Acura: TLX News

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Old 08-06-2015, 02:24 PM
  #11481  
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(re: the retro review/video above)

In 1986 people were not convinced about Legend vs. Accord. In 2015 people are still not convinced about TLX vs. Accord. Accord wins, yay! LOL
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Old 08-06-2015, 02:27 PM
  #11482  
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Advance!
Old 08-06-2015, 02:38 PM
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Old 08-07-2015, 07:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Tonyware
(re: the retro review/video above)

In 1986 people were not convinced about Legend vs. Accord. In 2015 people are still not convinced about TLX vs. Accord. Accord wins, yay! LOL
Yes, because its mirrors look more expensive. Now if the TLX would have stuck with its concept mirrors it would have been game over........
Old 08-28-2015, 02:03 PM
  #11485  
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Another retro vid:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ha5MN96ApDw
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Old 08-30-2015, 01:37 AM
  #11486  
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Originally Posted by Black Tire
The features that car had in 1993 blow my mind. Wow. I didn't even know about some of that stuff and they don't even mention some of the other cool things the Legend had, like the power rear quarter windows (gangster!!) or trunk mounted 6 CD changer.
Old 08-30-2015, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by TacoBello
The features that car had in 1993 blow my mind. Wow. I didn't even know about some of that stuff and they don't even mention some of the other cool things the Legend had, like the power rear quarter windows (gangster!!) or trunk mounted 6 CD changer.
My 92 Integra had tons of thoughtful touches and a nicer interior than my 2003 and 2009 Civic. Acura was ballin in the early 90s!

On par or better than Lexus, Lexus came out with the RX and started taking over. Acura then killed the Integra and fell away from their roots.

Mazda is the new Honda IMO if they can keep up the nice designs.
Old 08-30-2015, 07:25 PM
  #11488  
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Originally Posted by oonowindoo
Remember when our parents used to say "Back in the days, the things used to be _________, it was much better"

I think we start sounding like our parents now.
Unless you now own an American car. In that case, "Back in the day, these things used to be so much worse."

Old 08-30-2015, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by SamDoe1
Unless you now own an American car. In that case, "Back in the day, these things used to be so much worse."

and Korean cars.
Old 09-04-2015, 08:06 AM
  #11490  
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And British cars
Old 09-04-2015, 09:19 AM
  #11491  
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Originally Posted by imj0257
And British cars
No, they are still terrible.
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Old 09-26-2015, 10:59 PM
  #11492  
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Honda Accord V6 > Acura TLX V6 SH-AWD

Red Carpet Athlete? It's that kind of thrill? Not exactly.


Acura TLX Reviews - Acura TLX Price, Photos, and Specs - Car and Driver

2015 Acura TLX V-6 SH-AWD

Sep 2015 | By MIKE SUTTON

The all-wheel-drive TLX is not as racy as Acura thinks it is.

Motorsport is the ultimate proving ground -- and marketing tool -- for performance cars, including those from BMW, Cadillac, and Porsche, to name a few. Honda’s luxury brand also fits into that group as it tries to polish its image with specially built Acura TLX racing sedans that compete with Nissan GT-Rs, Cadillac ATS-Vs, and Ferrari 458 Italias in the Pirelli World Challenge. Unlike the other makes mentioned in this paragraph, however, the all-wheel-drive Acura TLX road car hasn’t received much feedback from pit lane.

Untapped Potential

The new-for-2015 TLX sedan replaced both the larger TL and the smaller TSX in Acura’s lineup. In place of the competition car’s 500-plus-hp twin-turbocharged V-6, the versions you can buy get either a 2.4-liter four-cylinder or a naturally aspirated 3.5-liter V-6 with 290 horsepower and 267 lb-ft of torque. An eight-speed dual-clutch automatic comes with the 206-hp four-banger, but the 3.5 is mated solely to Honda’s new nine-speed automatic. We’ve previously tested front-wheel-drive versions of both the 2.4-liter four and the 3.5-liter V-6—but the six-cylinder is also available with Acura’s torque-vectoring Super Handling All-Wheel Drive.

