Suspension question
08-16-2009, 10:10 AM
#1
Suspension question
I want to improve the handling and keep a decent ride. The drop is secondary.The stated drop for both the eibach and the aspec is one inche.That is as low as I want to go, no more . I would pair the eibach with a decent non-adjustable shock . The aspec we know is a complete kit. I would appreciate opinions on which would be the better way to go. Thank you
08-16-2009, 03:22 PM
#2
Team Owner
I vote for a-spec. It's balanced and will increase performance nicely with a minimal decrease in ride quality. As you know you have to sacrifice some ride quality to get better handling.
A couple other items that will improve handling without killing ride quality too much are a Type S front swaybar and a Progress rear swaybar.
A couple other items that will improve handling without killing ride quality too much are a Type S front swaybar and a Progress rear swaybar.
08-16-2009, 05:44 PM
#3
Burning Brakes
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Ottawa, Canaduh!
Age: 56
Posts: 1,107
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes
on
3 Posts
...and I would vote for the Eibach/KONI Yellows combo for pretty much the same reasons stated above by IHC. But with the exception that it gives slightly more drop which looks better IMO. Plus it's a progressive rate spring which maintains close to OEM ride in routine driving yet hunkers down and becomes stiffer the more it compresses. For me, the KONI Yellows with one turn from full soft is ideal for me. I really love the set up.
I don't think that you can really go wrong with either....
I don't think that you can really go wrong with either....
08-16-2009, 07:05 PM
#4
Are you saying that the aspec spring is not progressive and doesn't get stiffer the more it compresses like the eibach? If so, why was it designed like that? Interesting point you made.
...and I would vote for the Eibach/KONI Yellows combo for pretty much the same reasons stated above by IHC. But with the exception that it gives slightly more drop which looks better IMO. Plus it's a progressive rate spring which maintains close to OEM ride in routine driving yet hunkers down and becomes stiffer the more it compresses. For me, the KONI Yellows with one turn from full soft is ideal for me. I really love the set up.
I don't think that you can really go wrong with either....
I don't think that you can really go wrong with either....
08-17-2009, 09:24 AM
#6
Team Owner
Progressive rates are more of a compromise, better street manners with a firmer rate once you're set into a corner.
The reason I don't like them as much is they don't offer as crisp of turn-in and the car won't take a set as quickly. I'm speaking in general about progressives vs linear springs, haven't tried the ones in question. In the end it comes down to personal preference unless you plan on taking it to the track in which case I would go with a non-progressive spring.
08-17-2009, 05:47 PM
#7
So I believe what your saying is the aspec kit will give better ultimate handling than the eibachs right?
I agree that both will work fine.
Progressive rates are more of a compromise, better street manners with a firmer rate once you're set into a corner.
The reason I don't like them as much is they don't offer as crisp of turn-in and the car won't take a set as quickly. I'm speaking in general about progressives vs linear springs, haven't tried the ones in question. In the end it comes down to personal preference unless you plan on taking it to the track in which case I would go with a non-progressive spring.
Progressive rates are more of a compromise, better street manners with a firmer rate once you're set into a corner.
The reason I don't like them as much is they don't offer as crisp of turn-in and the car won't take a set as quickly. I'm speaking in general about progressives vs linear springs, haven't tried the ones in question. In the end it comes down to personal preference unless you plan on taking it to the track in which case I would go with a non-progressive spring.
Trending Topics
08-17-2009, 06:34 PM
#8
Team Owner
In theory, yes. I haven't personally run the Eibachs nor do I know the spring rate so it wouldn't be right so say for sure. I know that doens't help much but it's the only honest answer.
08-17-2009, 11:02 PM
#9
Cruisin'
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Monterrey, MX
Age: 39
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi everyone, this is my first post, I just got a 2007 TL with the underbody kit, deck lid, and I got separately the a-spec 18" wheels.
Now i'm interested in going for the suspension upgrade to the a-spec susp but I would like to know some statistical data if someone is able to share with us. If someone has tested it on a track I think Lap timings from before and after the susp upgrade will help a lot, even from another brand so we can compare final results. Also if the VSA system had more or less activity.
thank you.
Now i'm interested in going for the suspension upgrade to the a-spec susp but I would like to know some statistical data if someone is able to share with us. If someone has tested it on a track I think Lap timings from before and after the susp upgrade will help a lot, even from another brand so we can compare final results. Also if the VSA system had more or less activity.
thank you.
08-18-2009, 10:06 AM
#10
Team Owner
Hi everyone, this is my first post, I just got a 2007 TL with the underbody kit, deck lid, and I got separately the a-spec 18" wheels.
Now i'm interested in going for the suspension upgrade to the a-spec susp but I would like to know some statistical data if someone is able to share with us. If someone has tested it on a track I think Lap timings from before and after the susp upgrade will help a lot, even from another brand so we can compare final results. Also if the VSA system had more or less activity.
thank you.
