Honda: S2000 News
02-01-2017, 10:14 AM
#1081
Team Owner
Honestly, the people who buy miatas and the people who bough s2000s are completely different. The price point difference alone was so great that these two cars really weren't possible to cross shop.
Having spent plenty time behind the wheel of an s2000, and personally owning a loaded 2007 Miata GT, I can tell you there is no comparison when looking at the vehicles both in stock form. The Miata is more geared towards guys going through a midlife crisis, about 40-50 years of age, looking to regain some of their youth by getting a "sporty" convertible. The stock suspension was overly soft, the chassis stiffness is much lower (I remember coming across some charts that compared the s2000 chassis to the NA, NB and NC Miatas, and none of them even came close... Honda put a ton of engineering and effort into making the s2000 chassis as stiff as it was), the Miata engine is just a plebe 2.0L engine that mazda used in many of it's other cars- literally nothing special about it, where the s2000 had a bespoke, astronomically high revving and very well tuned "race" engine in comparison. The seats in the Miata offer no bolstering and are made for "wider" people, where the s2000 is much more snug and holds you nicely when pushed into the corners. The interior quality materials of the Miata were supremely subpar in comparison to the s2000... the leather is junk in comparison. The materials were all hard plastic and nowhere near as attractive as the s2000...
I can go on and on. These cars are intended for two separate markets and two separate buyers. While someone may cross shop them, it becomes very clear, very quickly which the better car is. All it came down to is whether or not people were willing to spend a bunch more on the better product, or not.
Having spent plenty time behind the wheel of an s2000, and personally owning a loaded 2007 Miata GT, I can tell you there is no comparison when looking at the vehicles both in stock form. The Miata is more geared towards guys going through a midlife crisis, about 40-50 years of age, looking to regain some of their youth by getting a "sporty" convertible. The stock suspension was overly soft, the chassis stiffness is much lower (I remember coming across some charts that compared the s2000 chassis to the NA, NB and NC Miatas, and none of them even came close... Honda put a ton of engineering and effort into making the s2000 chassis as stiff as it was), the Miata engine is just a plebe 2.0L engine that mazda used in many of it's other cars- literally nothing special about it, where the s2000 had a bespoke, astronomically high revving and very well tuned "race" engine in comparison. The seats in the Miata offer no bolstering and are made for "wider" people, where the s2000 is much more snug and holds you nicely when pushed into the corners. The interior quality materials of the Miata were supremely subpar in comparison to the s2000... the leather is junk in comparison. The materials were all hard plastic and nowhere near as attractive as the s2000...
I can go on and on. These cars are intended for two separate markets and two separate buyers. While someone may cross shop them, it becomes very clear, very quickly which the better car is. All it came down to is whether or not people were willing to spend a bunch more on the better product, or not.
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nist7 (02-01-2017)
02-01-2017, 10:17 AM
#1083
Senior Moderator
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02-01-2017, 10:19 AM
#1084
Team Owner
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02-01-2017, 10:26 AM
#1085
Safety Car
Honestly, the people who buy miatas and the people who bough s2000s are completely different. The price point difference alone was so great that these two cars really weren't possible to cross shop.
Having spent plenty time behind the wheel of an s2000, and personally owning a loaded 2007 Miata GT, I can tell you there is no comparison when looking at the vehicles both in stock form. The Miata is more geared towards guys going through a midlife crisis, about 40-50 years of age, looking to regain some of their youth by getting a "sporty" convertible. The stock suspension was overly soft, the chassis stiffness is much lower (I remember coming across some charts that compared the s2000 chassis to the NA, NB and NC Miatas, and none of them even came close... Honda put a ton of engineering and effort into making the s2000 chassis as stiff as it was), the Miata engine is just a plebe 2.0L engine that mazda used in many of it's other cars- literally nothing special about it, where the s2000 had a bespoke, astronomically high revving and very well tuned "race" engine in comparison. The seats in the Miata offer no bolstering and are made for "wider" people, where the s2000 is much more snug and holds you nicely when pushed into the corners. The interior quality materials of the Miata were supremely subpar in comparison to the s2000... the leather is junk in comparison. The materials were all hard plastic and nowhere near as attractive as the s2000...
