TL Diet 2.0/Track Car Build - Roll Cage Pg 51
04-21-2011, 07:51 PM
#204
Safety Car
I very much agree with the window net. There is no way I would be driving with my window down without a net. Rollovers are the most ugly collision scenario that a driver will ever experience.
Be sure that your racing harness is super tight against your body too. The harness loses most of it's effectiveness if even slightly lose. I nearly break my fingers trying to snap my buckles closed with my racing harness.
Here is a good read if you have not had a chance to read it yet. This thread discuses the dangers of rollovers and the accompanying body flail... arms and head being forced out of the window opening during a rollover.
Safety aspects of racing seats and racing harnesses in street cars (click here)
Be sure that your racing harness is super tight against your body too. The harness loses most of it's effectiveness if even slightly lose. I nearly break my fingers trying to snap my buckles closed with my racing harness.
Here is a good read if you have not had a chance to read it yet. This thread discuses the dangers of rollovers and the accompanying body flail... arms and head being forced out of the window opening during a rollover.
Safety aspects of racing seats and racing harnesses in street cars (click here)
04-21-2011, 08:21 PM
#205
I very much agree with the window net. There is no way I would be driving with my window down without a net. Rollovers are the most ugly collision scenario that a driver will ever experience.
Be sure that your racing harness is super tight against your body too. The harness loses most of it's effectiveness if even slightly lose. I nearly break my fingers trying to snap my buckles closed with my racing harness.
Here is a good read if you have not had a chance to read it yet. This thread discuses the dangers of rollovers and the accompanying body flail... arms and head being forced out of the window opening during a rollover.
Safety aspects of racing seats and racing harnesses in street cars (click here)
Be sure that your racing harness is super tight against your body too. The harness loses most of it's effectiveness if even slightly lose. I nearly break my fingers trying to snap my buckles closed with my racing harness.
Here is a good read if you have not had a chance to read it yet. This thread discuses the dangers of rollovers and the accompanying body flail... arms and head being forced out of the window opening during a rollover.
Safety aspects of racing seats and racing harnesses in street cars (click here)
04-22-2011, 06:11 PM
#207
Not sure if this'll work or not but a buddy shot this video from the media area at Autobahn. It was hella windy but this lap matches one in the youtube video and I figured I'd give it a shot for ya'll.
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/20227250/TL.MP4
Let me know if it doesn't work and I'll take it down.
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/20227250/TL.MP4
Let me know if it doesn't work and I'll take it down.
04-22-2011, 06:37 PM
#209
Team Owner
Any chance of removing the windows altogether?
I agree with not touching the radiator. The last thing you want is cooling issues and besides, if you ever add some serious power down the road you're covered.
While on the subject of radiators, any chance of adding a simple louver system to close off all grill openings at high speeds to help out with aerodynamics? You would still have the hood vent to let off pressure which is great since it's likely in a low pressure area. Maybe just the two lower ones or at least turn the lower openings into brake ducts but seal the ducts to the opening so all of the air has to go to the brakes. You could have all coolers (radiator, PS, and engine oil) in one area of the car, box everything in, including the area from the bumper to core support to where air HAS to flow through the radiator once it goes through the grill instead of around and under. You would be increasing cooling efficiency and aerodynamics at the same time.
The more I think of it, adding a lower front air dam like the factory one to where it nearly scrapes all the time should work wonders. It might be a valid alternative to the splitter which would be more easily damaged if it were "race" low.
I don't know what kind of speeds you see at your local tracks but we've seen improvements in aerodynamics, stability, and cooling as low as 60mph by controlling airflow through the front of the car.
On one car I used a switch that looks like a paddle that goes in the air flow. It's very light and all you need is a switch, actuator and some louvers. You can do the whole thing for 2.8lbs if I remember right. I thought about using a system based off of engine vacuum where it shuts the louvers under low vacuum and opens under high vacuum. It might work but I've never tested it. I was worried that an on/off system based on load instead of airspeed might upset things at very high speeds or stay closed too much of the time which becomes a cooling problem.
I agree with not touching the radiator. The last thing you want is cooling issues and besides, if you ever add some serious power down the road you're covered.