Now i'm interested in going for the suspension upgrade to the a-spec susp but I would like to know some statistical data if someone is able to share with us. If someone has tested it on a track I think Lap timings from before and after the susp upgrade will help a lot, even from another brand so we can compare final results. Also if the VSA system had more or less activity.
thank you.
A-spec won't give you the least bodyroll or largest drop but it gets the job done nicely since it's balanced. Great for a DD.
08-18-2009, 05:30 PM
#11
Interesting. I shows that it doesn't take a ton of mods to greatly improve handling. I really wonder how alot of these slammed cars would do on the track. A 1&1/2 inche drop is enough to meet all needs: Did this Michael Benz have larger wheels/tires ?
I really wonder how alot of these slammed cars would do on the track. A 1&1/2 inche drop is enough to meet all needs: Did this Michael Benz have larger wheels/tires ? Michael Benz ran it for a season of auto-x in conjuction with a 22mm RSB and won the season with most points. The suspension was amazingly stock with just a-spec and RSB. If I remember right, in his class he was allowed many more mods if he chose to do so.
A-spec won't give you the least bodyroll or largest drop but it gets the job done nicely since it's balanced. Great for a DD.
A-spec won't give you the least bodyroll or largest drop but it gets the job done nicely since it's balanced. Great for a DD.
08-18-2009, 08:33 PM
#13
08-18-2009, 09:28 PM
#15
Team Owner
One reason I like a-spec so much is it retains most of the suspension travel. As we know, the suspension's primary purpose is to keep the tires in contact with the road. Secondary would be ride comfort. When you slam a TL and use up all of it's available travel, it can no longer comply over bumps and irregularities in the road, it just hits the bumpstops and the car skips over bumps.
A slammed TL will feel like it corners better because it has less bodyroll but take it to the track or especially on the street and push it to the limit and you'll be disappointed.....unless you have a perfectly smooth street.
Bodyroll in the TL is not the evil that most people make it out to be. Sure, less bodyroll is a good thing. But unlike many cars, the TL's suspension goes into negative camber as it rolls so the tires keep their flat contact patch with the road.
If you do a-spec and a 22-24mm RSB, you'll have an awesome handling car for the street with nearly stock like ride quality. Body roll will be greatly reduced but there will still be a little. If you want to take it a step further, go with the Type-S front sway bar and the Progress 24mm RSB.
I have a-spec springs, Koni yellows, H&R FSB and the Progress RSB and I think I may have been better off with the Type S FSB. I'm having to retune my suspension to get the understeer out. So far I've stiffened my a-spec rear springs about 33% and it's finally starting to balance out but ride quality is starting to go away a little.
08-18-2009, 09:30 PM
#16
Team Owner
I forgot, I believe Michael Benz was on a-spec rims, not sure of the size tire. I do know that he ran a full R- compound slick in some of the races. Try a search for his username and you'll see it. There are pics and videos of him in action. Don't be too alarmed by the bodyroll, keep in mind he was on slicks so street tires could never generate the g-forces to make it lean like that and he did get 1st overall that year.
08-18-2009, 09:53 PM
#17
Boy, you really have experimented. That's good. You wanna know what I think would be a really good setup. H&R Springs, Koni shocks, & H&R F&R Swaybars. With the right tires/wheel, I can't see how there would be any body roll left. I know alot of people will say naw tiens etc. I'm not a expert on suspension, but I just feel you couldn't do much better than this set-up and you would be glued to the road
My guess, the slammed TLs will do terrible on the track and on the street.
One reason I like a-spec so much is it retains most of the suspension travel. As we know, the suspension's primary purpose is to keep the tires in contact with the road. Secondary would be ride comfort. When you slam a TL and use up all of it's available travel, it can no longer comply over bumps and irregularities in the road, it just hits the bumpstops and the car skips over bumps.
A slammed TL will feel like it corners better because it has less bodyroll but take it to the track or especially on the street and push it to the limit and you'll be disappointed.....unless you have a perfectly smooth street.
Bodyroll in the TL is not the evil that most people make it out to be. Sure, less bodyroll is a good thing. But unlike many cars, the TL's suspension goes into negative camber as it rolls so the tires keep their flat contact patch with the road.
If you do a-spec and a 22-24mm RSB, you'll have an awesome handling car for the street with nearly stock like ride quality. Body roll will be greatly reduced but there will still be a little. If you want to take it a step further, go with the Type-S front sway bar and the Progress 24mm RSB.
I have a-spec springs, Koni yellows, H&R FSB and the Progress RSB and I think I may have been better off with the Type S FSB. I'm having to retune my suspension to get the understeer out. So far I've stiffened my a-spec rear springs about 33% and it's finally starting to balance out but ride quality is starting to go away a little.