SH-AWD is one element of the TLX road car that is actually more advanced than the racer, as the system is able to individually over-rotate the rear wheels to aid in pivoting around corners. We’re not sure about the “Super Handling” moniker, but the system works especially well for powering out of tight bends where the front-drive cars’ inherent understeer is most apparent. Weight distribution actually improves a bit in the SH-AWD version, with the additional 146 pounds situated mostly at the rear. But more than 60 percent of our test car’s 3763 pounds still rested on the front axle.

The TLX, though, will never be a sports sedan until Acura makes it available with proper performance tires. Instead, very unsporty Goodyear LS2 all-season tires sit at each corner, sized 225/50R-18. While their tall sidewalls contribute to the TLX’s compliant ride, the tires simply lack the grip to exploit the SH-AWD’s potential. The stability-control system also cannot be fully disabled, limiting adhesion on the skidpad to a meager 0.82 g as the SH-AWD system teetered between pushing understeer and power-on oversteer. Braking from 70 mph was similarly so-so at 174 feet. The Acura’s new chassis feels solid and competent, and the electric power steering is nicely weighted if short on feedback. But the TLX struggles to keep up with its driver even in moderately aggressive cornering.

Nine Is Too Many

The direct-injected SOHC V-6 is relatively hushed yet pulls strongly up to its 6800-rpm redline with a familiar Honda growl. The SH-AWD’s added weight cancels out its traction advantage, making it about as quick to 60 mph as the front-driver. That benchmark takes 5.8 seconds and the quarter-mile is dispatched in 14.2 at 100 mph—comparable to a BMW 328i, Hyundai Genesis V-6, and Lexus ES350. But the TLX is about a second slower than the more-powerful BMW 335i and Infiniti Q50.

A button on the console allows the driver to choose among four driving modes (Econ, Normal, Sport, and Sport+), which adjust the assist from the electric power steering, as well as the throttle sensitivity, transmission shift points, and the all-wheel-drive programming. We noticed little difference among the settings in the real world, except that the transmission’s programming is hyperaggressive in Sport and Sport+ modes, holding lower gears for too long.

But there are simply too many cogs to manage, and Honda’s nine-speed is often caught out, hunting for the correct ratio. It also upshifts automatically at redline regardless of drive mode and is a bit slow to react to the shift paddles. And we’re still not sold on Acura’s push-button gear selector in place of an actual shift lever.

Both TLX V-6s carry an EPA-city rating of 21 mpg, with the SH-AWD rated at 31 mpg on the highway versus the front-driver’s 34. A similar 3-mpg gap separated our observed figures: 27 mpg for the two-wheel-drive car to the SH-AWD’s 24.

Going Inside

The TLX lacks the aggressively bolstered sport seats you’d expect in a performance sedan, but overall comfort is good and gadgets and amenities are plentiful. The instrument panel’s small, pixilated information screen already looks dated, however, and Acura’s two-tiered center displays are busy, redundant, and distracting in use.

The TLX SH-AWD carries a $2200 premium over the front-drive V-6 model, with sticker prices starting at $42,495. The list of standard features is long and includes seven airbags, a power sunroof, dual-zone automatic climate control, heated front seats, keyless entry and start, navigation, AcuraLink connectivity, a premium ELS audio system, blind-spot and forward-collision warnings, and lane-keeping assist. Our range-topping Advance model cost $3225 more and added adaptive cruise control, front-seat ventilation, remote start, and more.

Within its luxury strata, the top-end TLX is comparable with other mid-size, all-wheel-drive entries such as the Buick Regal GS and the Lincoln MKZ. However, the less prestigious -- yet 10Best-worthy -- Honda Accord V-6 is still more enjoyable to drive..