I can go on and on. These cars are intended for two separate markets and two separate buyers. While someone may cross shop them, it becomes very clear, very quickly which the better car is. All it came down to is whether or not people were willing to spend a bunch more on the better product, or not.
Having spent plenty time behind the wheel of an s2000, and personally owning a loaded 2007 Miata GT, I can tell you there is no comparison when looking at the vehicles both in stock form. The Miata is more geared towards guys going through a midlife crisis, about 40-50 years of age, looking to regain some of their youth by getting a "sporty" convertible. The stock suspension was overly soft, the chassis stiffness is much lower (I remember coming across some charts that compared the s2000 chassis to the NA, NB and NC Miatas, and none of them even came close... Honda put a ton of engineering and effort into making the s2000 chassis as stiff as it was), the Miata engine is just a plebe 2.0L engine that mazda used in many of it's other cars- literally nothing special about it, where the s2000 had a bespoke, astronomically high revving and very well tuned "race" engine in comparison. The seats in the Miata offer no bolstering and are made for "wider" people, where the s2000 is much more snug and holds you nicely when pushed into the corners. The interior quality materials of the Miata were supremely subpar in comparison to the s2000... the leather is junk in comparison. The materials were all hard plastic and nowhere near as attractive as the s2000...
I can go on and on. These cars are intended for two separate markets and two separate buyers. While someone may cross shop them, it becomes very clear, very quickly which the better car is. All it came down to is whether or not people were willing to spend a bunch more on the better product, or not.
I was also curious as to the target market. And maybe there is a wider gap in the buyer demographic between Miata buyers and S2000 buyers. Would be interesting to peek into some company-ran market research in this segment of cars.
Yeah....we'll see. Sounds like some kind of electric batterypack that would spool the supercharger (ie, no robbing of motor power) in the lower RPM and then the turbo takes over later in the higher RPM ranges?
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justnspace (02-01-2017)
02-01-2017, 10:38 AM
#1086
Team Owner
I've come across some older gentlemen that had s2000s. I had a boss a few years ago... he was about 60 and his toy car was an s2000. I'm sure there are people that would cross shop the two, but there likely wouldn't be very many.
Another way to look at it- mazda produced the miata to sell and make them money. I've heard several times that honda actually lost money on every s2000 they sold. Their reasoning for producing it was to showcase their engineering prowess, so they didn't hold back. The miata on the other hand uses some parts from other mazdas and overall was built to make money, not show off their abilities.
I think you're right about the e-supercharger though. I think the turbo will be set to produce power high in the rpm band, but inherently will be lagging down low. The e-charger likely will fill the low end grunt that the turbo can't produce.
One of the complaints about the s2000 was the lack of down low grunt. I think the e-charger is intended to address that
Another way to look at it- mazda produced the miata to sell and make them money. I've heard several times that honda actually lost money on every s2000 they sold. Their reasoning for producing it was to showcase their engineering prowess, so they didn't hold back. The miata on the other hand uses some parts from other mazdas and overall was built to make money, not show off their abilities.
I think you're right about the e-supercharger though. I think the turbo will be set to produce power high in the rpm band, but inherently will be lagging down low. The e-charger likely will fill the low end grunt that the turbo can't produce.
One of the complaints about the s2000 was the lack of down low grunt. I think the e-charger is intended to address that
02-01-2017, 10:52 AM
#1087
Safety Car
So we shall see when more firm details are actually out.
If they can keep the weight relatively down (certainly gonna be heavier the the superlight Miata) with good HP curve/peak and great looks AND keep it reasonable cost...it'll be very enticing.
If they can keep the weight relatively down (certainly gonna be heavier the the superlight Miata) with good HP curve/peak and great looks AND keep it reasonable cost...it'll be very enticing.
02-01-2017, 11:46 AM
#1089
Team Owner
hybrid = combing two different elements, or a mixture.
if it's using two types of "charging" then it def. fits the bill for the definition of hybrid..