One reason I like a-spec so much is it retains most of the suspension travel. As we know, the suspension's primary purpose is to keep the tires in contact with the road. Secondary would be ride comfort. When you slam a TL and use up all of it's available travel, it can no longer comply over bumps and irregularities in the road, it just hits the bumpstops and the car skips over bumps.
A slammed TL will feel like it corners better because it has less bodyroll but take it to the track or especially on the street and push it to the limit and you'll be disappointed.....unless you have a perfectly smooth street.
Bodyroll in the TL is not the evil that most people make it out to be. Sure, less bodyroll is a good thing. But unlike many cars, the TL's suspension goes into negative camber as it rolls so the tires keep their flat contact patch with the road.
If you do a-spec and a 22-24mm RSB, you'll have an awesome handling car for the street with nearly stock like ride quality. Body roll will be greatly reduced but there will still be a little. If you want to take it a step further, go with the Type-S front sway bar and the Progress 24mm RSB.
I have a-spec springs, Koni yellows, H&R FSB and the Progress RSB and I think I may have been better off with the Type S FSB. I'm having to retune my suspension to get the understeer out. So far I've stiffened my a-spec rear springs about 33% and it's finally starting to balance out but ride quality is starting to go away a little.
08-18-2009, 10:44 PM
#18
Team Owner
That might work well. Just don't go too low for the street or you will see negative effects at the limit.
The best suspension setup if you're looking at a no compromise track setup would be very stiff springs and using the swaybars for tuning only. Nothing larger than stock swaybars. The reason I've gone with the stiffer sways is I don't want to give up too much ride quality but there are definate performance drawbacks of large swaybars.
The best suspension setup if you're looking at a no compromise track setup would be very stiff springs and using the swaybars for tuning only. Nothing larger than stock swaybars. The reason I've gone with the stiffer sways is I don't want to give up too much ride quality but there are definate performance drawbacks of large swaybars.
08-19-2009, 06:29 AM
#19
The drop is a little over one inche. That's the sport springs. The race springs are like two inches. By the way how was your allignment specs after installing the aspec springs? Did you need a camber kit? My car's rear is near the negative camber limit at stock height.
08-19-2009, 09:31 AM
#21
Team Owner
I didn't know how much trouble it was going to be so I did it in front of the house in the street on my back. I started at 6PM and finished at 12AM. I had to drive it to work the next day so I couldn't quit. It wouldn't be that bad on a lift, I would guess it would take me a couple hours at most. You have to get an alignment afterwards.
Last edited by I hate cars; 08-19-2009 at 09:35 AM.
08-19-2009, 12:29 PM
#22
Was your rear camber out of spec after installing the aspec springs?
I didn't know how much trouble it was going to be so I did it in front of the house in the street on my back. I started at 6PM and finished at 12AM. I had to drive it to work the next day so I couldn't quit. It wouldn't be that bad on a lift, I would guess it would take me a couple hours at most. You have to get an alignment afterwards.
08-19-2009, 01:25 PM
#24
Team Owner
Front, yes. You're dropping the subframe and changing everything. One of the Acura techs said they loosen the subframe and move it around during an alignment.
08-19-2009, 05:22 PM
#27
Team Owner
That's how mine is. No problems yet, camber kit isn't required but I'm going to install one soon due to the ultra soft tires I'm running.
08-20-2009, 07:29 AM
#28
Don't you need one to prevent uneven tire wear? I'm not surprised it went out of spec. My rear cambers are close to -1.5 (limit) at stock height.
08-20-2009, 08:04 AM
#29
in most cases, a GOOD alignment is all you need to keep your tires in good shape. even if the camber is out of spec, a GOOD alignment will prevent premature tire wear n tear. usually a bad TOE spec is what will cause uneven tire wear. camber will have its effects on tire wear however those effects will be more long term depending on the treadwear rating of the tire.
08-20-2009, 08:52 AM
#30
Team Owner
in most cases, a GOOD alignment is all you need to keep your tires in good shape. even if the camber is out of spec, a GOOD alignment will prevent premature tire wear n tear. usually a bad TOE spec is what will cause uneven tire wear. camber will have its effects on tire wear however those effects will be more long term depending on the treadwear rating of the tire.
08-21-2009, 06:38 AM
#32
Gotcha,You know I realize now that when people say they didn't need a camber kit, what they mean is they could get away without one. They all probably were out of spec. I had a accord and now a TL and both were near the camber limits in the rear at stock height
in most cases, a GOOD alignment is all you need to keep your tires in good shape. even if the camber is out of spec, a GOOD alignment will prevent premature tire wear n tear. usually a bad TOE spec is what will cause uneven tire wear. camber will have its effects on tire wear however those effects will be more long term depending on the treadwear rating of the tire.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
BoricuaTL
Car Parts for Sale
138
04-08-2016 01:08 PM
