SSFTSX

Yup. Toyota world Largest and Honda World Second largest R&D and engine firms are not investing it in luxury lineup on mass scale. They will go hybrid way.
There was R&T comparision test of 6MT TL-SH-AWD and 6MT S4. and guess who come out on top on fuel test.
when weight/AWD/transmission setup & driving conditions are similar and TL is way taller and bigger car than S4 so high speed efficiency is hindered.
TL aerodynamic definciency is obvious when identical V6 TSX is faster than TL V6 by close to 10%.

there is further evidence of IS350/GS350 comparision tests with BMW 3/5 at Edmunds. 6 Speed lexus has achieved same or better efficiency with same or better performance than 8auto speed BMWs.

turbos are good if you drive outside the turbo range & cars are lighter so it is pointless to have turbo efficiency.
Autoblog made just ground less comparsion of 4600lbs minivan powered by 2.0 turbo will have some beneficial impact. I would say this 19/29 Odyssey is ground breaking interms of fuel efficiency.

Hapa DC5

SSFTSX do you agree with me when I say the 3.5L in the Odyssey will go 100 years and 3,285,324 miles?

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

You're quoting a R&T test that compared an S4 to a TL as your credible source???

fsttyms1

I read that article. If you would take the time to read it as well the Tl came DEAD LAST while the S4 came in first. By 120 the S4 was over 3 seconds faster. Mileage wasnt that far off, especially for the beating they took, (and for your info look at the BMW which is a TT inline 6, it beat your precious tl in mileage while being faster) But i already know you will counter with something having to do with RDX having 19" light weight wheels and turbo motors not lasting 30 years and 600k miles so no need replying.

MyCarIsntInMyWifesName

That's not even close to proof that FI is less efficient than NA. And in fact the EPA ranks the S4 above the TL in economy.

Post proof of that (read: NOT magazine tests) or shut up with your ignorant fantasies.

SSFTSX

your looking at data on wrong. It is understandable that S4 will be faster in straight line as it has 28bhp & over 50 ft-lb advantage. But thats not the big issue. TL is taller and wider vehicle that induce high drag at higher speeds above 70mph. so even if you punch it still the fuel economy does not drop below S4.
When you analyze the new A8 with its normally aspirated 4.2. It is more refined, more efficient and faster than 3.0T 740 BMW even with 20inch AWD.

BMW is lighter vehicle, very low to the ground. and no AWD frictions. So it is not relevant comparision.

BMW 3 looks mickey mouse compared to TSX let alone TL.

Hapa DC5

yes, no?

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Did I really just read that?

phile

I hate you all so much right now. I was hoping this crap would be isolated to the Monthly Sales Thread and the TL thread. but now even the Odyssey thread is ruined

biker

It's like those rubber neckers - you just can't help yourself to look.

dom

Seriously, wtf does any of this have to do with the Ody? Sure SSFTSX posted something stupid, what else is new. I'm wondering what's dumber, SSFTSX's opinion or the fact that some you continue to debate him knowing full well it goes nowhere? Smart, productive automotive debate is one thing, but this is getting ridiculous.

Lets get this back on topic.

dom

Outside of some styling issues, I'll have to say that this is the best Honda product release since the Fit. Prices are way down across the board up here in and features are way up. Honda has issues, but I don't think this Ody is one of them. Should be a huge success.

from Moog

Only issue I see is that my local dealer still has at least 20+ 10's sitting on the lot. Good luck moving them at anywhere near MSRP once these things hit the lot.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

^^^^ Gotta agree. Not fond of the exterior styling of the new Ody at all. It'll remain on my list of potential family haulers, hopefully by the time we need/want one, they'll have improved it's look.

The fact that it's now an 8 seater is a big plus.

Hapa DC5

I like the Odyssey. I think it will be a hit for Honda.

dom

The previous gen was an 8 seater as well. Although I don't think Touring's were as they didn't come with the removable second row center seat.

Moog-Type-S

I've said it before...this thing will sell.

The exterior design is love it or hate it.
Powertrain tech is old.
It's missing some serious features that are on vehicles that are half the price.

...but the Oddy has the name/rep.....and if you are looking for a 7-8 passenger minivan.....it will do the job.

I for one will not buy one again...but that's just me.

dom

Neither will I. My 07 has been nothing but a PITA. Still dealing with a tranny issue.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

I did not know that. My parents '05 Touring is a 7 seater. I just thought that all Ody's were 7 seater because of the way theirs was configured. Boy was I wrong.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Tranny issues? On an '07? Wow, I thought they corrected the problems.