I'm half asian and white...sometimes, I do call myself a hybrid
this doesnt mean, I run on batteries... or have a regenerative power pack on my back
if it's using two types of "charging" then it def. fits the bill for the definition of hybrid..
I'm half asian and white...sometimes, I do call myself a hybrid
this doesnt mean, I run on batteries... or have a regenerative power pack on my back
02-01-2017, 01:06 PM
#1090
Azine Jabroni
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02-01-2017, 02:08 PM
#1092
Azine Jabroni
02-01-2017, 05:59 PM
#1094
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I think the 2000 S2000 was $32k. Using that inflation calculator, it would be $45k in 2018.
The electric supercharger is probably there just to eliminate the turbo lag. It allows the boost to be higher for more power without turbo lag.
I guess the world has moved on from 17 years ago. No doubt the original S2000 is great, but Honda has to consider what's out there in the current market too.
350Z went from 274hp to as much as 350hp. And next gen Z is said to be 400hp.
The Porsche Boxster started out at 217hp with 5MT at $42k and was as fast as my 2G TL-S (0-60 in 6.2s and 1/4 mile in 14.7s@95mph)?
Now, there's a version with 350hp with 7-DCT that can do 0-60mph in 3.6s and 1/4 mile under 12's. And it starts at over $68k.
If it's a true s2000 successor, then Honda might want that car to be somewhat competitive with the next Z and new Boxster. Heck, by 2018, the Boxster might again be improved upon.
The electric supercharger is probably there just to eliminate the turbo lag. It allows the boost to be higher for more power without turbo lag.
I guess the world has moved on from 17 years ago. No doubt the original S2000 is great, but Honda has to consider what's out there in the current market too.
350Z went from 274hp to as much as 350hp. And next gen Z is said to be 400hp.
The Porsche Boxster started out at 217hp with 5MT at $42k and was as fast as my 2G TL-S (0-60 in 6.2s and 1/4 mile in 14.7s@95mph)?
Now, there's a version with 350hp with 7-DCT that can do 0-60mph in 3.6s and 1/4 mile under 12's. And it starts at over $68k.
If it's a true s2000 successor, then Honda might want that car to be somewhat competitive with the next Z and new Boxster. Heck, by 2018, the Boxster might again be improved upon.
02-01-2017, 06:34 PM
#1095
Team Owner
sadly, there is no "next Z" car. I'm part of the Z forums and there is a huge disappointment that so far, Nissan has been entirely silent on anything replacing the 370z, which has been out for 8 years now. Yes, there is the TT Qwhatever, but for some reason, not a single peep out of Nissan about a Z successor (unless it was announced in the last two weeks and I missed it, but I don't think so)
02-01-2017, 07:11 PM
#1096
Team Owner
I would not worry too much about it.... Nissan has balls... Honda doesn't,
02-01-2017, 07:42 PM
#1097
I think most of you are being whiny. It looks like finally Honda is serious about its performance models again, with the NSX and CTR. I am glad they're making something, at the very least. Would I prefer a more simplistic, relatively lightweight ~$40k RWD roadster or coupe? Sure, but it would almost be another "me too" in the market. On the flip side, it could be the Civic Si and... that's it.
It most likely will be a 4-cyl, which makes sense for it to have an electric supercharger and conventional turbocharger, instead of an electric turbo and regular turbo. I was praising MB for their implementation of the aforementioned in the MB Auto Technology thread, since theoretically if done correctly, it boosts power without sacrificing response.
It will undoubtedly be a relatively heavy vehicle though, as well as pricey. There has to be some sort of regenerative system to capture extra energy. So it may be a hybrid of sorts after all.
It most likely will be a 4-cyl, which makes sense for it to have an electric supercharger and conventional turbocharger, instead of an electric turbo and regular turbo. I was praising MB for their implementation of the aforementioned in the MB Auto Technology thread, since theoretically if done correctly, it boosts power without sacrificing response.
