oo7spy

My first 7.5 years of driving were in a FWD with no stability assist (traction control, etc.). The FWD pulled me through most low traction situations. The SH-AWD in the RL was my first taste of a loose rear-end, :nohomo:, but that only happened when I pushed the car on purpose. I still never turned off VSA for full hooning enjoyment. When I totalled the RL, I bought a 2005 Tundra V8 (2 MYs before traction control was standard). That was the start of having to learn keeping my rear wheels behind me. I currently have my mom's 2003 350Z Touring in my garage as it is in limbo waiting to be sold. I take it out occasionally and take my opportunities to hoon when they come. Pulling out of a parking lot onto an empty 3 lane feeder road in the rain yesterday, I tried to push the rear end around like my truck would do without hesitation. The reaction of the rear diff and VSA was awful. It sounded awful, it felt awful, and I couldn't get past 15 degrees maybe. Pulling up to a stop light, I turned off VSA, but traffic was around me and I didn't get another chance to push it around.

That got me to thinking. I daily drive a RWD with no traction control that will slip out during a downshift on a wet road. If I drove a modern RWD sports car, how often would I turn off VSA?

So, how often do you disable traction control in your car?

oo7spy

Damn, I just realized I should have included a "I don't have traction control" option. If another mod can help me out, I would appreciate it.


Also, please note that I am not condoning unsafe driving in any conditions much less on public roads. Please do not consider turning off your VSA unless you are fully aware of the consequences and how to deal with them.

JS + XES

iTrader: (1)

For my daily driving and very hard canyon runs, I always put the sport VSC which lets me drive very spiritedly, and the VSC kicks in when the slip angle reaches certain angle. It's actually pretty good since it corrects my driving line whether it's understeering or oversteering.

For track, there's a special mode for my car where it disables everything except ABS.

I believe there's absolutely no reason to turn off the nannies completely on a public road. Not that I don't know the limit of my car nor believe in my driving skills.

fsttyms1

I personally dont like it. I have played with it (VSA) countless times (different vehicles) at higher (hwy) speeds just to see how effective it is and havent found a system i was impressed with, and most never actually would have straightened the car or kept me out of a bad situation. I found most systems are intrusive and intervene poorly or too abruptly not allowing for any slip angle if you are trying to push it a little. TCS i tend to turn off as well (i have gone as far as to rewire the system in 3 of my cars now so that it defaults to off when the car is started. The best systems/situations where i would find them usefull are those that are all speed tcs and not just low speed (like the pos system in the 2nd gen tl) and most useful in cold/slippery conditions at hwy speed

NSXNEXT

iTrader: (2)

In the words of Seargant Schultz...
"I hear nothing...I see nothing"

http://genesisowners.com/hyundai-genesis-forum/showthread.php?t=14706

oo7spy

It sounds like you have the luxury of points in the middle. I don't even have the option for 95% of my driving now. The 350Z received high praise at the time of its release for being able to keep traction, but the system leaves a lot to be desired.

TLove It!

iTrader: (1)

^^Hogan's Hero's?^^

As far as the VSA poll. My thought is, in a RWD car I'd never use it. From the first car I drove until a few years ago, they were all RWD vehicles. I can't see using it and getting used to it or even becoming dependent on VSA in a RWD car.
Front Wheel Drive is a different story. (again, just my opinion). I drive a Front WD SUV for work and the VSA (stability system) has actually proven very useful in the snow when the back end gets a little loose.

Will Y.

There's no reason for me to turn off the TCS or VSA on public roads, especially since I drive nose-heavy FWD vehicles.
If I'm driving hard enough that VSA or TCS would activate on a public road, I'm probably being a dangerous menace to everyone else using the road.

I do autocross runs with the VSA off in the TL, though.

M.I.N.O.

iTrader: (1)

Disabled it once on my 2004 TL to get out of a snow bank.

RPhilMan1

I disable it every time I start the car.

That does depend on the weather, though. I'll leave it on in heavy rain/thunderstorm, and in the winter with snow or when the roads are slippery.

With the amount of power going down to the front wheels, it really helps to have it off when doing quick acceleration.

I did it in the TSX back in the day as well. That was probably more placebo then, thinking throttle response was better.

SamDoe1

My car doesn't have VSA or any form of TCS other than the water bag sitting in front of the steering wheel.

I leave the TCS on in the Yukon because, lets face it, it doesn't really ever need to be turned off and it controls the 4WD system.

My wife's Accord has VSA but I'm not sure she knows what it is or how to turn it off so never on that one.

TylerT

iTrader: (1)

No TCS here - my S2000 is an '04, I believe years '06+ were equipped with VSA.

Do I need it? Not really.

It rains less than 10 times a year and it never snows. Dry conditions = no nannies please.

ttribe

BMWs have an intermediate level between "On" and "Off" called "Dynamic"; basically, it just makes the nannies intervene later, allowing for a bit more shenanigans. I put my car into "Dynamic" daily. I rarely turn it all the way off, though, only because I haven't experimented enough to feel comfortable doing so. With my tune, the rear end can get squirrely in a straight line at 2,500 rpm at WOT without the traction control on.

NBP04TL4ME

I voted Never but had to once like M.I.N.O. because I was stuck on an incline in the snow. But that was the only time.