My parents continue to have problems with the brakes and premature wear and grinding.

phile

so does it look like the non-HID Odysseys still get the projector lenses at least?

dom

Not sure what the problem is at this point. I went through 2 tranny software updates (TSB's released from Honda) Then a new torque converter, then another TSB for the software update and the problem remains. In fact its worse after the last update. To be honest I don't think its a tranny issue at this point but Honda seems to think it is so we'll see. I have to bring it in and go for a drive with a mechanic to explain exactly whats happening.

phile

Edmunds first drive

http://www.insideline.com/honda/odys...rst-drive.html

LX model is 7-seater only

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Dang dude, sorry to hear. I hope they can get it figured out. Does Canada have a lemon law in place? If they did do you think you'd act on it to dump it and get something else?

TMQ

I think in the market there's no other van better than the Odyssey, despite its various shortcomings. Personally I will wait until the 6sp is available on the EX-L model. I just don't want my kids to watch movies in the car.

Moog-Type-S

^^ Why is the Oddy better than the Sienna?

Costco

Sienna's interior is terrible. As mentioned by a previous poster the texture they used for the plastic is terrible, and its EVERYWHERE.

Maybe its my fussy knee giving me problems but the dead pedal location is also too high. I think its a problem with the super cab forward design. The issues people are having with Odysseys worries me though.

phile

i want to see a comparo between the Odyssey and Sienna in SE form.

the Edmunds article already knows the Sienne will outrun the Odyssey to 60 (racing minivans...I know...) by a full second at least, but all the talk about the Odyssey's handling will make it a good show down between two of the best minivans on the market.

Moog-Type-S

My thoughts about the Sienna vs Oddy:

Sienna has 6 speed tranny...nope for Honda....unless you spend HUGE coin.
Sienna hs 2 engine options....nope for Honda
Sienna has AWD....nope for Honda
Sienna has keyless start....nope for Honda

Sienna exterior edges out the win over Honda.....only because the Honda is "odd" looking
Honda wins interior by a slight edge.....drawback is too many buttons on the Honda.

mrdeeno

Can you get HIDs in most Sienna models?

I don't know, I haven't shopped yet for minivans.

mrdeeno

so the Sienna will take the Odyssey in a straight line, but the Oddy will catch up in the curves! SWEET!

alex2364

It's only optional in the top of the line Limited trim.

SSFTSX

It is not just interior. It is Honda fit and finish, refinement, reliability and fuel economy that will win the sales race. Even with 5speed Honda is more efficient. There is no way Toyota is going catch up with Pilot, CRV, Odyssey. No matter how many hybrids/engines it throw up into the lineup. Once larger Honda hybrids rolled in. the gap is going to increase.

Fibonacci

Until the Ody offers AWD, not gonna go there. Not feeling the new exterior design much though and wifey's still happy with the MDX. I'll check back after kid numero dos arrives later this year.

dom, sorry to hear about your tranny issues. I thought the glass transmissions were ancient history by now.

Hapa DC5

Can you answer my question about engine life please?

dom

Thanks. The issues with the Ody's tranny, at least on 07's is common. The Ody forums are littered with them.

ThermonMermon

youd think more than one trim would have HIDs as standard - esp for a car that carries such a techie marketing campaign.

Costco

If the Odyssey offered AWD it would be a huge boost to its appeal. Don't know if it would be entirely popular, and I don't know if there are *new* minivans besides the Sienna that have AWD but just letting Toyota have that niche all to themselves....

I think Honda would be content to put SH-AWD and nothing else (unless they can derive a possibly cheaper AWD without torque vectoring) on the Odyssey which will probably make it too expensive. A fully loaded Touring Elite is already approaching MDX pricing levels.

It may just be me but the sea of buttons bothered me a long time ago but with any extended amount of time in a car, I get used to it. Maybe it's because I'm part of the "video game generation" and having 13 buttons with two joysticks on a controller is still easily intuitive for me. The placement is kind of awkward though, how everything is all clumped together. I can imagine the Sienna is still more intuitive.

The 2GB/15GB hard drive is nice but I find iPod connectivity through a USB port and controls through the van's audio system much more convenient, though I may be biased.... not everyone has an iPod/iPhone.

As an aside minivans aren't really mini anymore. The 8-passenger Sienna we rented had enough room for 5 adults and two kids with a child seat, stroller, 60-quart cooler, all their luggage, entertainment items items from shopping for a 2-week road trip. To make these vans any bigger would be silly.

phile

in the reviews so far, it's mentioned Honda's aware of the AWD market, and it's something like 5%, so they weren't interested in it.

which is a shame cause those of us who do live in areas where we get inclement weather would like such a thing.

Costco

While I do like trucks and how they drive, when it comes to people hauling a minivan is better add AWD into the mix, and really, the only purpose a big honking SUV has is towing capabilities and higher driving position (which I don't care for, at all) which is coupled with crappy gas mileage, typically poorer handling, and other things. I always thought it was stupid that the only vehicles with 7+ passenger seating and AWD were mainly SUVs, not minivans.

fsttyms1

Does any one else think that a 2gb HD is kind of a joke? I mean really. In the days of 80 dollar 1TB hard drives i think they could have splurged a little and at least have given a 30-60?????