It will undoubtedly be a relatively heavy vehicle though, as well as pricey. There has to be some sort of regenerative system to capture extra energy. So it may be a hybrid of sorts after all.
02-01-2017, 09:07 PM
#1098
Team Owner
I think most of you are being whiny. It looks like finally Honda is serious about its performance models again, with the NSX and CTR. I am glad they're making something, at the very least. Would I prefer a more simplistic, relatively lightweight ~$40k RWD roadster or coupe? Sure, but it would almost be another "me too" in the market. On the flip side, it could be the Civic Si and... that's it.
It most likely will be a 4-cyl, which makes sense for it to have an electric supercharger and conventional turbocharger, instead of an electric turbo and regular turbo. I was praising MB for their implementation of the aforementioned in the MB Auto Technology thread, since theoretically if done correctly, it boosts power without sacrificing response.
It will undoubtedly be a relatively heavy vehicle though, as well as pricey. There has to be some sort of regenerative system to capture extra energy. So it may be a hybrid of sorts after all.
It most likely will be a 4-cyl, which makes sense for it to have an electric supercharger and conventional turbocharger, instead of an electric turbo and regular turbo. I was praising MB for their implementation of the aforementioned in the MB Auto Technology thread, since theoretically if done correctly, it boosts power without sacrificing response.
It will undoubtedly be a relatively heavy vehicle though, as well as pricey. There has to be some sort of regenerative system to capture extra energy. So it may be a hybrid of sorts after all.
Last edited by oonowindoo; 02-01-2017 at 09:10 PM.
02-01-2017, 10:38 PM
#1099
But how many sporty, twincharged RWD coupes are out there? My guess is that whatever Honda cooks up, it'll still be lighter than competitors like the Mustang and Camaro, anyway
Simple, lightweight, and powerful RWD tends to be a specific niche that requires a unique platform and a longer model span to recoup development costs... Like the S2000
02-01-2017, 10:46 PM
#1100
Team Owner
They're making it sound like they're putting a whole new engine into that car, but based on the power claims, it sounds like it will be the CTR 2.0T, except with the addition of the e-charger. Why would they develop an all new turbo engine that puts out the same amount of power as an existing turbo engine? I can also see upper power not changing much from the CTRs 306hp, due to the e-charger. It's meant to delver power down low, not up high, so the max horsepower only goes up the 14hp. Hmmm...
02-02-2017, 12:01 PM
#1101
Team Owner
At the end, i dont really care what kind of engine it puts in there, as long as they can keep the weight down, 6mt, RWD. I will be very interested... oh and don't make it look like Acura.
02-02-2017, 12:07 PM
#1102
Team Owner
yeah, so I can already tell you that you'll be disappointed. I HIGHLY doubt there will be a 6MT, as much as I would absolutely love there to be one.
I think there is a possibility for RWD, but I can foresee Honda wanting it to be AWD... it might get left out, simply due to the increase in weight. That's at least what I'm hoping.
It won't be a s light as the original s2000 (which isn't even all that light, if you compare it to any Miata). The s2000 had a much stiffer chassis and I think the weight increase of the s2000 is highly related to that (and as such, totally ok in my mind). But I'd be surprised if the new s2000 can stay below 2800lbs.
I think there is a possibility for RWD, but I can foresee Honda wanting it to be AWD... it might get left out, simply due to the increase in weight. That's at least what I'm hoping.
It won't be a s light as the original s2000 (which isn't even all that light, if you compare it to any Miata). The s2000 had a much stiffer chassis and I think the weight increase of the s2000 is highly related to that (and as such, totally ok in my mind). But I'd be surprised if the new s2000 can stay below 2800lbs.
02-02-2017, 12:11 PM
#1103
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sadly, there is no "next Z" car. I'm part of the Z forums and there is a huge disappointment that so far, Nissan has been entirely silent on anything replacing the 370z, which has been out for 8 years now. Yes, there is the TT Qwhatever, but for some reason, not a single peep out of Nissan about a Z successor (unless it was announced in the last two weeks and I missed it, but I don't think so)
New Nissan Z-car concept gearing up for Tokyo 2017 | Auto Express
May be more news in November?
