I have a FWD TL so the TLX engine would also be an upgrade of 10hp to me. While I like the RLX okay, I don't think of myself in the RLX demographic. I see that vehicle marketed more towards people over 50.


I don't think Acura's intention was necessarily to move TL drivers towards the RLX but if it were, I don't think they were very successful. I could see myself driving an RLX one day but in my mind at least, I see it catering to older drivers than me at this point. I do like the RLX Sport Hybrid though and wouldn't mind owning one but it's almost twice the price of a TLX.

Tony Pac

Your points are valid. I heard one upgrade that most of buyers love it is the smooth ride and reduced road noise.

Tech is a normal upgrade for every car from one year to another. If we pay attention carefully, now Toyota Corolla offers most of the technologies that luxury cars offer. So this is part of the game. But 3G to TLX, there is a huge upgrade. No doubt.

Still, i believe TLX is a really good car.

weather

I am one who don't want to get into a flame war with people on the forum about whether the TLX is an upgraded TL or TSX. I think Acura was trying to simplify things but created more confusion than anything.

In a way, I wish they would have kept the TSX name and made the 3G TSX the body style of the ILX....The ILX is about the size of the 1G TSX anyway.

For me, the TLX V6 SH-AWD is a similar car to the TL V6 SH-AWD. Is it an upgrade? In some ways it is, and in some ways it is not. That being said, it is not uncommon in the auto industry to see subsequent generation seeing some aspect being not as good as the previous generation, and this is also subjective.

Let me explain:

Power - Its a wash - The change is not enough to be people upset. When the 2G TSX came out, the power hadn't gone up either so a power bump is not necessary.

SH-AWD - The system has been upgraded, is lighter so this is a slight improvement

Road Noise - The TLX is a clear winner there

Styling - Subjective but in my eyes, an upgrade for the tLX

ELS - pretty much the same

Technology - An improvement for the TLX

Fuel efficiency - An improvement for the TLX

Seats - In my opinion, I think some cost cutting went into the TLX

Throttle response - The TL wins in my test drive

Transmission - Once the software is sorted out, the TLX wins

Tires - Lower quality in the TLX in my opinion

Inside material - Depending on the TL trim you compare, the TLX is better or worse.

So for me, overall, I still think the TLX is a step in teh right direction and is a good evolution for TL owners but it is not better than the TL is all aspect, but when you look at the + over the -, the + outweighs the -.

Acura really needs to solve its transmission programing though...but again, this is how I see it and will not expect people to agree with me.

MisterZDX

Thanks everyone for your honest and intellectual opinions without disrespecting the opinion of others.

SilverJ

I consider the TLX a downgrade to the 4G TL- AWD. I cross shopped them and just felt the TLX was very TSX/Accord like in its overall interior feel and drive.
I hated the lack of shifter, hated the flat-ish seats(which feel like the RDX to me), hated the multiple clicks to get to different functions on the touch screens and overall the car felt more entry level luxury to me more than anything else.
I drove the V6 TLX back to back with a 4G AWD.
Its too bad to be honest because I do prefer the exterior looks of the 5G to the 4G(although I still feel the MMC 4G is nice looking as well) but I just came away from the 5G as "meh".
Once I drove the manual version of the 4G, game over. I had to have it. I see the appeal of the 5G for sure and I think it comes down to whats important to you.
I know gas mileage and exterior appearance are huge for a lot of people and the 5G has a huge edge on the former and a modest edge in the latter(IMO). If a type S manual were to ever make its way to production I may give it a second look way down the road.

iutodd

This is the most important thing to consider here. Acura saw the SHAWD TL as, basically, a Type-S analogue for the 4th generation TL (and there were any number of mechanical differences between the models). People that drive the SHAWD TL (especially 6MT owners) are comparing apples to oranges when talking about how the TLX compares - and I think most people understand that...comparing a manual car to an automatic is kind of silly anyway IMO. The current SHAWD TLX isn't a Type-S...it's just an AWD version of the FWD V6 model.

Acura absolutely wants TL owners to get into a TLX. As mentioned by a32tl there are any number of advantages to the TLX over the 4th gen FWD TL that would make it an attractive option for current TL owners of any generation.

weather

If that is truly the case, they better hurry offer to offer something former TL owners want, including enthusiasts or they will lose part of the market. I am fully aware that enthusiasts make up a small portion of their sales but they can't offer to lose any, and so far, they have lost me.

I have been with Acura since 2007 and have had 5 Acura vehicles since, which I know is not a lot but still. I am about 1.5 months away from switching brand and once that happens, they MAY never get another sale from me.

That is not to say that Acura vehicles are bad products or the TLX is inferior, but in developing their new business model, they have lost what attracted me to them....something good looking, fun to drive, reliable and elegant (with decent looking wheels), all at a reasonable price. Some of these features I have listed seem to have been diluted recently.

jeich182

I am a former TSX owner and everytime I got a 4G TL as a loaner I always felt the interior was cheaper with more hard plastics and more textures mixed together. As far as I'm concerned the TLX is an upgrade to the 4G TL in that department. Interior was always one of the areas TSX was noted for being great (materials and build).