And a few grand more than our example’s as-tested $45,720 will unlock an Audi S4, a true, all-weather sports sedan. While the TLX SH-AWD’s racing connection may appear legitimate on the starting grid, we’re still waiting for the transfer of performance to the real world.
Old 09-29-2015, 03:22 PM
  #11493  
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Cue the defenders who will immediately tell us how "crappy" of a mag Car and Driver is, and that they're testers know nothing and are a bunch of fools.
Old 09-29-2015, 03:41 PM
  #11494  
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Obviously Honda paid C&D for that review. Obviously.
Old 09-30-2015, 05:43 AM
  #11495  
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so SSFTSX is right all along...the TLX just needs some performance tires
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Old 09-30-2015, 09:45 AM
  #11496  
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I don't see any need to defend that car. The V6 TLX with the 9 Speed tranny is a bad combination of engine, transmission and nose-heavy driving dynamics.

But yes, if you're going to say those guys at Car & Driver know what they talking about, then you have to pay attention to this review, too.

Quotes:

"Overall, the TLX is a satisfying and overdue return to the engineering and dynamic greatness long associated with Honda’s luxury brand. "

"With clever engineering and right-size packaging, the fun-to-drive TLX just might signal a revival at Acura."


2015 Acura TLX 2.4L / 3.5L / 3.5L SH-AWD First Drive ? Review ? Car and Driver
Old 09-30-2015, 10:24 AM
  #11497  
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Originally Posted by Boulder TSX
I don't see any need to defend that car. The V6 TLX with the 9 Speed tranny is a bad combination of engine, transmission and nose-heavy driving dynamics.

But yes, if you're going to say those guys at Car & Driver know what they talking about, then you have to pay attention to this review, too.

Quotes:

"Overall, the TLX is a satisfying and overdue return to the engineering and dynamic greatness long associated with Honda’s luxury brand. "

"With clever engineering and right-size packaging, the fun-to-drive TLX just might signal a revival at Acura."


2015 Acura TLX 2.4L / 3.5L / 3.5L SH-AWD First Drive ? Review ? Car and Driver
What they're saying is that it's better than the 4G TL and 2G TSX...which doesn't take a whole lot.
Old 09-30-2015, 10:30 AM
  #11498  
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Originally Posted by SamDoe1
What they're saying is that it's better than the 4G TL and 2G TSX...which doesn't take a whole lot.
They said more than that. You apparently missed the quotes.

The main point is that if you're going to trust one review from Car & Driver, you need to believe another...and this one liked the 2.4 TLX -- quite a bit more than the V6 AWD model.

Last edited by Boulder TSX; 09-30-2015 at 10:33 AM.
Old 09-30-2015, 12:47 PM
  #11499  
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Originally Posted by Boulder TSX
They said more than that. You apparently missed the quotes.

The main point is that if you're going to trust one review from Car & Driver, you need to believe another...and this one liked the 2.4 TLX -- quite a bit more than the V6 AWD model.
And I would agree with him. The 4 cyl with the DCT is a better car than the V6 AWD.
Old 09-30-2015, 12:49 PM
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so basically a 4cyl honda accord then.
Old 09-30-2015, 01:02 PM
  #11501  
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Originally Posted by iforyou
so SSFTSX is right all along...the TLX just needs some performance tires
But:

However, the less prestigious -- yet 10Best-worthy -- Honda Accord V-6 is still more enjoyable to drive..
So what kind of tires does the Accord V6 come with? Unless they're summer extreme performance, an Accord is still more sporty.
Old 09-30-2015, 01:13 PM
  #11502  
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Originally Posted by Belzebutt
But:



So what kind of tires does the Accord V6 come with? Unless they're summer extreme performance, an Accord is still more sporty.
Well, just imagine how much more sporty it would be if it did have summer extreme performance tires!
Old 09-30-2015, 01:45 PM
  #11503  
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Originally Posted by justnspace
so basically a 4cyl honda accord then.