I think most of you are being whiny. It looks like finally Honda is serious about its performance models again, with the NSX and CTR. I am glad they're making something, at the very least. Would I prefer a more simplistic, relatively lightweight ~$40k RWD roadster or coupe? Sure, but it would almost be another "me too" in the market. On the flip side, it could be the Civic Si and... that's it.
It most likely will be a 4-cyl, which makes sense for it to have an electric supercharger and conventional turbocharger, instead of an electric turbo and regular turbo. I was praising MB for their implementation of the aforementioned in the MB Auto Technology thread, since theoretically if done correctly, it boosts power without sacrificing response.
It will undoubtedly be a relatively heavy vehicle though, as well as pricey. There has to be some sort of regenerative system to capture extra energy. So it may be a hybrid of sorts after all.
It most likely will be a 4-cyl, which makes sense for it to have an electric supercharger and conventional turbocharger, instead of an electric turbo and regular turbo. I was praising MB for their implementation of the aforementioned in the MB Auto Technology thread, since theoretically if done correctly, it boosts power without sacrificing response.
It will undoubtedly be a relatively heavy vehicle though, as well as pricey. There has to be some sort of regenerative system to capture extra energy. So it may be a hybrid of sorts after all.
They're making it sound like they're putting a whole new engine into that car, but based on the power claims, it sounds like it will be the CTR 2.0T, except with the addition of the e-charger. Why would they develop an all new turbo engine that puts out the same amount of power as an existing turbo engine? I can also see upper power not changing much from the CTRs 306hp, due to the e-charger. It's meant to delver power down low, not up high, so the max horsepower only goes up the 14hp. Hmmm...
02-02-2017, 12:12 PM
#1104
Moderator
With the MBZ SLC being 3200-3500lbs & the Z4 being 3200-3600, even though upmarket a bit from the S2k, I think 2800-3000lbs is reasonable.
The ND Miata is right around 2400lbs
Fiat 124 is around 2400-2500lbs
Puts a 2800lb S2k successor right in the middle.
The ND Miata is right around 2400lbs
Fiat 124 is around 2400-2500lbs
Puts a 2800lb S2k successor right in the middle.
02-02-2017, 12:23 PM
#1105
Team Owner
Original s2000 was about 2650, if I remember correctly. That's why I'd be surprised if it stayed under 2800. I could see 2900-3000... but are people going to complain then? Honestly, I think even if it hits 3000, that's still pretty light and Honda can design one hell of a car at that weight point. No, it's not as light as the original, but then again, the s2000 was heavier than the s800. And the s800 was heavier than the s600.
I for one hope it grows just a wee bit in size (so that I can fit, lol), and gains a tilting steering wheel. Now add the turbo, intercooler, piping, e-charger, BOV, wastegate, additional safety features that weren't around in 1998-2009, likely larger wheels (18s?), the DCT (I assume it has to weigh more than a 6MT), and whatever else, and I don't see how this car wouldn't be at least 2900 pounds.
Though now that I think about it, they likely will employ the use of lightweight frame materials, like the new Civic is utilizing, to keep the weight down, like the civic did over it's predecessor even though it grew in size. That will definitely be a plus.
Hmmm... maybe I jumped to conclusions too soon (hey, it's hard not to, ok?!). I will be sad there is likely going to be no manual option though. I DGAF how much slower it is... the feels just aren't the same. I'll reserve full judgement once I test drive it
I for one hope it grows just a wee bit in size (so that I can fit, lol), and gains a tilting steering wheel. Now add the turbo, intercooler, piping, e-charger, BOV, wastegate, additional safety features that weren't around in 1998-2009, likely larger wheels (18s?), the DCT (I assume it has to weigh more than a 6MT), and whatever else, and I don't see how this car wouldn't be at least 2900 pounds.
Though now that I think about it, they likely will employ the use of lightweight frame materials, like the new Civic is utilizing, to keep the weight down, like the civic did over it's predecessor even though it grew in size. That will definitely be a plus.