While on the subject of radiators, any chance of adding a simple louver system to close off all grill openings at high speeds to help out with aerodynamics? You would still have the hood vent to let off pressure which is great since it's likely in a low pressure area. Maybe just the two lower ones or at least turn the lower openings into brake ducts but seal the ducts to the opening so all of the air has to go to the brakes. You could have all coolers (radiator, PS, and engine oil) in one area of the car, box everything in, including the area from the bumper to core support to where air HAS to flow through the radiator once it goes through the grill instead of around and under. You would be increasing cooling efficiency and aerodynamics at the same time.
The more I think of it, adding a lower front air dam like the factory one to where it nearly scrapes all the time should work wonders. It might be a valid alternative to the splitter which would be more easily damaged if it were "race" low.
I don't know what kind of speeds you see at your local tracks but we've seen improvements in aerodynamics, stability, and cooling as low as 60mph by controlling airflow through the front of the car.
On one car I used a switch that looks like a paddle that goes in the air flow. It's very light and all you need is a switch, actuator and some louvers. You can do the whole thing for 2.8lbs if I remember right. I thought about using a system based off of engine vacuum where it shuts the louvers under low vacuum and opens under high vacuum. It might work but I've never tested it. I was worried that an on/off system based on load instead of airspeed might upset things at very high speeds or stay closed too much of the time which becomes a cooling problem.
04-22-2011, 06:58 PM
#210
Any chance of removing the windows altogether?
I agree with not touching the radiator. The last thing you want is cooling issues and besides, if you ever add some serious power down the road you're covered.
While on the subject of radiators, any chance of adding a simple louver system to close off all grill openings at high speeds to help out with aerodynamics? You would still have the hood vent to let off pressure which is great since it's likely in a low pressure area. Maybe just the two lower ones or at least turn the lower openings into brake ducts but seal the ducts to the opening so all of the air has to go to the brakes. You could have all coolers (radiator, PS, and engine oil) in one area of the car, box everything in, including the area from the bumper to core support to where air HAS to flow through the radiator once it goes through the grill instead of around and under. You would be increasing cooling efficiency and aerodynamics at the same time.
The more I think of it, adding a lower front air dam like the factory one to where it nearly scrapes all the time should work wonders. It might be a valid alternative to the splitter which would be more easily damaged if it were "race" low.
I don't know what kind of speeds you see at your local tracks but we've seen improvements in aerodynamics, stability, and cooling as low as 60mph by controlling airflow through the front of the car.
On one car I used a switch that looks like a paddle that goes in the air flow. It's very light and all you need is a switch, actuator and some louvers. You can do the whole thing for 2.8lbs if I remember right. I thought about using a system based off of engine vacuum where it shuts the louvers under low vacuum and opens under high vacuum. It might work but I've never tested it. I was worried that an on/off system based on load instead of airspeed might upset things at very high speeds or stay closed too much of the time which becomes a cooling problem.
I agree with not touching the radiator. The last thing you want is cooling issues and besides, if you ever add some serious power down the road you're covered.
While on the subject of radiators, any chance of adding a simple louver system to close off all grill openings at high speeds to help out with aerodynamics? You would still have the hood vent to let off pressure which is great since it's likely in a low pressure area. Maybe just the two lower ones or at least turn the lower openings into brake ducts but seal the ducts to the opening so all of the air has to go to the brakes. You could have all coolers (radiator, PS, and engine oil) in one area of the car, box everything in, including the area from the bumper to core support to where air HAS to flow through the radiator once it goes through the grill instead of around and under. You would be increasing cooling efficiency and aerodynamics at the same time.
The more I think of it, adding a lower front air dam like the factory one to where it nearly scrapes all the time should work wonders. It might be a valid alternative to the splitter which would be more easily damaged if it were "race" low.
I don't know what kind of speeds you see at your local tracks but we've seen improvements in aerodynamics, stability, and cooling as low as 60mph by controlling airflow through the front of the car.
On one car I used a switch that looks like a paddle that goes in the air flow. It's very light and all you need is a switch, actuator and some louvers. You can do the whole thing for 2.8lbs if I remember right. I thought about using a system based off of engine vacuum where it shuts the louvers under low vacuum and opens under high vacuum. It might work but I've never tested it. I was worried that an on/off system based on load instead of airspeed might upset things at very high speeds or stay closed too much of the time which becomes a cooling problem.