If making a car similar to an award-winning car is bad, then VW/Audi should stop it right now. Golf/GTI = Audi A3, Golf R = Audi S3. Toureg = Audi Q7 (identical platforms, transmissions and engines in most cases)

But there is a difference with the TLX...You can't get an Accord with the TLX's 8 speed DCT...and the TLX engine has more power. (No differences with the above Audis).
Old 09-30-2015, 02:45 PM
  #11504  
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Originally Posted by justnspace
so basically a 4cyl honda accord then.
The TLX is an Accord with a higher price tag. Thought that was already known.

Originally Posted by Boulder TSX
If making a car similar to an award-winning car is bad, then VW/Audi should stop it right now. Golf/GTI = Audi A3, Golf R = Audi S3. Toureg = Audi Q7 (identical platforms, transmissions and engines in most cases)

But there is a difference with the TLX...You can't get an Accord with the TLX's 8 speed DCT...and the TLX engine has more power. (No differences with the above Audis).
The TLX has more power, sure. But not enough to offset the higher weight so the speed is the same. The Accord is cheaper and has the vast majority of the same features available for a lot less money and better looks.
Old 09-30-2015, 06:19 PM
  #11505  
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Originally Posted by SamDoe1
The TLX is an Accord with a higher price tag. Thought that was already known.



The TLX has more power, sure. But not enough to offset the higher weight so the speed is the same. The Accord is cheaper and has the vast majority of the same features available for a lot less money and better looks.
And the same can be said of all the VWs listed above. Cheaper than the Audis, most of the same features and identical performance numbers. (Unlike the Acura/Honda modeles, the VWs actually have the exact same HP & torque as the equivalent Audis). It's a business model that works...and there are many doing it.

Last edited by Boulder TSX; 09-30-2015 at 06:23 PM.
Old 10-01-2015, 06:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Belzebutt
But:

So what kind of tires does the Accord V6 come with? Unless they're summer extreme performance, an Accord is still more sporty.
Michelin MXM4 on the Accord V6...versus Goodyear Eagle LS2 on the TLX AWD.


Not only that, the Accord has 235/45R18 tires, while the TLX has 225/50R18.

So basically the TLX uses less grippy tires that also has higher profile and narrower.....lol

Joke aside, seriously, not sure why Acura is not even offering a basic sport package or something...like the A-spec back in the 3G TL era. The performance figures of a 3G TL 6MT A-spec is MUCH better than a regular TL 6MT at that time.

Acura TL A-Spec - Short Take Road Test - Car Reviews - Car and Driver
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...a-tl-specs.pdf

Other than the lip kit and some badging, the A-spec had larger rims with summer tires (turanza's vs ES1000), along with stiffer suspension. Results?

Skidpad: 0.81g vs 0.9g
70-0mph: 189ft vs 174ft (note that regular TL 6MT already had brembo brakes)

Heck, there's a version of TL 6MT that has the Potenza RE030 summer tires, and it would pull 0.89g and stop from 70-0mph in 160ft as shown in the link below.

http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...-comparo-3.pdf

So really, I don't know what Acura is thinking here. They market the TLX with "it's that kind of thrill," suggesting its sporting intention. It has a decent engine and AWD system. But for whatever reason, they are using some very crappy tires.....and not even offering a summer tire package, like they used to do.
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Old 10-01-2015, 09:12 AM
  #11507  
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Originally Posted by iforyou
Michelin MXM4 on the Accord V6...versus Goodyear Eagle LS2 on the TLX AWD.


Not only that, the Accord has 235/45R18 tires, while the TLX has 225/50R18.

So basically the TLX uses less grippy tires that also has higher profile and narrower.....lol

Joke aside, seriously, not sure why Acura is not even offering a basic sport package or something...like the A-spec back in the 3G TL era. The performance figures of a 3G TL 6MT A-spec is MUCH better than a regular TL 6MT at that time.