Colin

Indeed, I've had 4 clients move from a 4G TL into a TLX I4 Tech! It was enough of an improvement in the things that mattered to them that it's a nice upgrade ant they are all very happy! To each his own.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

This. The TLX IMHO is not a step down from the 4G.

9SpeedTran

For me, coming from the 3G TL Type S, the V6 SH-AWD Tech is a huge upgrade. It is more luxurious and so much quieter, and more comfortable -- the seats may be flatter, but they suspend you in a much more comfortable way -- and handles even better, corners betters, and feels much more planted especially at high speeds. Both my wife and I love this car. And the additional safety features are great as well. Totally delighted with it.

Quandry

I am constantly amazed by the posters with their violent hate expressions about the car. Don't like it, fine just post and move on. Maybe that is an just expression of life itself. Best advise for anyone researching the car is to test drive it and then decide.

CheeseyPoofs McNut

In my opinion - many enthusiasts (not just for cars - I'm a photographer and people in the camera forums act the same way!) secretly feel their opinion somehow means more because they see themselves as experts. The Internet makes it easy to do so they do it!

holografique

Interesting, I bought mine at age 39...

the RLX for me was a great step up from my 3G TL, and while it is a bigger car, it can still perform in a very sporty manner, and I don't even have the Sport Hybrid.

I think the RLX is more in line with the 35+ and up demographic that is either making a financial move up, or already there. Same demographic the A6, 5-series, GS, and E-series is marketed to. The problem is the RLX doesn't have enough sex appeal to it like it's competitors to create enough cross-shopping, and it's been plagued with issues, and a severe lack of marketing and product awareness. So at this point it's customer base has been largely relegated to either the existing RL owners, or loyal Acura customers who were interested in making a move up (like me). The RLX has been the only option to move up since 2013 without leaving the brand.

MisterZDX

Very well said Sir. The RLX (mainly the interior) exudes grown (35+) and sexy which would explain my fascination with it. I purchased my ZDX 2 years ago when I was 31 and I could very well see myself in an RLX by the time I turn 35 and drive it well into my upper 40's. As much as I love the exterior styling and rareness of my Z, the tech feels so 2009 and I am ready for a change (even considering a downgrade to an Accord Touring).

Dear Acura...please make the RLX exterior sexier during the mid cycle refresh or at least create an all new flagship by 2017. There is still interest.

Rocket_man

'Most' is not in evidence here. There are some very vocal 4G TL owners that really like their cars and anything that is not a 4G TL is just not a comparison. I'm not a 4G TL owner but I've compared the two and I'd pic the TLX over the TL every time.

Not a chance... Acura never planned to build the RLX in TL quantities. It was always going to be a niche car, especially the Sport Hybrid. Yes used RLX prices have dropped, but they were offered at a discount even when new. It was just over priced at MSRP. But it is a nice car and now a bargain. But considering there are many thousands of 4G TL owners, and probably not many used RLX cars, you'd think if your premise was right and 4G TL owners were supposed to be drawn into the RLX, that a used RLX would be in demand and the prices would be higher. The demand just isn't there, that is why the price is a bargain. I suspect when most 4G TL owners decide to buy a new car, if they stay with Acura they will buy the TLX. Of course all luxuary makes hope their clients move up the lineup as their income goes up, but most people probably stop moving up before they get to the 'flagship'car.

Lastly, the TLX was meant to combine the TSX and TL markets because that is basically what Acura said...

"....Now … when the production version of this TLX Prototype comes to market in the middle of this year … we accomplish something else for the Acura brand … a very clear hierarchy of luxury performance sedans … stretching from the ILX at the gateway … to our flagship model, now topped off by the RLX Sport Hybrid...."

So the ILX is the entry level car which overlapped the TSX and TL on the sales floor. The TSX and TL stopped production when the TLX started production... and the RLX clearly replaced the RL as the new flagship. The TL was never referred to as Acura's flagship.

mapleloaf

I understand your point, but I would disagree with the "violent hate" characterization of most of these contrary opinions. I actually find this discussion quite civil and interesting, and a further confirmation that because a car is not a life and death matter, we should always be able to civilly agree to disagree. That being said, I love my TLX! Not like i love my family or friends or dog, but more like I love a really great meal…..okay…actually a lot more than a meal

neuronbob

I'm one of those weirdos who actually cross shopped the RLX and TLX. Regulars know I'm a former 2G and 3G TL owner (and in the case of the 3G TL, a beta tester/first year owner). I'm also not old. I bought my 2G RL at age 38, and I'm 46 now.