Hmmm... maybe I jumped to conclusions too soon (hey, it's hard not to, ok?!). I will be sad there is likely going to be no manual option though. I DGAF how much slower it is... the feels just aren't the same. I'll reserve full judgement once I test drive it
02-02-2017, 12:52 PM
#1106
Moderator
Maybe the fact that the Si & Type R are still available w/ 6MT gives hope.
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02-02-2017, 01:21 PM
#1107
Team Owner
yeah, so I can already tell you that you'll be disappointed. I HIGHLY doubt there will be a 6MT, as much as I would absolutely love there to be one.
I think there is a possibility for RWD, but I can foresee Honda wanting it to be AWD... it might get left out, simply due to the increase in weight. That's at least what I'm hoping.
It won't be a s light as the original s2000 (which isn't even all that light, if you compare it to any Miata). The s2000 had a much stiffer chassis and I think the weight increase of the s2000 is highly related to that (and as such, totally ok in my mind). But I'd be surprised if the new s2000 can stay below 2800lbs.
I think there is a possibility for RWD, but I can foresee Honda wanting it to be AWD... it might get left out, simply due to the increase in weight. That's at least what I'm hoping.
It won't be a s light as the original s2000 (which isn't even all that light, if you compare it to any Miata). The s2000 had a much stiffer chassis and I think the weight increase of the s2000 is highly related to that (and as such, totally ok in my mind). But I'd be surprised if the new s2000 can stay below 2800lbs.
2800 lbs is daydreaming for the current Honda. I will be happy if they can keep it under 3000. I think going AWD for a small roadster is kinda pointless. I mean, Honda should know roadsters are not meant to set track record or drive in snow. They are all about fun and feel.
Well, it is Honda, they do stupid shit more often than not.
02-02-2017, 01:31 PM
#1108
I think they will surprise us with the final drivetrain, just like they did with the NSX.
Whether or not that will be a good thing remains to be seen.
I think a twin turbo, twin motor V6 sans-VTEC was the last thing we all expected, up until the leaks shortly before production anyway
Whether or not that will be a good thing remains to be seen.
I think a twin turbo, twin motor V6 sans-VTEC was the last thing we all expected, up until the leaks shortly before production anyway
02-02-2017, 01:44 PM
#1109
Team Owner
Not really. What other choice did they have?
they aren't going to ever add cylinders. That's been made clear.
there's only so far you can push a V6- the same problem the 1G NSX had. And even so, all your competitors have to do is crank the boost and retune the ecu. Voila, an additional 100hp. No NA setup could even compete, unless Honda started adding cylinders, which again, they aren't going to do.
What at else would power a super car? Just batteries?
they aren't going to ever add cylinders. That's been made clear.
there's only so far you can push a V6- the same problem the 1G NSX had. And even so, all your competitors have to do is crank the boost and retune the ecu. Voila, an additional 100hp. No NA setup could even compete, unless Honda started adding cylinders, which again, they aren't going to do.
What at else would power a super car? Just batteries?
02-02-2017, 02:21 PM
#1110
Not really. What other choice did they have?
they aren't going to ever add cylinders. That's been made clear.
there's only so far you can push a V6- the same problem the 1G NSX had. And even so, all your competitors have to do is crank the boost and retune the ecu. Voila, an additional 100hp. No NA setup could even compete, unless Honda started adding cylinders, which again, they aren't going to do.
What at else would power a super car? Just batteries?
they aren't going to ever add cylinders. That's been made clear.
there's only so far you can push a V6- the same problem the 1G NSX had. And even so, all your competitors have to do is crank the boost and retune the ecu. Voila, an additional 100hp. No NA setup could even compete, unless Honda started adding cylinders, which again, they aren't going to do.
What at else would power a super car? Just batteries?
02-02-2017, 03:52 PM
#1111
Ex-OEM King
This thread makes me want to go drive my S2000... 