Well removing the windows would be nice if I had an enclosed trailer and had a good chance the weather would be nice but kinda hard to do that right now.
As for the aero thoughts, I was just looking at the front bumper today trying to draft a plan for the brake ducts I want to do and I think I could easily turn the two lower openings on the bumper into sole ducts for the brakes. I say this because the grill by the Acura logo and the little gap I have between my splitter and the bumper both would direct air right at the radiator so I really wouldn't be losing anything by doing that. This will be my next fiberglass adventure lol
As for a louvers, it's probably doable but I think the surface area I would be blocking off wouldn't really make a huge difference at most tracks I frequent. I mean, maybe at like Road Atlanta where the straight is hellishly long it would be useful but most other places I only get to the top of 4th gear and maybe just a titch of 5th before I brake again. On this subject though, I'm pretty sure the new Ford Focus has a system just like the one you describe, they are marketing it for economy I think, but same system.
04-22-2011, 08:51 PM
#213
Safety Car
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaakBiqzDK0
Beat you to it.... Done.
Woot !!!!!
Look at that TL Diet flying
The TL Diet... Woo Hoo, What a Ride !!!! :gheywave:
Last edited by Inaccurate; 04-22-2011 at 08:53 PM.
04-22-2011, 09:33 PM
#214
Three Wheelin'
vill0169, ever consider making some underbody panels?
I seen a very nice DIY, using cardboard, aluminum strips, reinforced with layers of fiberglass, resulting in strong yet lightweight panels:
http://www.iwsti.com/forums/gr-membe...ouple-s-7.html
I was real close to taking this project on myself along with a functional rear diffuser that would channel some air through the type-s rear bumpers' fake grill (planned on cutting it out). I wanted to do the entire underside.
What changed my mind was the cost and labor it would take me wasn't worth it since I don't even track the car..
I'm still curious to see how much difference in aerodynamics and handling it could make. If I had access to a lift I'd still probably wanna do it.
I seen a very nice DIY, using cardboard, aluminum strips, reinforced with layers of fiberglass, resulting in strong yet lightweight panels:
http://www.iwsti.com/forums/gr-membe...ouple-s-7.html
I was real close to taking this project on myself along with a functional rear diffuser that would channel some air through the type-s rear bumpers' fake grill (planned on cutting it out). I wanted to do the entire underside.
What changed my mind was the cost and labor it would take me wasn't worth it since I don't even track the car..
I'm still curious to see how much difference in aerodynamics and handling it could make. If I had access to a lift I'd still probably wanna do it.
Last edited by HQTL6SPD; 04-22-2011 at 09:38 PM.
04-23-2011, 06:48 AM
#216
vill0169, ever consider making some underbody panels?
I seen a very nice DIY, using cardboard, aluminum strips, reinforced with layers of fiberglass, resulting in strong yet lightweight panels:
http://www.iwsti.com/forums/gr-membe...ouple-s-7.html
I was real close to taking this project on myself along with a functional rear diffuser that would channel some air through the type-s rear bumpers' fake grill (planned on cutting it out). I wanted to do the entire underside.
What changed my mind was the cost and labor it would take me wasn't worth it since I don't even track the car..
I'm still curious to see how much difference in aerodynamics and handling it could make. If I had access to a lift I'd still probably wanna do it.
I seen a very nice DIY, using cardboard, aluminum strips, reinforced with layers of fiberglass, resulting in strong yet lightweight panels:
http://www.iwsti.com/forums/gr-membe...ouple-s-7.html
I was real close to taking this project on myself along with a functional rear diffuser that would channel some air through the type-s rear bumpers' fake grill (planned on cutting it out). I wanted to do the entire underside.
What changed my mind was the cost and labor it would take me wasn't worth it since I don't even track the car..
I'm still curious to see how much difference in aerodynamics and handling it could make. If I had access to a lift I'd still probably wanna do it.
A rear diffuser is definitely in the plans for the car. Probably nothing more than that though. The cost and my time for the diffuser alone would be pretty extensive and I just think an underbody panel like in the link would be somewhat of a headache after a while.
I couldn't believe how long it took me to make my splitter. I made that from the ground up and it probably took 2 to 3 times the time and material I thought it would to make it rigid and functional. It would be nice if I decided to run a short little exhaust that just dumped under the car somewhere because that would make fabing the rear diffuser a lot easier due to the absence of the big mufflers and everything.