Acura TL A-Spec - Short Take Road Test - Car Reviews - Car and Driver
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...a-tl-specs.pdf

Other than the lip kit and some badging, the A-spec had larger rims with summer tires (turanza's vs ES1000), along with stiffer suspension. Results?

Skidpad: 0.81g vs 0.9g
70-0mph: 189ft vs 174ft (note that regular TL 6MT already had brembo brakes)

Heck, there's a version of TL 6MT that has the Potenza RE030 summer tires, and it would pull 0.89g and stop from 70-0mph in 160ft as shown in the link below.

http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...-comparo-3.pdf

So really, I don't know what Acura is thinking here. They market the TLX with "it's that kind of thrill," suggesting its sporting intention. It has a decent engine and AWD system. But for whatever reason, they are using some very crappy tires.....and not even offering a summer tire package, like they used to do.
Agree completely...it doesn't make sense. Hopefully they will rectify that, along with the addition of some turbo D.I. engines within the next year.
Old 10-01-2015, 09:56 AM
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Heck, my 1G TSX came with Michelin MXM4. What the hell is Acura doing right now??
Old 10-01-2015, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Boulder TSX
And the same can be said of all the VWs listed above. Cheaper than the Audis, most of the same features and identical performance numbers. (Unlike the Acura/Honda modeles, the VWs actually have the exact same HP & torque as the equivalent Audis). It's a business model that works...and there are many doing it.
Is it working for Acura?
Old 10-01-2015, 10:18 AM
  #11510  
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Originally Posted by iforyou
Michelin MXM4 on the Accord V6...versus Goodyear Eagle LS2 on the TLX AWD.


Not only that, the Accord has 235/45R18 tires, while the TLX has 225/50R18.

So basically the TLX uses less grippy tires that also has higher profile and narrower.....lol

Joke aside, seriously, not sure why Acura is not even offering a basic sport package or something...like the A-spec back in the 3G TL era. The performance figures of a 3G TL 6MT A-spec is MUCH better than a regular TL 6MT at that time.

Acura TL A-Spec - Short Take Road Test - Car Reviews - Car and Driver
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...a-tl-specs.pdf

Other than the lip kit and some badging, the A-spec had larger rims with summer tires (turanza's vs ES1000), along with stiffer suspension. Results?

Skidpad: 0.81g vs 0.9g
70-0mph: 189ft vs 174ft (note that regular TL 6MT already had brembo brakes)

Heck, there's a version of TL 6MT that has the Potenza RE030 summer tires, and it would pull 0.89g and stop from 70-0mph in 160ft as shown in the link below.

http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...-comparo-3.pdf

So really, I don't know what Acura is thinking here. They market the TLX with "it's that kind of thrill," suggesting its sporting intention. It has a decent engine and AWD system. But for whatever reason, they are using some very crappy tires.....and not even offering a summer tire package, like they used to do.
I thought it has already been established long time ago. It is always about the tires. RE030? TLX probably could fly if you put some M-PSS
Old 10-01-2015, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by oonowindoo
Is it working for Acura?
As a business model, yes. To continue the comparison with Audi, Acura's sales numbers are very close to Audi's. (And that is with Audi breaking sales records over the past two years...Acura's sales are up over the past year, as well.)

That's not to say that Acura shouldn't work to make their sedans have better performance, to fit the image they initially created. They hit a dark period of design and performance from 2009-2013 or so. The designs have improved. --At least some of the performance is going to be addressed soon with turbo D.I. engines. (Like the one in the CivicR)

Last edited by Boulder TSX; 10-01-2015 at 10:56 AM.
Old 10-02-2015, 02:13 AM
  #11512  
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^^^^^

Audi vehicles carry a much higher price tag than equivalent Acura vehicles. Thus Acura is able to achieve more unit sales than the more "premium priced" Audi.