02-02-2017, 04:13 PM
#1112
Team Owner
02-02-2017, 06:21 PM
#1113
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Original s2000 was about 2650, if I remember correctly. That's why I'd be surprised if it stayed under 2800. I could see 2900-3000... but are people going to complain then? Honestly, I think even if it hits 3000, that's still pretty light and Honda can design one hell of a car at that weight point. No, it's not as light as the original, but then again, the s2000 was heavier than the s800. And the s800 was heavier than the s600.
I for one hope it grows just a wee bit in size (so that I can fit, lol), and gains a tilting steering wheel. Now add the turbo, intercooler, piping, e-charger, BOV, wastegate, additional safety features that weren't around in 1998-2009, likely larger wheels (18s?), the DCT (I assume it has to weigh more than a 6MT), and whatever else, and I don't see how this car wouldn't be at least 2900 pounds.
Though now that I think about it, they likely will employ the use of lightweight frame materials, like the new Civic is utilizing, to keep the weight down, like the civic did over it's predecessor even though it grew in size. That will definitely be a plus.
Hmmm... maybe I jumped to conclusions too soon (hey, it's hard not to, ok?!). I will be sad there is likely going to be no manual option though. I DGAF how much slower it is... the feels just aren't the same. I'll reserve full judgement once I test drive it
I for one hope it grows just a wee bit in size (so that I can fit, lol), and gains a tilting steering wheel. Now add the turbo, intercooler, piping, e-charger, BOV, wastegate, additional safety features that weren't around in 1998-2009, likely larger wheels (18s?), the DCT (I assume it has to weigh more than a 6MT), and whatever else, and I don't see how this car wouldn't be at least 2900 pounds.
Though now that I think about it, they likely will employ the use of lightweight frame materials, like the new Civic is utilizing, to keep the weight down, like the civic did over it's predecessor even though it grew in size. That will definitely be a plus.
Hmmm... maybe I jumped to conclusions too soon (hey, it's hard not to, ok?!). I will be sad there is likely going to be no manual option though. I DGAF how much slower it is... the feels just aren't the same. I'll reserve full judgement once I test drive it
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...statistics.pdf
The above is a 2003 model at 2896lb.
Given how "spartan" the S2000 was back then, I'd be really surprised if a new one is under 3000lb.
Not really. What other choice did they have?
they aren't going to ever add cylinders. That's been made clear.
there's only so far you can push a V6- the same problem the 1G NSX had. And even so, all your competitors have to do is crank the boost and retune the ecu. Voila, an additional 100hp. No NA setup could even compete, unless Honda started adding cylinders, which again, they aren't going to do.
What at else would power a super car? Just batteries?
they aren't going to ever add cylinders. That's been made clear.
there's only so far you can push a V6- the same problem the 1G NSX had. And even so, all your competitors have to do is crank the boost and retune the ecu. Voila, an additional 100hp. No NA setup could even compete, unless Honda started adding cylinders, which again, they aren't going to do.
What at else would power a super car? Just batteries?
02-02-2017, 06:59 PM
#1114
Moderator
iTrader: (3)
02-02-2017, 07:37 PM
#1115
To me it doesn't really matter what powerplant it uses, as long as the final product isn't excessively heavy and it produces power in a satisfying way. I'm not stuck on any one particular brand, so if I don't like it, I'll shop elsewhere.
02-03-2017, 01:42 PM
#1116
Ex-OEM King
02-03-2017, 02:25 PM
#1117
Team Owner
The original AP1 S2k is closer to 2800-2900lb:
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...statistics.pdf
The above is a 2003 model at 2896lb.
Given how "spartan" the S2000 was back then, I'd be really surprised if a new one is under 3000lb.
Haha yes that was almost 10 years ago...you can find the specs of that V10 online too. It makes about 543hp at 8500rpm at 5L, with the potential to grow to 5.5L for future upgrade.
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...statistics.pdf
The above is a 2003 model at 2896lb.
Given how "spartan" the S2000 was back then, I'd be really surprised if a new one is under 3000lb.
Haha yes that was almost 10 years ago...you can find the specs of that V10 online too. It makes about 543hp at 8500rpm at 5L, with the potential to grow to 5.5L for future upgrade.
shit, you're right. It was my NC Miata that weighed 2650, that I was confusing the s2000 with. Yeah, the s2000 was not a light car, on paper. It feels pretty nimble, showing how well it was engineered.