Oh the thoughts that are always creeping into my head lol
thanks for the link!
04-23-2011, 09:33 AM
#217
A rear diffuser is definitely in the plans for the car. Probably nothing more than that though. The cost and my time for the diffuser alone would be pretty extensive and I just think an underbody panel like in the link would be somewhat of a headache after a while.
I couldn't believe how long it took me to make my splitter. I made that from the ground up and it probably took 2 to 3 times the time and material I thought it would to make it rigid and functional. It would be nice if I decided to run a short little exhaust that just dumped under the car somewhere because that would make fabing the rear diffuser a lot easier due to the absence of the big mufflers and everything.
Oh the thoughts that are always creeping into my head lol
thanks for the link!
I couldn't believe how long it took me to make my splitter. I made that from the ground up and it probably took 2 to 3 times the time and material I thought it would to make it rigid and functional. It would be nice if I decided to run a short little exhaust that just dumped under the car somewhere because that would make fabing the rear diffuser a lot easier due to the absence of the big mufflers and everything.
Oh the thoughts that are always creeping into my head lol
thanks for the link!
:
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Acura TL Builder (09-05-2022)
04-23-2011, 10:36 PM
#220
6spd FTW
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Probably set up to pull cool air through the wheels/brakes then down and out the back of the car through a pressure differential created at speed... Assuming they are for the brakes that is.
04-23-2011, 11:46 PM
#221
BUT what i think it is really for though, is for the necessary airflow to keep the rear diff cool, and not overheat (also look at the one slightly foward to let the necessary air in to keep it cool)
04-24-2011, 07:33 AM
#222
yes they help to "suck" the air out from the heat (especially any built up heat under there)
BUT what i think it is really for though, is for the necessary airflow to keep the rear diff cool, and not overheat (also look at the one slightly foward to let the necessary air in to keep it cool)
BUT what i think it is really for though, is for the necessary airflow to keep the rear diff cool, and not overheat (also look at the one slightly foward to let the necessary air in to keep it cool)
That's a good possibility as well. Luckily for me being FWD and having a dumped exhaust will make the fab for it a little bit easier. Not sure when I'll undertake this one but it'll definitely be a lengthy project to get right.
04-24-2011, 08:46 AM
#223
Three Wheelin'
Yup thats exactly what those ducts were for, to keep the diff cool. I read it on their thread somewhere.
It's definitly not a bad idea to incorperate a few ducts to pull heat from the engine bay such as so:
It's definitly not a bad idea to incorperate a few ducts to pull heat from the engine bay such as so:
Last edited by HQTL6SPD; 04-24-2011 at 08:52 AM.
04-24-2011, 10:46 AM
#224
umm....... by the looks of it, i think that may be a porsche, with a REAR engine, so the vent would kinda be on the wrong end
(but the radiator is still up there, and still would need to be vented though; but if you are going all out, it would probably be better to vent that sucker up, and out of the top through the bonnet/hood/trunk (whatever you want to call it)edit: that may actually be the panamara, so indeed front engine
04-25-2011, 01:33 PM
#226
WOW!!!!
JUST WEIGHED MY CATBACK AND IT WAS A MASSIVE 54 LBS!!!!
DEFINITELY GONNA MAKE A NEW RACE EXHAUST FOR THE CAR THAT WEIGHS A FRACTION OF THAT. WITH THAT OFF THE CAR AND A FEW NEW DIET ITEMS I WILL BE VERY VERY CLOSE TO 2700 LBS!!!
Just couldn't believe a resonator and two Magnaflows with tips would be that hefty. Certainly isn't necessary for me anymore to have a tamed down street exhaust.
JUST WEIGHED MY CATBACK AND IT WAS A MASSIVE 54 LBS!!!!
DEFINITELY GONNA MAKE A NEW RACE EXHAUST FOR THE CAR THAT WEIGHS A FRACTION OF THAT. WITH THAT OFF THE CAR AND A FEW NEW DIET ITEMS I WILL BE VERY VERY CLOSE TO 2700 LBS!!!
Just couldn't believe a resonator and two Magnaflows with tips would be that hefty. Certainly isn't necessary for me anymore to have a tamed down street exhaust.