SgtSir440

I voted often. I turn the VSA off as soon as I get in my car in the morning. My driveway is uphill to get out with loose gravel, so the stock michelins tend to slip a bit and I find the VSA annoying. As soon as I get on the highway VSA goes back on. Occasionally if I'm in the city I will turn VSA off because the stockies sometimes tend to slip when pulling away from lights, especially if I'm going uphill and it is wet/damp out. When that happens, VSA will kick in and the car slows down unexpectedly and causes the person behind me to get uncomfortably close to hitting me. In the snow, VSA is always on except when I need to dig myself out. We will see if that changes with some new tires soon.

Booya4139

intentionally losing traction on public roads is incredibly irresponsible...

If you live out in the rural boonies it may be different but around these my area i wouldn't consider it.

JS + XES

iTrader: (1)

This is a pretty fun video about VSC:

SamDoe1

You need new tires if you lose traction pulling away from a stoplight in the rain. Unless you're going WOT at every green light, in which case carry on.

SgtSir440

Haha yeah I do need tires. I did mention that I'll be getting new ones soon in that last post though. I have 54,xxx miles on the same Michelins that were put on the car wayyyyy back in 07 when it was made It's pretty scary driving on the highway in a thunderstorm too. For that, VSA stays on.

SamDoe1

If your tires are bad, the VSA isn't going to do sh1t.

The only thing that all these systems on your car do is make the tires spin faster, stop faster, or change direction faster. Tires are one of the most important parts of your car.

CLtotheTL32

iTrader: (3)

Never. My TL isn't fast nor agile so I don't drive it like it is

SgtSir440

I never said tires weren't important nor did I ever say that having VSA means I never have to replace tires or whatever you are trying to imply. I can't tell if you are just stating facts or if you are trying to lecture me on the importance of tires. The only thing I really said was my tires suck and therefore sometimes I turn VSA off because it can cause problems.

Is the correct spelling therefore or therefor? Spelling isn't really my fort.

SamDoe1

Just saying you should replace your tires more often than once every 8 years.

It's "therefore" and "forte".

SgtSir440

Believe me I know. I bought the car and drove it for two months before putting snow tires on it for the winter. Now that they are back on, I realize they are just terrible.

oo7spy

I don't know who you are, but you can stay.

cjTL

iTrader: (2)

Often in the winter. Traction control cuts power at the first sign of slippage on snow/ice. This is pretty freaking dangerous when traveling up an incline. Complicated by the fact that Ford buries the setting in a bunch of menus you have to click through on the steering wheel.

EvilVirus

iTrader: (8)

I always turn off VSA.

subinf

Rarely. Usually only when I'm adjusting the mirrors or using the mirror defrost and accidentally hit the button. And once or twice in the snow to get moving.

SuperTrooper169

iTrader: (2)

I turn mine off when I'm drag racing, but otherwise it stays on.

black label

I don't have it, in hindsight since my cl-s was 6mt, I've never had it. I will say that those of you who never turn it off probably don't live in the snow belt. As counter intuitive as it may sound, sometimes turning off traction control is the only way to actually get moving. Mercedes is notorious for having a ridiculously over intrusive system, they can be near impossible to get moving in the smallest amount of snow.

FamilyGuy

Turning VSA off is the first thing I do when I start the car. I only leave it on in heavy rain or snow (when I lived up north before).

Years ago I was making a left onto a street from a dead stop. Coast was clear and off I go. Half a car onto the road and this guy comes around the corner flying. I realize I need to get out in a hurry and hit the gas, TCS kicked in and cut the fuel, and I almost got T boned. Never again. There are times for these systems to be used. Every day 24/7 isn't it.

cjTL

iTrader: (2)

I had a friend recently tell me they're so glad their car has traction control and that they turn it on whenever there is snow on the roads. I was curious what she meant by turning the traction control on. "Yeah, I just push the button whenever there is snow so the system is active." I kindly explained to her that pushing the traction control button, in fact, disables the system.

SgtSir440

Why thank you

This has happened to me a couple times. Definitely not a nice feeling at all when you feel the power cut out while you're watching somebody speed towards you. As a matter of fact, it happened to me last week when a motorcycle came flying around a corner while I was leaving a stop sign.

SamDoe1

Solution is four driven wheels and a 7500 curb weight, traction control be damned.

black label

Yeah, new process 231, black label doesn't get stuck.

oo7spy

It is much safer to learn the limits of your car in a controlled environment than to figure them out on the fly in a random one.

Saintor

TC control never but ESP (aka DSC) regularly.

It is a benefit of BMW of having a partial net.... unsure if all the new ones are like this, but mine you have a setting that the setting of ESP is less aggressive - I can hold a drift but passed an higher threshold eventually it will kick in. Extremely funny in winters. Other brands have it but in higher packages/options (Audi Drive Select, Porsche Chrono, some GMs).

MTEAZY

I don't believe in traction control. Rather have clutch-type LSDs or elockers instead.

black label

Porsches traction control/skid protection can not be fully disabled. Even when you turn it off its waiting to turn itself back on. An "abs event" will cause the systems to re-engage. It's pretty nice though, it basically turns itself on as a way of self preservation, it lets you lose control before turning itself back on.

Aman

I voted rarely. The Passat has it, and it was too intrusive this past winter with A/Ss.