02-03-2017, 03:26 PM
#1118
Ex-OEM King
02-06-2017, 12:18 PM
#1119
You'll Never Walk Alone
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lol come on man sub-3000lb was still pretty impressive even in 2000 for a convertible with that kind of chassis stiffness. A $55k Boxster S 6MT at that time was over 3000lb. Given the price of the S2k back then ($33k), Honda couldn't afford to offer super lightweight and strong materials.
12-03-2020, 08:43 AM
#1120
Moderator
https://www.motor1.com/news/457956/h...rn-rumor-2024/
Take it with a massive grain of salt, but "a source close to Honda" tells Forbes that a revived S2000 is at least under consideration. Specifically, the brand's marketing team is allegedly investigating the possibility of building a new sports car to arrive in 2024.
As a vehicle that's still so many years away and doesn't even have a green light for production, details about the revived S2000 are still sketchy. The insider indicates that Honda intends the body proportions to be similar to the original. Aluminum and carbon fiber would help keep the weight below 3,000 pounds (1,361 kilograms). For comparison, the S2K at introduction in Japan weighed 2,733 pounds (1,240 kilograms).
Rather than the original, high-revving naturally aspirated four-cylinder engine, the new S2000 allegedly adopts a version of the Civic Type R's 2.0-liter turbocharged four-cylinder. To make it work, Honda needs to engineer the engine to work longitudinally for driving the rear wheels.
While all of this sounds great, you should be hesitant about starting to save your pennies for a new S2000 in 2024 because of earlier statements from company execs. In 2018, Hayato Mori, the automaker's senior manager for product planning in Canada, indicated that research showed there wasn't enough interest in reviving the sports car. He said it was going to be impossible to make money on the vehicle.
Also, Honda Motor Company CEO Takahiro Hachigo was a bit more diplomatic in 2017 when he said that it wasn't the right time to bring back the S2000. “All over the world – in Japan, North America, Europe, China – more and more voices are expressing the desire to reinvent S2000. However, it has not matured yet. It’s not time yet. We need time to decide if S2000 is reinvented or not. If the sales people investigate, look at it and they’re really enthusiastic, maybe we look at it,” Hachigo said at the time.
Granted, both of these statements are not too recent. It's possible that the time is finally here for Honda's lineup outside of Japan to include a two-seat, open-roof sports car once again.
As a vehicle that's still so many years away and doesn't even have a green light for production, details about the revived S2000 are still sketchy. The insider indicates that Honda intends the body proportions to be similar to the original. Aluminum and carbon fiber would help keep the weight below 3,000 pounds (1,361 kilograms). For comparison, the S2K at introduction in Japan weighed 2,733 pounds (1,240 kilograms).
Rather than the original, high-revving naturally aspirated four-cylinder engine, the new S2000 allegedly adopts a version of the Civic Type R's 2.0-liter turbocharged four-cylinder. To make it work, Honda needs to engineer the engine to work longitudinally for driving the rear wheels.
While all of this sounds great, you should be hesitant about starting to save your pennies for a new S2000 in 2024 because of earlier statements from company execs. In 2018, Hayato Mori, the automaker's senior manager for product planning in Canada, indicated that research showed there wasn't enough interest in reviving the sports car. He said it was going to be impossible to make money on the vehicle.
Also, Honda Motor Company CEO Takahiro Hachigo was a bit more diplomatic in 2017 when he said that it wasn't the right time to bring back the S2000. “All over the world – in Japan, North America, Europe, China – more and more voices are expressing the desire to reinvent S2000. However, it has not matured yet. It’s not time yet. We need time to decide if S2000 is reinvented or not. If the sales people investigate, look at it and they’re really enthusiastic, maybe we look at it,” Hachigo said at the time.
Granted, both of these statements are not too recent. It's possible that the time is finally here for Honda's lineup outside of Japan to include a two-seat, open-roof sports car once again.
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