As you can tell by my sig, I preferred to be a beta tester again, I mean, Sport Hybrid owner. I really like the TLX, but at the end of the day, I wanted the bigger rear seat, wanted the rear seat heater for my son (thus Advance trim), and most of all wanted the eSH-AWD (it is AWESOME, really it is!) and the powah. As far as more sporting drive, I've got two sports cars so the RLX allows me a little relaxation when I need it.

Nice thread and great conversation.

Rocketsfan

I hated the RLX when it came out, but saw it in person and really started liking it. With the discounts that were initially offered on it due to poor sales, I really considered getting one. The only thing that stopped me from getting one is because the car is just too big for me. The TLX is a perfect size to me... the interior is a perfect size to me... and this is something I never got used to in the 4G. I never really completely fell in love with the 4G TL's looks even after the facelift, but could look past that because it eventually became "not so bad looking". I actually liked the interior (MOAR BUTTONS!), but I could never get comfortable in the car for some reason. My head always seemed like it was getting pushed forward in the '09 TL... not sure if they fixed that later -- can't remember. I also felt like I was in a bucket or a cave while driving the thing. It always seemed way bigger than it probably was. I don't get that feeling with the TLX. I also enjoy the ride more in the TLX. I really don't care to race the car, so I don't care about a few tenths of a second this way or that, to be honest. I'm still enjoying my TLX now having driven it since August. The only negative I have about the car, well, the one that irks me the most, anyway, is the harder first couple of gear shifts and probably the bouncing it can do when I put it in park without using the parking brake first.

Fibonacci

I agree, the TLX is an upgrade, but not a leap, just a nice evolution.

If I could wave a magic wand and grab the steering rack from my 1G TSX and the 6MT from my 4G TL and transplant them into my TLX SH-AWD, I'd be a very happy camper.

TacoBello

Awesome read thus far!

beach109

The same for us. Many 4G TL customers trading for the 2.4L TLX, even a previous RL owner or two. The V6 TLX with 34-mpg and power galore is not being as well recognized, but that's partially because the 2.4L TLX is so desirable.

I've had TSX's and TL's over 4 years now as daily drivers, and the TLX is so massively further refined, it feels words different of a vehicle, interior layout, comfort and usefulness included. I've said it many times, and the TL may feel faster because it's louder, but the TLX is bizarrely silent and refined in comparison then you accelerate or corner and feel the claws. Been a fantastic upgrade.

Colin

I suspect that its also due to the fact that a TSX and TL Tech packages were not equal. Different tech, ride quality etc. made for a very different experience. I think what we're seeing is that many people went with TL Tech for reasons other than power.

TeamAcura

Guess I'll chime in since I'm currently in an i4 tech loaner. I'm a tech guy and I do it for a living and I love the tech in the 5G. That's the most appealing thing to me. IDS is cool and the brake hold feature comes in handy at stop and go traffic. Nice upgrades. The cabin noise is definitely quieter and a very solid ride. No disappointments there. I'm confused with the material selection for the interior because there are places where they pay special attention to like the aluminum accents around the controls but some where they cut corners a bit. I love the illuminated handles inside. But I'm not fond of the foam padding that is abundant everywhere. The dual stacked screens I had to get used to but I think it's okay. I wish the navigation would have included 3D imagery though. To be honest though, as a 4G owner it is not enough for me to trade up to a 5G. I'd wait for a "performance model or will skip this generation and wait for the next one. Kind of like what a lot of 3G owners are doing. I think current 4G owners feel the same way.

CheeseyPoofs McNut

I think the 3G/4G owners who have a problem with the 5G are the ones who wanted a performance upgrade and that's not what the 5G is all about. Marketing blitz aside - it's pretty clear they went more for a luxury feel (quiet cabin and nice ride) than a sport feel with this car.

So yes - the 3G/4G owners who were hoping for a 390 HP sedan are not happy. I suspect they're a vocal minority and not the vast majority.

RCJD

^^^
Agree on what he said.

Colin

Not sure what this is referring to?

Stew4HD

Some people just prefer hard plastic or metal to the soft leather looking material they are using on the dash and upper doors (assuming that is what he is referring to calling it foam).

TeamAcura

they could of added some leatherette on parts of the dash and door panels to make it look more appealing.

Anyway, I got the 4G back yesterday and immediately noticed a difference in cabin noise in favor of the 5G. But also noticed a difference in driver feedback in favor of the 4G. I prefer the bucket seats and the initial bite on the brakes are better imo. Engine and throttle response is more "mechanical" for lack of better words. But I also have a 6MT and a smooth revving V6 which makes all the difference. The 5G is definitely more refined though. 4G with SH-AWD is more of a driver's car for sure imho.

Stew4HD

I do miss my old 4G SH-AWD, especially with the problem I am having with the TLX SH-AWD shifting/Idle Stop.

C8N

While many things are subjective, but performance wise, the TLX is a step down. While acceleration is debatable as everyone seems to have different 0-60 times, one thing that is certain is that the 4G in stock form corners and stops better.

CybrRdr

TLX is a "Tweener"... it just feels like it is somewhere in between.