So it is a given than Acura SHOULD sell more vehicles than (not just close to) the more "premium priced" Audi brand, just like Honda is able to sell more "cheaper priced" vehicles than the Acura brand.

If all Acura vehicles were to slapped with the same "premium pricing" as the Audi brand, then it would be a goodbye to the Acura brand, as demonstrated by the extremely poor selling, premium-priced, RLX Acura flagship sedan.
Old 10-02-2015, 04:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Boulder TSX
Agree completely...it doesn't make sense. Hopefully they will rectify that, along with the addition of some turbo D.I. engines within the next year.
Ya...they had summer tires as an option before, it's pretty easy to implement.....that's the least they should do. A-spec, Type S should also be added. It's stupid when they call the TLX a sport sedan but then it pulls 0.82g.

Originally Posted by RPhilMan1
Heck, my 1G TSX came with Michelin MXM4. What the hell is Acura doing right now??
The only reasons I could think of is cost saving and/or noise reduction. To me, it's okay to use these Eagle LS2 tires as standard tires. But please, if you are marketing the car as a sport sedan, at least included a set of real performance tires as an option. Test results would look so much better. We have already seen that with the 3G TL, Civic Si, and 4G TL.

Originally Posted by oonowindoo
I thought it has already been established long time ago. It is always about the tires. RE030? TLX probably could fly if you put some M-PSS
Haha I don't think there was M-PSS back in the days of the 3G TL???

Originally Posted by Edward'TLS
^^^^^

Audi vehicles carry a much higher price tag than equivalent Acura vehicles. Thus Acura is able to achieve more unit sales than the more "premium priced" Audi.

So it is a given than Acura SHOULD sell more vehicles than (not just close to) the more "premium priced" Audi brand, just like Honda is able to sell more "cheaper priced" vehicles than the Acura brand.

If all Acura vehicles were to slapped with the same "premium pricing" as the Audi brand, then it would be a goodbye to the Acura brand, as demonstrated by the extremely poor selling, premium-priced, RLX Acura flagship sedan.
That's assuming Acura simply increases the pricing without adding anything else (materials, build quality, technologies, features, design, etc) though. If that's the case, of course sales would suffer a lot...lol
Old 10-02-2015, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Edward'TLS
^^^^^

Audi vehicles carry a much higher price tag than equivalent Acura vehicles. Thus Acura is able to achieve more unit sales than the more "premium priced" Audi.

So it is a given than Acura SHOULD sell more vehicles than (not just close to) the more "premium priced" Audi brand, just like Honda is able to sell more "cheaper priced" vehicles than the Acura brand.

If all Acura vehicles were to slapped with the same "premium pricing" as the Audi brand, then it would be a goodbye to the Acura brand, as demonstrated by the extremely poor selling, premium-priced, RLX Acura flagship sedan.
I understand your logic and it makes sense, but the numbers aren't as simple as that. Audi's bestselling vehicles (Q5 & A3) are not any more expensive than Acura's (MDX & RDX). In fact, they may be less expensive.

Your point comes into play with Audi's upper model range, which sells in lower numbers.

The amazing thing to me is that Audi has over twice as many models to sell as Acura...and one of Acura's is a non factor (RLX). And still, somehow Acura keeps up. Imagine if they somehow made the RLX (and ILX) compelling cars.

Last edited by Boulder TSX; 10-02-2015 at 10:23 AM.
Old 10-02-2015, 11:36 AM
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That is because Audi is not really competing with Acura. Their primary competitors are BMW and Mercedes,,, maybe to certain extend, Lexus.
Old 10-02-2015, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by oonowindoo
That is because Audi is not really competing with Acura. Their primary competitors are BMW and Mercedes,,, maybe to certain extend, Lexus.
Not sure how that pertains to their sales numbers being similar. Both have vehicles in the same luxury market and classes.

If that's is who Audi is competing with, BMW, Lexus and Mercedes are kicking Audi's tail in this country.