04-25-2011, 02:46 PM
#227
Chapter Leader (Southern Region)
It's definitely going to sound like shit though
05-21-2011, 07:19 PM
#230
Thought I'd give ya'll a little progress update. I've just about finished the new exhaust for the car. Less than half the weight and after another hanger is welded up and turn down is put on it'll be done. I'll get some pics and maybe a vid up tomorrow but it sounds pretty good for the size and weight.
I also started my rear diffuser today. Still a long way to go but it should come along nicely in the coming weekends. I'll continue to post info and pics as I make progress on it.
Here's some stage 0 pics of masking and prepping for fiberglass
On a lighter note, the car officially has a name! lol I kinda got the idea from the new Acura commercials that say at the end, "aggression, in it's most elegant form". So I took that idea and spun it a bit and rather brilliantly (I think) tied it in with the Air Force/Aircraft theme I've already started... Let me know what you think!
Oh and if I seemed distracted in the coming months it's due to this thing. lol
I also started my rear diffuser today. Still a long way to go but it should come along nicely in the coming weekends. I'll continue to post info and pics as I make progress on it.
Here's some stage 0 pics of masking and prepping for fiberglass
On a lighter note, the car officially has a name! lol I kinda got the idea from the new Acura commercials that say at the end, "aggression, in it's most elegant form". So I took that idea and spun it a bit and rather brilliantly (I think) tied it in with the Air Force/Aircraft theme I've already started... Let me know what you think!
Oh and if I seemed distracted in the coming months it's due to this thing. lol
05-21-2011, 10:12 PM
#233
Chapter Leader (Southern Region)
Great update! Keep us posted.
05-22-2011, 06:52 AM
#234
Hey mods- you can edit a thread title right?
Kinda think at this point it would make sense to add "track car build" or something of the sort. Being the diet is pretty much done and I'm just building the car for track/race use now. Yes, no, maybe?
Kinda think at this point it would make sense to add "track car build" or something of the sort. Being the diet is pretty much done and I'm just building the car for track/race use now. Yes, no, maybe?
Looking forward to see the continued progress...
05-25-2011, 09:58 AM
#236
Right because I'm obviously doing this to a completely stock car and have no idea about these handling and performance mods you speak of.....
Not trying to be rude but we've been though this over and over again and I would appreciate it if you kept these sorta comments to yourself. You have no idea how rewarding it is to see the look on people's faces with this "4 door, FWD, V6 Luxury sedan is hunting them down on a track. Is there anything wrong with the usual M3's, Evo/STI'S, vette's, etc? No! But God its boring doing the same thing everyone else has already mastered. So why the hell not do this? At least that's my firm belief on this.
Not trying to be rude but we've been though this over and over again and I would appreciate it if you kept these sorta comments to yourself. You have no idea how rewarding it is to see the look on people's faces with this "4 door, FWD, V6 Luxury sedan is hunting them down on a track. Is there anything wrong with the usual M3's, Evo/STI'S, vette's, etc? No! But God its boring doing the same thing everyone else has already mastered. So why the hell not do this? At least that's my firm belief on this.
05-25-2011, 10:06 AM
#237
Chapter Leader (Southern Region)
05-25-2011, 10:22 AM
#238
was fine till my differential gave up. not from the turbo, but from this guy at one of the dealerships that decided to launch the car over and over. so the dealer's been fixing that.
I gota say, i really want to see this TL so i can get some pointers for some of this weight reduction and fabrication. Looks awesome man!
I gota say, i really want to see this TL so i can get some pointers for some of this weight reduction and fabrication. Looks awesome man!
05-25-2011, 10:36 AM
#240
i wasn't there so i couldn't really say anything, lol.
but all the turbo stuff was off for warranty work. the car NA was making 300 before the FI went on, so i'm sure he just felt the need to destroy some one else's property. Oh well, it's fixed now and rodney is putting my kit back together now. so i'm just waiting in the meantime. No big deal, i'm just chill, lol
but all the turbo stuff was off for warranty work. the car NA was making 300 before the FI went on, so i'm sure he just felt the need to destroy some one else's property. Oh well, it's fixed now and rodney is putting my kit back together now. so i'm just waiting in the meantime. No big deal, i'm just chill, lol