"Through May, Mercedes sold 107,344 vehicles, followed by BMW at 105,444 and Lexus at 103,056. Audi still keeps its distance with 56,925 cars sold thus far. Acura was fifth with sales of 54,518, followed by Cadillac with 52,976."
Old 10-02-2015, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Boulder TSX
Not sure how that pertains to their sales numbers being similar. Both have vehicles in the same luxury market and classes.

If that's is who Audi is competing with, BMW, Lexus and Mercedes are kicking Audi's tail in this country.

"Through May, Mercedes sold 107,344 vehicles, followed by BMW at 105,444 and Lexus at 103,056. Audi still keeps its distance with 56,925 cars sold thus far. Acura was fifth with sales of 54,518, followed by Cadillac with 52,976."
you just answered your own question.

Most of the buyers For Audi/BMW/Mercedes would only cross shop between those brands maybe some to Lexus and the few that cross shop between Acura and others will be turned off by German brands because they can get a much better equipped cars from Acura. (different subject)

So you have BMW and Mercedes eat most of the pie and what is leftover is Audi's and it has been that way for decades. They are selling based on prestige and technology. Value is not part of their equation.
One can argue Audi has just as much prestige and tech as the other two. probably. But maybe its close relationship (sharing) with VW has something to do with it? or Maybe Its historical perception is just not as good as other 2 or maybe because of its FWD layout? (all sounds familiar?) The bottom line is Audi has never been as successful as Merc and BMW in the US. They could offer amazing cars and everyone would drool over them but still not a lot of people would buy when they were given a choice.

Now Acura's market is different. While Lexus is clearly the leader, there are still enough left for Acura/Infiniti/and whatever other brand. They are competing in value, reliability and technology on a budget.

So by saying Acura has similar sales # as Audi can only tell you so much because their business models are completely different.

Use NBA as an example, some of the losing teams on the west coast can easily be in the playoff if they were on the East but because they are on the West (Much tougher market), their stats are just not as good.
But they are still much better than most of the East coast teams.

The Summarize: The last place in Tier 1 > First place in Tier 2 and that is not even Acura.

Last edited by oonowindoo; 10-02-2015 at 05:36 PM.
Old 10-02-2015, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by oonowindoo
you just answered your own question.

So by saying Acura has similar sales # as Audi can only tell you so much because their business models are completely different.
The business models may seem different, but ironically, Audi is the only German manufacturer to use something Lexus, Acura and Infiniti use: sharing platforms with mainstream sedans and economy cars for many of their bestselling vehicles.

VW Golf = A3 1.8, A3 2.0 FWD & Quattro models,
Golf R = S3
VW Tiguan =Q3
Toureg = Q7

Q1, A1, S1, TT are all VW platform based as well.

That's a business model Audi shares with Lexus & Acura, but not Mercedes and BMW.

If Audi is competing with BMW and Mercedes in this country, they are failing miserably, with roughly half the sales of each, and sales similar to Acura. Their sales will likely take another hit in the future, with the VAG diesel scandal.

Last edited by Boulder TSX; 10-02-2015 at 05:45 PM.
Old 10-02-2015, 05:47 PM
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which explains WHY they are failing in sales #s when compare to the other big 2.... but that does not mean they are not competing with them head to head.

Just because Acura has similar sales #s as a "failing" Audi, is not really saying all that much. But at least Audi could still sell 57K cars against its tough competitors.
Price up the current Acura line up to BMW/Merc's level and see what happens.

Oh yah i forgot they have already done that. look at RLX.
Old 10-02-2015, 05:52 PM
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Price up to match Mercedes and BMW? I'm not sure that argument works any more. BMW and Mercedes are getting a huge boost from cars starting at under $30K. --They are selling tons of CLAs, GLAs, 1-series, 2-series, X1's, etc. Those cars are the main reason for their dramatic increases in sales in the last few years.


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